The truth about PRE-RENDERING 0?

Discussion in 'Videocards - NVIDIA GeForce Drivers Section' started by Tastic, Jul 16, 2012.

  1. bernek

    bernek Maha Guru

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    So it's recommended that I "disable fullscreen optimizations" in W10 all the time ? I use GSYNC ON Fullscreen on a Freesync monitor with an 1070GTX.

    So to my understanding I get real "exclusive fullscreen mode" for my games by turning this feature off ?

    I mean I don't care about W10 OSD stuff and the speed of ALT+TAB I just want my games to run the best they can (with no additional lag or anything caused by W10 config).
     
  2. kurtextrem

    kurtextrem Master Guru

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    Benchmark your game, but for me I got higher fps (min + max + avg) when I turned it off.
     
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  3. bernek

    bernek Maha Guru

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    How do I turn it off completely in latest W10 version ? I don't have the option anymore to turn off via "Settings" app.

    Thank you !

    P.S. is it disabled ?!

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  4. alexander1986

    alexander1986 Member Guru

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    something changed in win10 1809 im pretty sure, theres a lot of topics on this online and forums about 1809 exclusive fullscreen acting weird sometimes/some games/in general, I had a really hard time getting rid of it, just ticking disable fullscreen optimizations did not work had to change several other values in registry and add some lines aswell if I remember correctly to fix it, might depend on the game also, even now im not sure its true exclusive fullscreen mode, even if I cant alt tab fast and I dont see start menu or overlay when pressing windows key inside a fullscreen game..

    easy check if you have fullscreen optimizations = press windows key/start on keyboard when inside a game in fullscreen mode, if start menu comes up then you are not in exclusive fullscreen, atleast from what I know I might be wrong,


    For me it took some tweaking to not have start menu appear when pressing start in games, but still, I think its not same exclusive fullscreen as in previous windows builds, in most cases there should be no stutter or performance issues anyway, for me works fine now but if you have problems in game maybe I can check my registry settings if you want to copy them to get rid of overlay/start menu showing up in games etc,

    :S
     

  5. bernek

    bernek Maha Guru

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    Yeah I understand ... well in most of my games even I when select "Fullscreen" in game I get instant alt+tab and start menu so like you said its the "new fullscreen mode" that isn't actually exclusive fullscreen. I don't have any problems but sometimes I feel that GSYNC is not working because of this new fullscreen mode. I get some tearing and I dont want to enable VSYNC with GSYNC ... I prefer capping max fps with RTSS at -3 monitor refresh rate and hope the fullscreen is working ...

    I could also enbale GSYNC for fullscreen and window mode but not sure if its a good idea ...

    Well not sure what to do next :D
     
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  6. alexander1986

    alexander1986 Member Guru

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    yep, your refreshrate minus 3 fps as frame limit with gsync on should be all u need for correct gsync as far as I know, I think gsync on+vsync on will have same result, as long as you have refreshrate -3 fps as framelimit gsync will take priority over normal vsync, on blurbusters gsync test they use gsync on+vsync on+ minus 3 fps as framelimit and its same as just gsync on what I can see, actually they used only minus 2 fps but the normal recommendation now is minus 3 fps to be on safe side from reaching the gsync ceiling:


    [​IMG]

    ingame frame limiter is best if you can set custom, if cant set custom fps limit in game, then do it with RTSS, but with RTSS there is a from a half to 1 frame of extra lag, not much but still,
    but the frametimes will be perfect with RTSS so that is perhaps worth the small input lag penalty,


    but anyway ! I took a look at my registry to see what I changed to make start menu not show when im in fullscreen game and press start key,

    maybe this is not all I did but you can try copy this settings:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    If some value or entry is missing in your registry just add it and edit the value to like in my pictures, also reboot after changes and try again to see if start menu shows up in fullscreen game when press start key, if not then maybe its fixed and will feel better,

    also I removed all xbox apps from win10 with powershell and all gamedvr stuff :D

    but still, im 99% sure from win 1809+ there is no longer the real exclusive fullscreen mode, but it still feels better like this for me, IDK :D


    good luck and let me know if this helps!

    PS you could also try what you said enable gsync in fullscreen+windowed mode, see if any difference, but still interesting to know if my registry settings makes it so start menu does not appear in fullscreen game!
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  7. kurtextrem

    kurtextrem Master Guru

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    I do it the following: Right click the game .exe, compatibility, check "disable fullscreen optimization"
     
  8. alexander1986

    alexander1986 Member Guru

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    are u on win10 1809 btw? it does not work 100% of the time for every game in win 10 1809 version, you can see it didnt work for @bernek in his post above and same for me in fortnite, ticking disable fullscreen optimizations on win 1809 does not give exclusive fullscreen for me in this game,

    there are many users that report the same problem if googling this issue in win10 1809, but maybe it also depends on the game, IDK
    anyway for me to fix I had to edit registry further (posted screenshots above with the settings I think fixed the problem) and also completely disable all gamebar/gamedvr/xbox stuff, one of those things fixed it lol,


    but in theory should be same performance or even better with fullscreen optimizations according to microsoft, reality can be different :D

    if I run win10 1607 for example I can get true exclusive fullscreen and slightly better frametimes/min fps but its small difference and not worth downgrade for other reasons imo...
     
  9. bernek

    bernek Maha Guru

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    yeah not worth downgrading but getting rid of useless telemetry and game bar and game dvr it is ! :)

    I'm not encountering any specific issues but sometimes g-sync fails to deliver for me at least is what I "feel" ...

    I just honestly wish we have a "Gaming OS" version of W10 with all crap turned off just to be enough to play games. But even with this gaming edition Microsoft will leave some "neat" features like Game DVR on so the pain is still there ...

    I only game on this particular PC and I was thinking in the past to roll back to a version of Windows that is stripped and to disable all Spectre and Meltdown patches from BIOS (installing older versions before these vulnerabilities were discovered or patched) and to use the appropriate Windows version just to game.

    I have a dual boot in this system and I use hackintosh for any work that I do. W10 is purely gaming.
     
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  10. alexander1986

    alexander1986 Member Guru

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    did you fix the startmenu showing up in fullscreen game btw? I posted reply if you check above with my registry screenshots and its different from yours :p if you want to try I mean, for me there is no startmenu showing up in fullscreen games when I press start key after these changes anyway! (but still, probably not true exclusive fullscreen like old windows builds lol)

    also you can disable software level spectre/meltdown patch with "inspectre" freeware tool+reboot, it gave me like ~ 30 minimum fps boost on my old pc which was i5-3470 and 2x4gb ddr1333 ram :D

    on new hardware its probably no difference or minimal though..
     

  11. bernek

    bernek Maha Guru

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    I did use inspectre in the past with no discernible effects in gaming performance ... an old i5 surely but with modern CPUs not the case ... (AMD not being vulnerable only to 1 type of attacks).

    I did add only 1 missing line from your reg tweaks and yes the start doesn't show up anymore so its some kind of fullscreen mode not sure what it is but at least no more OSDs and start popping out ... it also depends on game I think since some say fullscreen exclusive and maybe its not ... maybe some Origin titles not sure :)
     
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  12. alexander1986

    alexander1986 Member Guru

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    nice! I believe this is as close as we will get to exclusive fullscreen on 1809 lol, atleast for these games that maybe dont force it on their own somehow..


    it was GameDVR_FSEBehavior "2" I guess that did it and you had to add it manual? good to know if it was this line so I remember for future and maybe if someone else need help with this :D


    gg microsoft !


    ah well, GL with your testing :)


    Also in origin there is always the old trick to disable origin in-game overlay in origin settings , but this was like a trick in 2014 I remember, I think they patched to now the bugs it had with some fullscreen games with it enabled x)
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  13. Chastity

    Chastity Ancient Guru

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    It's not that the RTSS interface is limited to 2 decimals, it's limited to 5 numerals. :)
     
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  14. alexander1986

    alexander1986 Member Guru

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    yes, and no I guess :p

    it can show 6 numbers + underscore, maybe even 7 numbers I never tried ,but can not modify from interface with values over 5 numerals it seems?

    [​IMG]


    sorry for nitpicking lol :D
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2019
  15. bernek

    bernek Maha Guru

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    Yep that was the line :) the only difference towards my configuration. I guess it tells it to default to that option for any games you start. Not sure really but it works most of the times.

    I depends a lot on the way full screen is handled or implemented by the game.

    I'm sorry for rambling about my "Game Edition W10" rambling but it should be made ... Microsoft could just tweak W10 64 bit towards gaming oriented consumers and ship with a new UI and some game stuff added it will sell like crazy. I think a big proportion of W10 installs are on gaming computers and if you tell those people you get extra 5% gaming performance they will do it :D
     
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  16. plopingo

    plopingo Active Member

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    I don't know what to say the result is just insane !! I'm using this with vsync (triple buffered mode in apex legend) it's smooth, no tearing. gsync & freesync seems useless to me now !!
    (monitor used Samsung CF24FG73)

    thanks for the help ;)
     
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  17. Cyberdyne

    Cyberdyne Ancient Guru

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    Gsync would be useless to just about anyone if they could keep 144 FPS solid in every game they played. :rolleyes:
     
  18. artina90

    artina90 Active Member

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    I would like to try capping my fps but I am getting variable results from both the web based detection sites, they both oscillate a lot.
    CRU reports that my screen has a frequency of 59.996 is it accurate?
     
  19. Cyberdyne

    Cyberdyne Ancient Guru

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    Yeah that's accurate. Most 60 hz displays are actually 59.9 hz. My understanding is that it's a holdover from analog TV broadcast, believe it or not.
     
  20. EerieEgg

    EerieEgg Member Guru

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    @Tastic I'll add to this that what I've found is that with a value of "1" (the minimum available), many games begin to exhibit "hitching" or what appears to be "frame skipping". @CrunchyBiscuit commented on this over in this thread as well where our experiences appear to line up: https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/s...-in-games-like-overwatch.427557/#post-5690298

    For myself, this is on a high end system (8700K/1080 Ti + G-Sync) and occurred in several games I tested (Witcher 3 /Crysis 3 / Overwatch / Far Cry 5).

    In my tests, when using a value of "1" for the max prerendered frames setting, to avoid this "hitching" / "frame skipping" behavior one must cap their fps to what is almost always achievable -- even then, if I do dip beneath that target, I often get hitching (the fps graph seems to drop to 0 then return to normal).

    As I've experienced it then, one either has to use 1 mprf in conjunction with an fps cap OR set this to a higher value to avoid hitching/frame skipping or whatever issue there that occurs.

    A big pet peeve of mine is that a ton of games out there "freeze" completely for a split second upon reaching a checkpoint/save point for example and that I'm not certain can be resolved by upping the mprf value since that behavior specifically may be tied to the game itself (or its antipiracy measures perhaps -- perhaps they do checks on save or some such there, not sure -- I know for a fact that's the case in Far Cry 5 -- have tested both the paid uplay version that I own as well as the cracked version and the cracked version does not exhibit the horrendous hitching/stutter problems that the paid version does on my system -- based on this, I assume that perhaps at least some other games out there work that way as well much to my dismay but I digress...).

    What's unfortunate about all of this is that I find that even at very high framerates, the input lag difference for MPRF is noticeable. If AMD's new "Low Lag" feature for their new cards is some sort of "Dynamic" flip queue size, then I'm likely to swap over over to team red lol.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2019

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