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The truth about PRE-RENDERING 0?

Discussion in 'Videocards - NVIDIA GeForce Drivers Section' started by Tastic, Jul 16, 2012.

  1. Xtreme512

    Xtreme512 Master Guru

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    with afterburner in monitoring you can select it to see in osd or its own monitor screen with line chart.
     
  2. Mars73

    Mars73 Member

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    I was playing it in exclusive full screen (all games btw) but I had the iPresentinterval on 1 (vsync). Changed it yesterday from in-game vsync to nvcpl.
    Also with these RTSS settings with Ghost Recon Wildlands it's quite smooth. Whereas I sometimes had a weird random stutter, even though it was saying 60fps, it's now smoother. Responsiveness is good.
    Will use this with more games, thanks!
     
  3. dr_rus

    dr_rus Ancient Guru

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    Fallout 4 physics engine tend to misbehave when running at fps higher than 60.
     
  4. mirc00

    mirc00 New Member

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    Thanks, i found it. So, frame time basically means how long a frame takes to render and higher frame rate means more input lag right? So 3ms frame time equals way less input delay than 16,66ms frame time?
     

  5. rla1999

    rla1999 Member

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    Thanks for the info on the other thread. I am following your method shown above with RTSS. I found out my non GSync monitor is 60.049 Hz so I set the limit to 60.042

    [Framerate]
    Limit=60042
    LimitDenominator=1000

    Now, I have VSync ON globally in NVCP. I have the program setting to "use 3D application setting" and VSync ON in the game. Is this the best way? Or just set the program setting to "use global setting(on)"?
     
  6. RealNC

    RealNC Ancient Guru

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    Normally, yes. What's measured is how much time has passed since the last time the game has presented a frame to be displayed. It's not possible to know how much time was needed to render the frame.

    So the frame times in AB/RTSS represent present intervals. These should be the same as render times though, since it doesn't make sense for a game to render a frame and then sit on it and not presenting it immediately.

    Note that if you apply a frame rate cap, this stops being the case for obvious reasons. (If the game needed 5ms to render, but your cap is 16.7ms/60FPS, then that's your present interval and you're gonna see 16.7ms as the frame time.)

    No. Higher frame rate means less input lag. Remember: Higher frame rates means lower frame times and vice versa.

    Yes. Although it's not "way less". 13ms is not really a huge amount of input lag.

    That means there's diminishing returns when it comes to input lag and frame rate. 3ms means 333FPS. That's a very difficult to achieve frame rate in modern games, and input lag is not reduced that much compared to 16.7ms (60FPS.)

    All of this assumes either vsync off, or g-sync btw. With vsync, there are huge differences in input lag. With vsync off or g-sync, input lag differences between frame rates are smaller. For example, 144Hz vsync has much lower input lag than 60Hz vsync. But 144Hz vsync off compared to 60Hz vsync off (or gsync) does not have such a huge difference in input lag.

    This also depends in other factors. One of them is how stressed the GPU is. For example, 63FPS with the GPU stressed to 99% has higher input lag compared to 62FPS with the GPU not maxed out. This is why frame limiting can induce a big input lag reduction. If your game maxes out your GPU at 63FPS, if you frame cap to 62FPS you're going to get a big latency reduction.

    I proposed a feature for RTSS that does exactly this (apply a variable frame rate cap that throttles the game just a bit,) but I'm not sure if Unwinder ignored it or didn't get around to it yet :O
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2017
  7. mirc00

    mirc00 New Member

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    Thanks again for your info RealNC. It was a typo tho :p What i meant to write was:

    "and higher frame time means more input lag right?" not frame rate :p
     
  8. Agent-A01

    Agent-A01 Ancient Guru

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    Keep posting that until he responds :)
     
  9. X7007

    X7007 Maha Guru

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    Many games like Need for Speed Rivals and Rise of the Tomb Raider have better fps and steady 60 fps when using PreRender 3 . I don't why. but when use 1 in Tomb Raider the Fps was 49 fps on the same place.
     
  10. Xtreme512

    Xtreme512 Master Guru

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    true. you can also try "2" and see.
     

  11. Mars73

    Mars73 Member

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    Did some more testing today and am amazed about how smooth everything is with lowering it 0.007.
    Also in Ghost Recon Wildlands when not using this 0.007 lowering my i5-6400 gets bottlenecked big time (not suprising with a GTX 1080Ti), but when using this RTSS 0.007 lower thing I get perfect 70-90% values. I tested this a many times (0.007 on and off) and it is consistent, at the same places constant 100% and stutters when off, 70-90% and smooth when on.
    Will test it in more games, but how is it possible that with that change in RTSS the CPU will be spared?
    (and why is this not a standard implementation with every vsync option - I'm thinking of all the people who don't use RTSS and this 0.007 cap and complain about it not being smooth).
     
  12. fernake

    fernake Member Guru

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    Hi, how do you know the exact refresh rate of your monitor? I'll try what you say, thank you in advance.
     
  13. GroinShooter

    GroinShooter Master Guru

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    Leave this running for a while with nothing interfering in the background (games etc).
    Your actual refresh rate is displayed at the top of the graph.

    https://www.vsynctester.com
     
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  14. Orochi

    Orochi Member

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    I've tried this approach on my 144hz monitor, to no avail, rivatuner limiter locks up my dota 2 game after a few seconds running the game. But there's good insight in this thread, thanks for sharing
     
  15. tfam26

    tfam26 Active Member

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    It seems pretty significant to me considering with a simple tweak in a text file you can smooth out your gaming experience and significantly lower input lag. I've tested this in multiple games and it almost always works and noticeably so.

    I hate looking at these types of things in a cynical light, but it really makes you wonder about the levels of incompetence and/or negligence of the people working on the hardware/software release at these companies having not implemented something like this already or at the very least an option to toggle this on and off that is clearly defined and easy to use within the official driver. Again, this is significant for gaming in general on a PC and maybe a fraction of a percent of the of PC gamers know about it?
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2017

  16. Orochi

    Orochi Member

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    I was part of the fraction of PC gamers who didn't knew about this, mainly because i own a 144hz Freesync monitor recently, and prior to it i would cap my frame in all games with vsync off global, would give me the smoothness i required :)
     
  17. khanmein

    khanmein Ancient Guru

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    @RealNC Should I cap MPC-HC with V-Sync on thru NvCpl? Do we need to apply the same concept too? Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2017
  18. Drimzi

    Drimzi Member

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    Would you be kind enough to post a list of games where you find that it is better to disable the ingame limiter and use RTSS instead, for GSYNC?
     
  19. mdrejhon

    mdrejhon Member Guru

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    In addition to vsynctester, the TestUFO site now also has an exact-Hz tester: www.testufo.com/refreshrate
    It defaults to 3 decimal digits for simplicity. You can click to get it up to 8 decimal digits, though.

    Also, I have written a new RTSS article on this now: HOWTO: Low-Lag VSYNC ON
    (Thanks, RealNC for the help! I've linked to his Guru3D post on this)
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2017
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  20. mdrejhon

    mdrejhon Member Guru

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    EDIT: Below post now moved to RTSS thread
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2017

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