Why so many Americans today are 'mentally ill'

Discussion in 'The Guru's Pub' started by JACK4HIRE, Aug 15, 2007.

  1. JACK4HIRE

    JACK4HIRE Ancient Guru

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    http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=57143

    I know some of those here liken news stories from World Net Daily to what's reported on Ripley's Believe it or Not however I found this an interesting read (though long) and I was wondering if anyone else had the wherewithal to read it in it's entirety and then offer an [intelligent] opinion.

    -Jack
     
  2. GhostXL

    GhostXL Ancient Guru

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    I've read the article. What i can say about this is...

    The media only reflects on bad things hardly any good...

    Mental illness is an excuse for being poorly raised.

    If you cant raise a child properly control your hormones.

    If you have ANY addictions or problems that may rub off onto a child in ANY manor...dont even think about having one...simple really.

    RESOLVE your problems then have a kid...

    You may think you have every right to have a child and you arent hurting them. Sure on the outside they look ok...think about what they are feeling on the inside...hurtin like a mofo...

    The environment in which a child is raised does effect them. A child is monkey see monkey do, unless taught and raised to know better.

    Too bad not many people are smart enough to think about that.
     
  3. nm+

    nm+ Don Cappuccino Staff Member

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    While I believe that psych meds ae massively over-prescribed, I don't believe it has anything to do with our "relationship with God" or anything like that.
    This sounds more like Christian Science applied to psychatry perhaps mixed witha little Scientology. Granted, I'm an agnostic, so I may be a bit biased, however, if it were a troubled relationship with god or some such thing, I'd think athest/agnostics/whatevers woulkd have more issues, which i haven't seen any stats of.
    Also the link between violence and drugs. Certainly there are interactions, but isn't in probable that in many of those cases they got the drugs because of the condition that caused the murder? Its like saying guns cause murders because a higher percentage of people who commit murders own/possess guns than the population at large.
    Further, this uses some weird logic. ADD/ADHD didn't exist before 1980? No. The diagnosis didn't exist. It does exist (though likely in lesser numbers). its like saying cancer didn't exist before the first time it was diagnosed. Rather medicine has developed an diagnosed new deseases. This is how the field works.
    Yes, I agree that psych meds have been used as a subsitute for good psychatry in some cases, but not really with anything else.
     
  4. Jason9875

    Jason9875 Master Guru

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    So to have morals, and know good and evil I must believe in a deity. k.

    Any proof or some such to back up this claim? I didn't see any related links inside the writing, or a section with sources. Odd, as this is something that is a rather big assumption.

    I haven't noticed a correlation between a person's relationship with deities and their mental health. I would consider myself rather healthy as I have no urges to kill or cause violence, and yet I know those far more spiritual that have depression and other such symptoms.

    And surprisingly, so can chemical makeup. To dismiss that just because environment is another factor is rather silly. At least that's what your post sounded like you were doing.
     

  5. Googie

    Googie Master Guru

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    OOOOOOOOOOOOOOh this is gonna get outta hand lol
     
  6. Classic Satch

    Classic Satch Banned

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    How do you figure? I don't this getting ridiculous at all. I admit that gun's thread title had me ready for battle but when I figured out who posted it and where he was coming from:

    http://www.acmewebpages.com/midi/alliswell.wav
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2007
  7. GhostXL

    GhostXL Ancient Guru

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    Exactly why i said what i did. Chemical make up. If your a drug addict etc, or have health issues you really should not be having children. Who knows what could happen to them at ANY point in life. its almost selfish in a way to have kids when you know you shouldnt.

    But w/o those reasons the environment in which someone is raised does effect their mentality. They see someone scarfin down on Mc D's every night at a young age..chances are they will too. Then they will say they are mentally ill in some manner because of how they were raised and being taught to believe its okay to way 400lbs.
     
  8. JACK4HIRE

    JACK4HIRE Ancient Guru

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    I must admit that even I found the latter half of the article a little sappy even for my faith.

    I was mostly hoping to get other peoples ideas on the effects of psychotropic and anti-psychotic drugs being handed out basically like candy by medical professionals.

    I for one was labeled "hyperactive" when I was a child. This was before they knew of the term ADHD. The wanted to give me Ritalin but my parents would not allow it. I instead received 'extra attention' from my parents/ teachers and was allowed additional physical recreation time in school. Problem solved.

    ADD and ADHD to me are nothing more than being a – N.O.R.M.A.L. B.O.Y. of any age before 16. LOL

    I find it strange that ADHD and ADD are almost unheard of in European Countries or so I've read. I wonder why? Is it that there is some environmental cause or is it that Europeans are not so quick to label a child defective?

    Me? I think some parents and teachers just don't want to deal with a normal and active child. It is much easier to deal with a child who is medicated at least in the short term. I was hell on wheels when I was a young man and now I have a son so I know.

    If I had been my parents I would have killed me. Thankfully though they came from a different generation that didn't medicate problems so they could be ignored - they dealt with them directly.
     
  9. Corrupt^

    Corrupt^ Ancient Guru

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    ADHD and Autism are slowly becoming more and more popular around here. Even I am labeled as autistic. However I have always strongly stated to several psychiatrics and psychologists that I refuse to take any meds.

    The side effects are bloody annoying or even dangerous + they don't solve your problem, they reduce the symptoms but it does not solve your actual problem.
     
  10. Alexstarfire

    Alexstarfire Ancient Guru

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    That's assuming there even is a problem. I for one see "mental illnesses" as a way to escape responsibility for a problem. I'm sure some people genuinely have problems, no doubt about that. But there are also a vast majority of people that are diagnosed to have "mental illness" even though what's wrong with them is bad parenting, as someone above posted about. If you have problems, as a parent, then getting them classified to have a "mental illness" is like telling you that it's not your fault, but God's or someone elses fault. It's almost like a way for them not to feel bad that they can't parent worth a crap.

    Some kids need more parenting than others and it's the parents responsibility to know how much their child needs. Also, as stated above, the meds to "cure" your kid can have very bad side effects and sometimes they don't even work and you have to go through several meds to find the ones that do work, maybe only to a certain degree too.
     

  11. Deadman93723

    Deadman93723 Ancient Guru

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    Mental illness is real, I should know I'm Bipolar, severly Bipolar. I need my medications, and I have a lot of them, just to function like a halfway normal person. But, I do agree that a lot of people, especially children, get diagnosed for ADHA ,and the like, far to often. Most of those children just need a swift kick in the a$$.

    Parents these days want a simple quick fix and don't want to parent the way they should. A lot of people take mental illness either too lightly or use it as an excuse for their or their childrens bad behavior.

    Those type of parents piss me off, because if they only knew what it is like to worry everyday whether their child was going to be Bipolar or not like I do because my daughter has a %60 chance of being like me when she grows up, they might appreciate what they have.

    Anyways, I could ramble on about this topic for ages, mental illness is all to real, but a lot of over-prescribing and over-dianosing goes on that's for sure.
     
  12. nm+

    nm+ Don Cappuccino Staff Member

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    ADD/ADHD are atual real deseases that do exist and are different than being a normal child. I know people who actually have it and before meds or when they are off meds its pretty obvious.
    However, it is also not that common. For every person with it, i would gather to guess that 5 kids are diagnosed because thier parents don't want to deal with them and some psychastrists are lazy/poorly-trained/want the money/make a mistake.

    Not directly related to mental health, but I do wonder what the effect of all this antibiotic cleaners will be on human development. the human immune system develops early and it needs "practice." there damn helicopter parentrs are so afraid of thier precious darling getting the flu (and actually have to do real parenting) that they're making childhood too clean for thier own good.
    I blame a lot of this on helocopter parenting. Yes, its normal for mom to worry about her children. But its also normal for children to get hurt, it how they learn not to do stupid crap and that thier actions have consequences.
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2007
  13. eat@joes

    eat@joes Maha Guru

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    When I mouthed off I didn't get what I want. I got a one-two-shut the hell up. My dad's hand could reach the back seat of the van while merging traffic at high speed.

    Parents are too much of a pussy to put kids in their places. And no, I'm not saying beat your kids; just let them know they can't get away with ****.
     
  14. Classic Satch

    Classic Satch Banned

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    True words of wisdom. Screw this "time-out" garbage. I think that I would have laughed in my mother's face if she would have attempted to use that as a disciplinary technique.
     
  15. bug77

    bug77 Banned

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    Eh, drugs...

    If you want to make one, you have to test it for years (and in some instances, the market demands it yesterday). If possible, testing it on as few humans as possible. And after that sell it, in this case a mind-altering drug, and guarateeing no side effects whatsoever. Not very reasonable, is it?

    I think the problem is we have come to expect things, rather then use our better judgement. Of course, the whole thing is a lot more complicated, but in the end, it comes down to the above.
     

  16. Flukester

    Flukester Banned

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    Yep that is so true, my parents disciplined me well enough, almost too much. Hate to say, but I got the belt, the ruler on the butt and physically thrown into my room sometimes for the course of a day! Not to mention some verbal abuse and false accusations constantly. Not saying this is how to raise your child, but I did learn discipline and to respect my parents. Unfortunately discipline has to be for both parents. Not just one. Take my case for example, I am the bad guy in the family. When I get angry or anything my son will take heed, when my wife gets angry the kid basically laughs. The side effect is when I get home it's never peaceful and my son tries to get away with what he gets away with with mommy. Not much I can do about it really, because as soon as I try to get into it with her it usually ends up being that "I" am playing the 'blame game'. My only thing is I feel bad because I know I am the one who is literally doing things about bad stuff going on and my conscious bothers me at times so I insert times when I just tolerate it for a while. My wife is even easy with the pets, they stick by her meanwhile I'm the one picking up their dumps in the backyard, I'm the one cutting the dogs nails or combing him etc... I call it my own little hell that I married into. As for my wife, well I don't mean to ever put her down or hurt her through emotional conversation but I believe she was raised where anything goes and very little discipline. At this stage there is nothing I can do really to change anything. I believe it hurt her maturity and affects her overall ability to deal with a child who starves for attention.
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2007
  17. most leftist 69

    most leftist 69 Master Guru

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    Mental illness is very different from physical illness.

    Mental illness is largely subjective, while physical problems are objective, even though they may be misdiagnosed.

    I disagree with whoever says too many people are diagnosed with anti-diarheal high definiton and ADD. The reason is that many parents will not accept that their child isn't the perfect. Same with learning disabilities.

    The guy who said not to have kids if there's something wrong with you is a genius, and I've agreed with him my whole life.
     
  18. JACK4HIRE

    JACK4HIRE Ancient Guru

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    Allow me to clarify my earlier statement because we are saying the same thing. Excess hyperactivity in children does happen but as you said I believe it is extremely rare. I also agree with your statement that all too often a normal healthy boy of 8 is given the badge of ADD/ ADHD because his parents, teachers etc don’t want to deal with him.

    I also wonder about the emerging research that shows how much food additives, dyes, processed sugars, food allergies etc are having an effect on peoples mental stability.

    I have read of several doctors who have cured ADHD in children simply by changing their diets and exercise plans. Makes me wonder.

    Another thing that bothers me is all the 'depressed' children out there who have to take mood enhancers just to make it through the day. WTF? There can't be that many genuinely depressed kids out there. Why are these kids not being taught proper coping skills by their parents? I know the answer. These kids have probably been watching their parents medicate themselves just to get through a day. That is the coping skills they learn - if you have a problem take a pill.

    My parents taught me that life sometimes sucks and to get through it you need to man up and push on despite your feeling. If I sniveled as a kid my mom or dad would 'correct' my attitude and I would have to complete the assigned task anyway with a now sore ass etc.

    My dad would say things to me that I didn't understand at the time but I do now, things like "hesitation causes meditation in a horizontal position" or "2nd place is only the first loser". [Insert the F word in any of the above statements by my dad].

    Anyone else's father say screwed up sh*t like that to them?
     
  19. Solinari

    Solinari Ancient Guru

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    Mental illness is obviously real, there is no doubt about that. While i can understand why some people say it's an excuse, i still don't believe that any decent doctor would hand out pills like candy. Of course that doesn't mean that some people don't play on it for whatever reason, and then you have bad doctors that write a prescription on demand.

    Someone mentioned Bi-Polar disorder, this is very real and can even be seen on scans (might be MRI can't recall). Depression in general is just a part of life, but some people can become sufficiently depressed to merit medication. Fear is a part of life, but some people can experience fear (anxiety) all the time or it's so bad it becomes debilitating. No one here can say they have never been nervous or that they haven't been down (low mood caused by many things, grief is a good example).

    Mental illness is as real as the many things we go through on a daily basis, it's when someone suffers significantly because of their mood or anxiety that medication can help. Of course it may not get to the root of the problem, it can relieve the symptoms. When you break your leg you will take pain medication, but it won't fix your leg. Same applies for mental illness.

    I have really only touched on depression and/or anxiety (the two usually go hand in hand), but i haven't really mentioned the severe mental illness like schizophrenia or Post Traumatic stress Disorder or Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder. Even things like Agoraphobia and personality disorders (narcissism or Antisocial personality disorder) are real mental illnesses.
     
  20. arnie

    arnie Maha Guru

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    I have got to agree here, medications for mental problems are vastly over perscribed in the UK (in my opinion anyway). This was really brought home to me after I lost a close relative and I was offered pills to cheer me up, pills to make me sleep, pills for all sorts. I just don't think it is healthy, I said no to any medication, pulled myself up by my shoelaces and was back at college in 2 days after the death. Sometimes you just have to get on with life, and I think this culture of giving pills out for everything is terribly unhealthy.

    These people need to stop thinking that medication is the answer for everything and actually deal with their problems. (This is not aimed at people with legitimate mental illness, I might add. But giving a child pills just because he has a lot of energy, for god sake..)
     

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