Windows 11 won't update after installation with unsupported CPUs

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Aug 30, 2021.

  1. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    It's a little funny when you think about it:
    Windows 10 was a nice overall evolution to Windows 7 and 8.1, yet people even today still vehemently refuse to upgrade.
    Windows 11 overall doesn't seem to have many noteworthy improvements at all, yet people are upset that they can't upgrade.

    Reminds me of cats that scratch at a door so you can let them through, but then you open it and they just walk the other direction. They don't really want to go through, they just want the option to do so.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2021
  2. Mineria

    Mineria Ancient Guru

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    Security updates might make it even more unstable if parts of them rely on TPM or instructions that aren't supported by older CPU's.
    It's not like that MS forces anyone to upgrade to Windows 11, they keep Windows 10 alive for some years and even add some of the features to it that where announced as Windows 11 exclusive.

    Both yes and no, Auto HDR which makes even HDR work seamless (really loving that feature, should have been there ages ago tbh.) and Direct Storage, besides a few other things that I personally don't care much about, other do want them Android apps and stuff though.
    Although, Windows 10 will get both Auto HDR and Direct Storage, the latter with some limits though that gamers and average users should be fine with.

    The settings menu also got some improvements that make it more logical, less diving into sub settings, although some could still be improved, think they should also put an split screen option button for HDR on one side and SDR on the other side in there instead of just posting a registry key on a blog.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2021
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  3. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    @Mineria Whoops meant to say "many" not "any". I seem to be making a lot of typos this morning...
     
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  4. Mineria

    Mineria Ancient Guru

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    Murphy's law :D
     
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  5. alanm

    alanm Ancient Guru

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    Apparently the HW requirements for 11 do not just have to do with security, but stability too:

    For example, PCs that meet the Windows 11 hardware requirements had a “99.8 percent crash-free experience” during Insider testing, while those that did not experienced 52 percent more kernel crashes, 17 percent more app hangs, and 43 percent more crashes for Microsoft’s bundled apps than did compliant PCs...

    https://www.thurrott.com/windows/wi...are-requirements-but-will-placate-enthusiasts
     
  6. Embra

    Embra Maha Guru

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    ^^ Ouch!
     
  7. Fediuld

    Fediuld Master Guru

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    Yeah I agree with you when comes to change. Everyone wants something "modern" yet they cry. I still remember people cursing vista because the icons look too "glassy"!!!! Revering to XP.

    You know what are most annoying things are?
    a) Most people do not realize that on rolling distros like Manjaro/Arch you have access to 90% of the software available through the package manager, all in a single place. No need to browse through dozens of websites to download everything and try to make sure they are updated. And the package manager updates them automatically!!!!

    b) Many send new users to Ubuntu :eek: a distro that gives bad name to Linux as it feels we are back 15 years ago. (which is why I hate it)
    Haven't used terminal on the Manjaro since forever. At least 3 years now and I am tinkering the system constantly, because I can :D

    c) People beg for MS to add their CPU in Windows 11. While others are on Intel vs AMD flame war at several places why Zen1 isn't supported, but at same time the Intel 7000 (Z270) and 6000 (Z170 & X99) or earlier CPUs aren't supported either.
    And they behave like the world will come to an end if W11 is out and they cannot upgrade!

    d) My mates have seen both the desktop and laptop with the widgets etc, they all find it impressive how nice and modern both Gnome and KDE look (themed) yet they are afraid to try them when gave them access to the systems. Somehow they "forgot" how to open the damn firefox on the taskbar, just because the taskbar is on the side, they look lost :D
    And the only thing they do with the computers is browse the internet, discord, blender and play World of Tank!! Nothing else!

    Using Manjaro + Gnome on PC, Kubuntu on the laptop until I reprogram the bios chip to unlock the secure boot crap (only allows ubuntu to work), and ofc unlock the bios to add 3200Mhz RAM support.
     
  8. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    A. Depends on what you're looking for, but yeah (especially once you get the AUR involved). It's funny because the Linux approach is faster and easier, but the concept is foreign to a lot of people so they don't know. Mac OS has this weird middle-ground, where you can do things the Windows way (which is technically wrong) but it works anyway.
    B. I'm one of such people (though, I would typically recommend Mint to new users). I haven't used Manjaro but really, Arch (or any of its derivatives) or any rolling-release distro is not a good idea for beginners. I can't speak for any differences in Manjaro, but Arch generally doesn't spoonfeed you; it doesn't make a lot of assumptions and it doesn't try to follow any industry standards. This makes things hard for beginners. Rolling releases aren't a good idea for beginners either, because there's no LTS and downgrading broken packages is not something a noob should be doing; it's not necessarily hard but it's not obvious either.
    Once you get enough familiarity, Arch and its derivatives are a great choice, at least for desktop users.
    D. I know the feeling. This goes back to what I said about familiarity. While you don't want "uncanny valley" levels of familiarity, you don't want something so foreign that you don't know what to make of it. It sure is difficult finding a middle ground.
    ...reprogram? Your BIOS doesn't have an option to just simply toggle secure boot off? Not sure I've ever encountered a device where it's forced-on.
     
  9. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    Lying with statistics.

    52% more of 0.2% is 0.3%.
     
  10. Fediuld

    Fediuld Master Guru

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    If I turn it off doesn't recognize that OS is installed. Even if it can see the USB drive which is installing without error the distro
    If is ON then again complains and doesn't boot
    However Acer allows to add GRUB to the secure list, it boots then fails over as fails to mount the drive.

    Spent hours.
    Contrary Ubuntu was installed regardless if Secure Boot was on or off (tried it both times) because Canonical has paid the licence to use Secure Boot.
    That is why I am against all these secure boot and several new settings coming with Windows 11. It won't take but 1 bios update to lock your system and not been free again. Especially if MS goes down the subscription model for the windows 11 as did with the Office and they will.
     

  11. nosirrahx

    nosirrahx Master Guru

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    Using the truth to imply lies is kind of how everything works.
     
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  12. 0blivious

    0blivious Ancient Guru

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    I may update our two compatible laptops but the two qualifying gaming PCs in the house will possibly wait. At least mine will. My son can choose his own adventure.

    I was a little surprised at how new the CPU needs to be. I hadn't been paying that much attention to the requirements.

    List of compatible Intel CPUs
    List of compatible AMD CPUs
     
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  13. Zooke

    Zooke Master Guru

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    In this example, the absolute (real) % increase is 0.1%, but that figure wouldn't raise an eyebrow anywhere hence the use of the relative 52%.
    Welcome to the 2020's.
    It's what we do now, use the eye-popping relative % instead of the absolute % in order to make figures seem more shocking.
    It's misleading at best, some would say it's downright deceptive.

    Another favourite statistics deception is the use of log scale graphs instead of the normal linear scale graphs that we all learnt at school, most people will have been presented with these without realising the difference and that they are being deliberately misled.
    The basic rule of thumb here is that if the graph is attempting to influence you in any way, and it has the words 'log scale' written on it, then chances are it's a deliberate attempt to fool you.
     
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  14. Airbud

    Airbud Master Guru

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    Yep^....I prefer to call it "Lying by omission" but yea.....
     
  15. Rich_Guy

    Rich_Guy Ancient Guru

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    I read somewhere, that you will still get the security updates on the patch Tuesdays, its only the feature updates you wont get, 22H1 etc....
     

  16. DannyD

    DannyD Ancient Guru

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    I'm good to go for the update but not gonna bother cause why?
     
  17. alanm

    alanm Ancient Guru

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    FOMO syndrome too pervasive. Some succumb to it, but others are patient. Some feel like ants crawling up their crotch if they dont get it on day 1. Rational, relaxed ppl tend to yawn at the arrival of a new OS or consider it something to toy with rather than need to commit to on day 1. Nothing wrong with interest in a new OS, just the burning need to commit to on day 1 is the funny bit. :D
     
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  18. DannyD

    DannyD Ancient Guru

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    Maybe buy a key for £3 at some point but till then ..:D
     
  19. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

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    Not even all the "new" processors are supported.... MS still hasn't added the Ryzen 3 3300X to the list and it's more than a year old. Even if you stick to processors that meet the requirements, there's no guarantee of support.
     
  20. Valken

    Valken Ancient Guru

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    My CPU is not even on the list so EFF that! LOL! Linux here I come!
     

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