Vulkan insta-crashes games on my RX 5700 XT with current drivers

Discussion in 'Videocards - AMD Radeon Drivers Section' started by dalekusa, Nov 27, 2020.

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  1. dalekusa

    dalekusa New Member

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    For the past good while, I've not been able to use Vulkan in any of my games. GZDoom crashes right after launch without an error, Rainbow 6 Siege crashes after the intro screen, and I've been getting errors in Doom (2016) right at launch.

    Here's my DxDiag results
    And here's my Doom crash log
     
  2. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    your system memory is not stable.

    please use speccy or cpu-z to publish system informtation, not dxdiag, theres a lot of useless information in there and it doesn't really even give detailed system info.
     
  3. dalekusa

    dalekusa New Member

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    OK, here's the CPU-Z report.

    As for the memory statement, I'll run the Windows Memory Diagnostic tool and come back with any findings.

    Edit 1: No problems were found, but now I'll run MemTest64 for a bit.

    Edit 2: 30 minutes, 18 passes, no errors found.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  4. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    I would try the latest Vulkan runtime or the AMD 20.11.2 Ray Trace Vulkan drivers which includes this and a newer Vulkan SDK core I'd imagine.
    https://www.amd.com/en/support/kb/release-notes/rn-rad-win-20-11-2-vrt-beta

    https://vulkan.lunarg.com/sdk/home (Only the small 1.2.154.1 runtime not the full SDK.)

    With that out of the way check on the Windows Event Logger for any reports on memory errors and if there is anything potentially also see if there's a bios update especially if on AMD the 1.1.0.0 (Even Patch C) and 1.1.8.0 range as these are very error prone and the newer updates focus a lot on ABL (AGESA Boot Loader) RAM compatibility and fixes but it's not perfect yet especially higher speeds.

    Thing to do here is to boot into the bios and disable the XMP and test without that fully confirming memory stability then possibly tuning the XMP values like a little bit extra voltage if the kits can handle it or start with lower speeds or more relaxed (higher) timings first.


    GPU wise too the 5700 if altered in Wattman can be very sensitive memory clocks especially, I have basically no headroom at all in some games before those crash whereas in others I can add a +50 or even +100 just fine and it's stable for hours but not in all games.

    Testing wise I can run OCCT for an hour it won't find anything, game wise 5 minutes in Watch_Dogs Legion or Assassin's Creed Valhalla and it'll crash it's quite a bit better at picking out these stability errors due to how sensitive these and a few other titles are particularly Vulkan and D3D12 :)

    EDIT:
    Combo-AM4 1.0.0.4

    That is quite old, 3600 / 1800 too for the DDR4 memory and infinity fabric and a B450 motherboard.
    (Late 2019 I think and then various Type A and B patches around early 2020 for it also exists.)


    Not that it can't be stable but that's a good first test to see if it improves knowing it's hitting the limits of what AMD motherboards and CPU's are capable of handling.


    AMD GPU too it's going to hit the PCI Express Bus and memory channels harder the way AMD's using these through DMA or Direct Memory Access the limited knowledge I have of this.

    Basically AMD GPU's are more sensitive to RAM stability issues as a result.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020

  5. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    Like i told the last guy, Memtest is insufficient for finding errors in memory tuning or issues connected to the retention of data between refresh cycles.
     
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  6. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    Wonder if testing software will eventually improve and be a bit better at catching some of these things, most users would find it satisfactory that the stress test benchmark and dedicated software for hardware component testing with multiple sets to get at some of the more difficult stability conditions pass without issue.

    Then some game just can't manage stability for more than a few minutes or doesn't even boot up before hitting an error.
    It's a good way to absolutely ensure stability or at least as good as it can get but there will be a bit of confusion over if it's the GPU or the drivers and then it turns out to be memory related maybe it would also work fine on NVIDIA or Intel but crash on AMD or be stable in some titles on AMD and be unstable on NVIDIA and Intel but I guess it's impossible to discern from a benchmark doing a pattern and how it utilizes RAM and then various games and game engines and entirely different conditions plus a more overall workload on the entire system not mostly just a particular component.

    EDIT: Assuming this is of course a RAM error but it seems fairly likely this is the case.

    Even knowing about some of these issues it can be a bit of tinkering with various software or the bios especially when that gets a major code update to make certain that it's all stable and going to remain so.
    (Well AMD also recommends 3200 DDR4 but 3600's often accepted as possible though it can be a bit more work above that though it becomes a lot more problematic.)


    EDIT: Maybe Dice could use Frostbite to make one of those fancy 3D Mark sequences, that'd be a proper stability test alright with how that engine is really sensitive to much of this and general GPU and CPU issues besides RAM or VRAM.
    (There's Super Position or others I suppose using D3D12 but I don't know if that's good enough.)
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  7. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    You can generally find the issues memtest doesn't catch in Prime95 Blend.

    30 minutes is nothing though for memtest, some issues don't show up till 30 hours of testing.
     
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  8. dalekusa

    dalekusa New Member

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    Well after updating the BIOS and turning off XMP, I launched Doom again and I still got the same error. I'll run Prime95 Blend as @Astyanax recommended at 2133 MHz for a while and see if there is anything going on.

    Edit 1: Some additional info:
    • I installed the Vulkan runtime directly
    • These errors seem to only come up with Vulkan. Games running OpenGL and DirectX still work just fine.
    • I have not OC'd the graphics card outside of maybe the manufacturer's factory OC (I dunno if Sapphire cards have it automatically applied, and I don't see any OC profiles in Trixx [my card is a Sapphire Pulse RX 5700 XT].)
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2020
  9. Hypernaut

    Hypernaut Member Guru

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    Those drivers are horrid. Oust them and get some older ones in there.
     
  10. dalekusa

    dalekusa New Member

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    Which ones do you recommend, and will there be any issues with any newer games?

    Edit 1: Ran Prime95 Blend test for a little over three hours at 2133 MHz, no errors or warnings. I think either @Hypernaut is correct and the AMD drivers have gone horribly wrong in the past few months, or perhaps something may be wrong with the motherboard (unlikely, as I am only crashing programs, not the whole machine).
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2020
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  11. Hypernaut

    Hypernaut Member Guru

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    I'm using the previous version. The horror stories of installing the latest put me off. I'm having no issues with 20.11.1
     
  12. dalekusa

    dalekusa New Member

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    I've been having these issues for at least the past two months, even on 20.11.1.

    Edit: I'll go ahead and re-enable XMP at full chat, then later tonight I'll run Prime95 overnight and see if anything comes up there. I hope I don't have to, say, RMA my motherboard or graphics card.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2020
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  13. Hypernaut

    Hypernaut Member Guru

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    Sounds like it could be either a dying or under performing power supply or bad RAM. Have you updated the BIOS on your mother board?

    additional: I see you have updated the BIOS. Best case it's a failing PSU or dodgy RAM. Worst case it returning the mobo.
     
  14. dalekusa

    dalekusa New Member

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    These parts are less than a year old, and like I said, Prime95 gave me no issues. My PSU is from Corsair, so I don't think it's dodgy. I dunno if I should replace the motherboard with a new one or upgrade to a B550/X570 mobo, but in that case, I don't know if I can go back to an old machine of mine in the meantime.

    Edit: I ran MemTest86 a bit, and after a pass or so, it found no errors at all. I think that this eliminates the RAM from the potential causes. I also DDU'd again and rolled back to 20.9.1, but that didn't work. I just don't know what else to do other than potentially RMA the motherboard.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2020
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  15. Hypernaut

    Hypernaut Member Guru

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    can you pop another PSU in there?
     

  16. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    If it's the PSU long as it's not a splitter type cable you should be fine feels a bit silly to point that out but I see the 6800 and 6800XT users are running into these problems again so might be something to check, Pulse is a 8x and a 6x so not as heavy as what you'd get trying to splitter 2x 8-pin but can still be unstable especially if it hits higher power draws during fluctuation.

    I'm on a Corsair as well in terms of PSU only thing is that this model has a switch for multi or single rail configuration although practically it's not too different in modern power supplies it's rarer with a full modular build though the amperage protection and setting the cables to separate rails can still be useful to keep in mind if not toggling over to a single rail mode for when that's a thing. :)


    Good to hear it wasn't the memory, Wattman and instability shouldn't be a thing on stock settings either and driver wise I've had no problems with 20.11.2 myself but the drivers still carry some known issues that haven't been resolved.
    Enhanced Sync is still problematic for example and multi-display mode will improved can be a bit hit & miss in addition to AMD's sharpening option causing the occasional problem but they have profiles for many games were this is the case or where it conflicts with FidelityFX in the game directly. :)

    Vulkan runtime and the recommendation for that is that AMD until 20.11.2 and the ray-tracing beta support used 1.2.135.1 for the runtime (Version 1.2.148.1 I think for the driver support itself.) and since then there's been a few bug fixes including crash cases and overall stability in the runtime software so I am glad AMD's now on the latest 1.2.154.1 runtime directly with these and hopefully the next 20.12.1 drivers which should have the 6900XT support.

    Any third party programs?

    Registry location for the Vulkan layers is found here:
    Computer\HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Khronos\Vulkan\ImplicitLayers
    (ReShade, Riva Tuner or others could have entries here.)

    Steam and other layers would be here as well other than that if it's just Vulkan it's unlikely to be stuff like the anti virus or Defender acting up.


    EDIT: Third party programs can also include recording software, hooks in problematic software like iCue from Corsair and others and also AMD's own ReLive software.

    EDIT: Daisy chaining that's what it's called not a splitter.
    You don't want to push above what the cable or the 8x (Hopefully it's a 8x) PSU side of this is trying to handle.


    But the examples listed shouldn't be peaking to the absolute limits anyway and again Vulkan only.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2020
  17. rflair

    rflair Don Commisso Staff Member

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    tried uninstalling Trixx?
     
  18. dalekusa

    dalekusa New Member

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    I found two Steam layers (SteamFossilizeVulkanLayer64.json and SteamOverlayVulkanLayer64.json) and one from Twitch Studio (TwitchOverlayVulkanConfigure64.json). Might try uninstalling Twitch Studio and see if that works, since I don't even use it at all. As for the PSU stuff, I wouldn't think it would be that, because if the PSU was weak, it would be causing issues in games that don't run Vulkan, such as DirectX and OpenGL stuff.

    Edit: UNINSTALLING TWITCH STUDIO FIXED IT!!!
    [​IMG]

    After uninstalling it and getting rid of it's entry in the registry, Doom 2016 just started right up! Same thing with GZDoom. Thanks for bringing the layers up, @JonasBeckman. (Note: taking a look at the older thread, it seemed a similar issue was causing it all along with Bandicam.)
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2020
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  19. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    Author of DXVK had some words for I forgot if it was a OBS plugin or Bandicam but it sounds like the situation with recording software could be better, resolved at least so that takes care of it. :)
    And hopefully at some point these programs will start doing this sort of interaction with D3D12 and Vulkan properly minimizing potential issues.

    Well mostly Vulkan but yeah it can be a problem troubleshooting these things so good to see it get resolved.
     

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