Windows 'Threshold Microsoft's plan to win over Windows 7 users

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Jul 2, 2014.

  1. ScoobyDooby

    ScoobyDooby Ancient Guru

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    "Microsoft is basically "done" with Windows 8.x. Regardless of how usable or functional it is or isn't, it has become Microsoft's Vista 2.0 — something from which Microsoft needs to distance itself, perception-wise. At this point, Microsoft is going full-steam-ahead toward Threshold and will do its best to differentiate that OS release from Windows 8."


    lollllll *palmface*
     
  2. ShadowMyth

    ShadowMyth Ancient Guru

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    It goes without saying I love PCs and am somewhat of a Microsoft fan-boy. I personally like Windows 8.1 and find little issue with it. With that said over the past 7 years; with a few exceptions; I really don't think Microsoft has been bold enough in just about anything they have done. In my eyes they are treading water in most of their larger areas of business. They are always a step behind. I think some fresh blood in the higher ranks might help.
     
  3. Reddoguk

    Reddoguk Ancient Guru

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    They want to catch up to Firefox and co.

    By 2020 we will be on Windows 20, just bangin em out, not even caring for the people who buy the OS's and defiantly not listening to what people want.
     
  4. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    Uh no.

    You said the trend started recently -- Microsoft has released a new OS every 2-3 years since 1985.

    Also they have a blog where they specifically show how people are using the operating system and how they are changing it to cater towards those people. Windows 7 was literally built entirely of features that people have been asking for.

    Lately Microsoft has noticed a trend in computing, in fact you may have as well. A huge amount of people are switching to mobile devices as their primary computing platform. Most of my friends, family, co-workers, they don't use laptops or desktops at home. They use iPads, Nexus's, Notes etc. Consumer feedback, particularly people like me, have complained that Windows have been slow to adopt to this emerging trend in computing. Windows 7 is essentially unusable on a touch screen device, not without pulling some hair out. And yet all my productive apps are locked to this platform.

    Microsoft heeded the call and developed this thing called the Start Screen. It's fantastic for someone like me. Using it on the desktop with a keyboard and mouse is simple enough. I want to open word? Hit Windows key then type Wo and press enter -- bam it's open. Want to keep some seldom used apps in a easy to reach place? You have 72 slots for it at the click of a mouse button. But even better, on my Surface, I get an actual, usable touch interface. It allows me to open native desktop applications easily enough, but it also provides me with Metro applications better fit for the form factor. It gave me easy, up to date information at a glance via live tiles. It also provided me with a number of on-the-go enhancements that allowed me to utilize my device to it's fullest capability.

    It was a win/win for me on both desktop and mobile. Microsoft had finally realized they need to actually innovate their interface to compete with this new computing paradigm. Then along came the "Power Users" -- completely devoid of the ability to recognize a problem that isn't in their realm of what "desktop computing" should be. They scrutinized Microsoft for following the wishes of these "mobile drones". How dare Microsoft cater to someone that isn't a gamer! Clearly all the underlining improvements in advanced timers, memory management and paging, driver stability via decoupling of major internal systems, explorer improvements, security improvements, boot speed improvements and even file transfer dialog box! -- CLEARLY ALL THESE NEW FEATURES THAT BENEFIT US were just some ruse to blind us from their true intention! To conform all desktop users into some putrid, vile, mobile world filled to the brim with people who ACTUALLY TOUCH THEIR DISPLAYS and LEAVE THEIR DESKS. How could Microsoft, the company who's CEO has talked about natural language and input for years possibly do this to us now! Clearly it's not the fact that mobile is the fastest trend in computing ever! Clearly it's not that the vast majority of users want it! Obviously it's the greed! The $$ they raked in from every single unwilling person who purchased this hideous rancid product.

    Wait what's that you blasphemous heathen? What did you ask me? What's wrong with Windows 8!?! Why clearly it's the removal of aero! Why shouldn't my interface be bloated with skeuomorphic properties that add absolutely nothing to the design of the application! Or how about the fact that the Start Screen fills my entire desktop! How am I supposed to navigate to the application I need now while following those instructions! And what about the keyboard and mouse! Why should I be forced to use the scroll wheel on the mouse to navigate my apps! I shouldn't need to know what app I'm selecting and simply type it into the search! That's so much work!

    /s

    It's really a joke. I migrated multiple users at work to Windows 8 and despite many of them being in their late 60's none of them had an issue adopting to the new interface. Most of them commented on how much faster the system was, probably do to a variety of factors (clean installs are always faster) but I'm going to put some of it on 8 just simply being better than 7.

    If you people want to sit here and pretend like Microsoft isn't listening to it's customers then by all means live in your blissful world of what you think computing should be. The rest of us "mainstream" people think it's in mobile. Hence why it's boomed past PC sales. It's what people want and Microsoft is giving it to them.

    No, I don't think Windows 8 is perfect, I don't think Metro or whatever they are calling it now is perfect. But I do think it has significantly improved Windows on mobile devices. I do think Microsoft is heading in the right direction. I don't think they are simply iterating OS's because they just want to "bang them out" if they did they wouldn't be doing 3 feature rich Updates to Windows 8.

    The whole discussion is a joke and it only exists in the minds of people who simply don't care what other people want.

    Sorry for the rant. It's late, it's raining and I have a massive headache. Sometimes I sit here and wonder why I type so much debate over something as meaningless as a piece of software.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2014

  5. ShadowMyth

    ShadowMyth Ancient Guru

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    Well for what it's work Denial, I quite enjoyed reading said rant :)
     
  6. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    Denial yeah ms released with that schedule until windows xp, then they had some weird long period there and suddenly people think "HOORY GOD WHY ARE THEY RELEASING NEW WINDOWS EVERY SO OFTEN!!!!" .

    Windows 8.1 works unless one is in complete denial. It is easy and intuitive.

    I do hope they aren't returning to w7 style with 9 tbh. But hey we will see next year.
     
  7. the_4ork

    the_4ork Master Guru

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    Why? Im perfectly content using windows 7, I loved it when it first game out and im still loving it. There is nothing in windows 8 to make me switch, and i doubt whaver the next version is has anything of importance either
     
  8. Valagard

    Valagard Guest

    "If you people want to sit here and pretend like Microsoft isn't listening to it's customers then by all means live in your blissful world of what you think computing should be."

    Ballmer his whole tenure at Microsoft was him sticking his fingers in his ears and going "LALALALA I'LL TELL YOU WHAT YOU WANT LALALALA!!", and if you didn't like it? Tough!

    Didn't like the Xbone with Kinect? Tough! You got it anyways!

    Didn't like Metro UI and wanted to turn it off and get back the start menu? Tough! You got it anyways!

    While I understand his reasoning of doing this, which was of course to make gobs and gobs of money, his way of going about it damaged his company incredibly.

    Users from DAY ONE told Microsoft they didn't like Metro UI on DESKTOPS, they didn't like it on LAPTOPS but they liked it on Tablets and Phones, but Ballmer thought "Well, if we make Windows 8 EXACTLY like tablet/phones, then people who use Windows 8 will be USED to the OS, and won't want to use another OS design for a tablet/phone, thus they'll buy one!"

    And while I agree, its a great OS on a tablet and phone (Baring space issues but I won't get into that) its absolutely horrid for desktop/laptop users, but he refused to listen, cause he thought his approach above would work.

    And you know what? Microsoft was WELL aware of this, they just thought they could hold out long enough to force the consumer to switch over, and when they finally didn't, they relented

    The kicker is they know the start menu is so god damn useful that not only does most of Microsoft's business ITSELF still use Windows 7 machines, like this article says, the update that was going to bring the start menu to windows 8.3 has been SCRAPPED because they're going to stick it into Windows 9/Threshold in order to sell THAT OS

    They took a bet and lost, Microsoft is well well well aware of what customers are saying, but lately they've gotten into the business of plugging their ears and pretending not to hear them
     
  9. fusion

    fusion Active Member

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    Lol windows 7 users, still using a renamed vista thinking they're ace. What I don't get is why people are crying over window 8.x when they know that windows 9 will be a just be the same deal just rebranded. Windows 8.x is more secure then 7, its better integrated with all of Microsoft new apps as well.

    Windows 7 may have sold better but that in no way means its better than 8. I just don't understand peoples rationale here, or lack of it. If you don't want windows 8 then why oh why are you waiting or demanding windows 9 for? YOU MAKE NO SENSE!!! You have windows 8.1 now and it is made of the same tech windows 9 will be made of. Do you really think that there will be some sudden influx of magic tech in the last 6 months of making windows 9 that's going to put it leaps and bounds ahead of 8? REALLY???
     
  10. Evildead666

    Evildead666 Maha Guru

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    I fully agree with what you're saying Valagard.

    I use Android on my Tablet and Phone, and I don't want touch interface on my desktop PC.
    At work, I have just had the first Win8 tablet/laptop hybrid brought back to me, because the client doesn't want it. He's had it less than a week.
    The HP SPectre x2 is also a really heavy hybrid, which doesn't help.

    The biggest gripe about Win8, is why the hell did they move so much around ?
    I haven't found "close session" yet, its not in the shutdown menu, where it always was.
    Drop down into the installed programs screen, and No Outlook, even though its installed, no Office whatsoever in fact. very very useful. our clients aren't used to using the "search" box to find all their software.

    Microsoft is going to end up killing their corporate cash cow, by themselves.

    @Fusion : Chewbacca lives on Endor with Ewoks. That does not make sense. It does not make sense ! :)
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2014

  11. Fender178

    Fender178 Ancient Guru

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    Um Windows 9 might look different than Windows 8.1 and also MS might do a complete overhaul you never know. Also not all Windows 7 users are waiting for Windows 9 especially business users and some power users. So that statement makes no sense and is a stereotypical statement.
     
  12. Neo Cyrus

    Neo Cyrus Ancient Guru

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    If it's anything like Windows 8.x I'm not interested. 8.x still seems like a sick joke and I cringe every time I use my laptop which has it, it's as if it was designed to be annoying as possible. "You'll get used to it" they said, no, I never got used to it.
     
  13. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    I just don't see the logic in this. I mean yes I agree that Microsoft probably should have provided an option for people who like the start menu to use it. But the entire industry is moving towards touch oriented devices. Look at Gnome/KDE/Unity/Cinnamon/iOS/Android every single major desktop environment are all being redesigned to be used across a wide variety of devices.

    Matias Duarte went on a like a 20 minute speech about how he foresees Android and his newly created Material Design as an approach to be taken across a wide range of screens. From TV, to PC/Laptop, to Phones, to Watches.

    This is the way design is going. Microsoft followed suit not directly because they wanted "globs of money" but because if they didn't they would be the only major OS that didn't follow that trend.

    Blackberry is an example of a company who didn't follow the trend. At the start no one cared. Now, in hindsight, people are saying "Blackberry should have innovated" "Blackberry should have switched over to modern design principles". Well it's too late for them now. The ship has sailed and they missed the boat. Microsoft has thus far avoided this by changing their design principle and moved towards a unified approach.

    Obviously there is a very vocal minority of users who will complain about this approach and hate it. But I still think they are making the correct choices. The vast majority of people that I know that use Windows 8 love it. They don't have issues with the Start Screen, most don't even seem to care. The only place I hear people bicker is on enthusiast forums. And their complaints are often not followed up by any real argument.

    You can 't just say "I hate this UI because it was designed for touchscreens!" Like why do you hate it? Is there a particular workflow that was impeded by the redesign? Did it cause an unreasonable amount of extra work to complete that task? What was the time before what was the time after? Is there a new or alternative workflow that could help you complete that task even quicker?

    So many people love to **** on it yet I still haven't seen any single particular problem fleshed out. It always just turns into "I hate it because it's different".

    This is a perfect example of what I'm talking about. There is nothing here. "I don't like it because it's a sick joke that was designed to be as annoying as possible". Like what does that even mean? Why is it annoying? Why is it a joke? Why is it worse on your laptop? Do you find that navigating the interface is more difficult on a touchpad because it requires more movement now that the start takes up the full screen? How often are you diving deep within the application hierarchy that this becomes a problem? Have you tried using the search function more often to complete the tasks you are attempting? Can you think of ways that may keep the same touch-oriented functionality that the Start Screen provides while maintaining the ease of flow on a touchpad? Would a touch screen on said laptop provide a viable alternative to this issue? Would display built into the touch pad that started when you hit start be a unique solution to solving this problem while providing the benefits to a tablet device?

    But no, nothing, devoid of thought and reason. It sucks because it sucks and there is no way to fix it. It provides nothing for me and thus I don't want it.

    And the thing that drives me insane is that Microsoft is clearly listening and iterating it's design with each update. Like ok the initial problem was that Windows sucked on touchscreen devices. Microsoft fixed this problem with Windows 8. But in the process of that they kind of hampered the interface with traditional desktop and laptop users. So with each update they slowly started progressing through and fixing the problems that users had.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2014
  14. Clouseau

    Clouseau Ancient Guru

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    Microsoft has been changing the interface that 8 brought because no choice was given. That and that alone has been the main ongoing complaint. Windows 98 and forward provided a choice to go full on with the new interface changes or stick with the "classic" look. I originally thought Microsoft was pulling a Coca-Cola move just to get Classic branded on their product. That was not the case. This is the first time since Windows 95 that no choice was given. The market is not the same as it was back then; not as forgiving. The need to adapt an offering closer to what was and is being communicated from their user base had to happen.

    The desktop market is becoming a niche market. Like stated so many times before the mass market has evolved to mobile. Microsoft is going to align themselves with the ongoing mobile side before ironing out the quirks for any niche. There is nothing wrong with this approach. Windows 8 was for the mass market and 9, or what ever it will be labeled, is going to address the business side to keep that market in the fold. The unified vision they have will take time, as found out and cannot be done cold turkey without alienating market segments. This is why 9 will be looking at the immediate environment it will be operating in and setting up by default the UI it thinks will be more to the users liking. Like 7 was Vista the way it should have been. 9 will be 8 the way it should have been. Choice is not always the correct item to remove.
     
    Last edited: Jul 3, 2014
  15. ManofGod

    ManofGod Ancient Guru

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    Personally, I find Windows 8.1 to be much better than Windows 7. However, for what you use the machine for, I would not mess with it either. Mission critical stuff should not be upgraded unless you know for sure that it will work.

    However, I do not see that as a plus for Windows 7 as much as a plus for long term stability. (Patches and updates have made everything work much better over the years.) Also, the drivers and updates will be better on a 5 year old OS compared to something that has not even been out for 2 years yet.
     

  16. ManofGod

    ManofGod Ancient Guru

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    Rigghhhhtttt..... The first paragraph, I was sort of with you. Then you continued on and showed the world your true colors as a illogical Microsoft hater. :bang::puke2:

    Oh well, enjoy your time with Ubuntu, don't let the door hit you in the butt.:wanker:
     
  17. ManofGod

    ManofGod Ancient Guru

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    Something is wrong with that statement though. The Surface Pro 3 is billed as a laptop replacement so, what good would an $800 started price device be without a desktop? Perhaps they are speaking of the $100 tablets only?
     
  18. -Tj-

    -Tj- Ancient Guru

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    I really like win8.1, its perfect now the way it is, metro type of system is great as well.

    Use to be a diehard win7 user and the first time I saw win8 I was like wdf is this crap, no way..
    But then after 2-4 weeks of usage it was just great, now with win8.1 proper start button its a true win.

    Imo it would be stupid to kill this type in next release, although I saw that "leaker" said it will feature both styles, so I guess all isn't lost yet.
    Also it might be free update for both win7 & win 8.1 users? fine by me :D
     
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2014
  19. Evildead666

    Evildead666 Maha Guru

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    Illogical ? Cheers for the "Wanker" :wanker: Emoticon. Maybe when you get older you'll understand other peoples opinions and usages can differ from your own.

    I work in the IT dept of our company, and have to deal with lots of peoples problems.
    One I don't need, is for people being given Win8 laptops and Tablets, when they have no clue how to use them. You obviously don't understand what that can do to a company...
    Something like a huge amount of lost time and work, no-one in the tech support team knows how to find the regular workarounds and processes we have set up, because Microsoft, in their great wisdom, changed the place and functionality of much of Windows 8 compared to previous versions of Windows.

    I'm very pissed at Microsoft because they've just made my job a f**kload harder, is going to cost the company a lot of money in getting people up to scratch with Win8, including me, and that isn't cheap.
    Do you know how much it costs for a course on using and repairing Win8 ?
    Try that for a few thousand people. Get it yet ?

    We don't all spend our time just "using" the OS, some of us have to go a little bit further.

    Microsoft is doing this to themselves. I'm not the only Tech that is bitching about Win8, most of us are, because of the crap its causing in businesses.
    Our F-ing network routers had to have their software updated to allow Win8.1 users to acces the Wifi !!

    Not being a US company, or in the US, we should have jumped from XP to Linux. Because of the decideing powers not understanding the security implications etc, they went Microsoft 100%, when we were 90% ready to go to Linux.

    I never said I was going to use Ubuntu, just that I installed it for people who couldn't afford a new PC and a new OS. It does what they need.
    I'm not entirely decided which version i'd like to install, but i'll be checking out a few of them.

    Are you an illogical Microsoft User ? :bang:
     
  20. djseltus

    djseltus Member

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    win8 is a beta of win 8.1 and win 8.1 is a beta of next version and.....
     

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