SweetFX Shader Suite release and discussion thread #4

Discussion in 'Games, Gaming & Game-demos' started by CeeJay.dk, Sep 30, 2013.

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  1. angellman

    angellman Guest

    Hey all! Can be used in OpenGL games now (Riddick, Doom 3)?
     
  2. BenYeeHua

    BenYeeHua Ancient Guru

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    Not for SweetFX, but eFX is getting the OpenGL support.:)
     
  3. Zomgerd

    Zomgerd Master Guru

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    Still makes your statement incorrect because Nvidia users are not the only ones who have to use an unofficial AMD tool to use SweetFX for DX10/11..

    Fixed.

    Also eFX is litterally being designed to work for DX9/10/11 and OpenGL so it's not really "getting it" so much as it's being designed for all API's (exluding mantle.)
     
  4. BenYeeHua

    BenYeeHua Ancient Guru

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    Yup, and it look like eFX will replace SweetFX anytime when it is ready?:)
     

  5. Zomgerd

    Zomgerd Master Guru

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    ^That one I could not tell you.
     
  6. BenYeeHua

    BenYeeHua Ancient Guru

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    Yup, time will telling everything.:)
     
  7. K-putt

    K-putt Master Guru

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    eFX is just the injector. SweetFX is "only" the shader library. At least that's what i think it is.
     
  8. Crosire

    Crosire Member Guru

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    Correct. eFX can't replace SweetFX and there's no intention in doing so. It's a replacement for the (old) InjectSMAA injector that's currently used to apply the effects.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2013
  9. BenYeeHua

    BenYeeHua Ancient Guru

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    Thank for the information, so it is SweetFX+eFX.

    So I think the issues is, how's the thread going in the future, will they become one thread?
    Or SweetFX thread become only talking about shader library, while eFX thread talking about injector issues?:)
     
  10. OrdinaryOregano

    OrdinaryOregano Master Guru

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    Ahhh all this lovely progress...

    Also, holy **** Ceejay doesn't look what I imagined him to be.
     

  11. 007.SirBond

    007.SirBond Master Guru

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    Why do we need so many different kinds of injectors? Why can't we just take the best of all of them and put it into one injector for all?

    I may not be 100% correct, but I think this is how it goes:

    Ceejay's SweetFX cannot use ingame AA, or run in OpenGL games, 64bit games, or DirectX 11 games on Windows 8.1
    Boulator's SweetFX cannot run in DirectX 11 games on Windows 8.1, gets detected by anti-cheat programs like Punkbuster, and may have compatibility issues on some games.
    eFX.... actually I don't know much about eFX, I haven't used it yet, but I think it shares some of these problems with the other injectors, I tried using it in a game, and it wasn't working because I was using ingame AA.

    Can't there be a injector that overcomes all these limitations? It's just strange how one version of SweetFX will overcome a issue, like Boulator's for ingame AA, while another SweetFX doesn't. Can't the devs just focus on one and make it the best?

    I do appreciate the work being done on this, however, I just want one version that will be the best. Thanks to Ceejay and the others for making these.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2013
  12. Zomgerd

    Zomgerd Master Guru

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    Incorrect actually, it works with most games only some games have this problem. :p
     
  13. OrdinaryOregano

    OrdinaryOregano Master Guru

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    Ceejay's is the original injector.

    Boulotaur's injector was going to 'replace' CJ's but then Boulo disappeared.

    Don't know much about eFX other than that it was made for OpenGL support.

    And the injector's don't work on Win8.1 because they need a dxgi(?) update.
     
  14. BenYeeHua

    BenYeeHua Ancient Guru

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    Most of them are right, except Boulotaur one, he is very busy, and if you lost the interest on something, you will hardly to find it back and continue going.
     
  15. Spock

    Spock New Member

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    I already posted this on the Nexus, but this seems to be a lot more active so I thought I'd put it here too.

    Hey CeeJay,

    thank you for your great shader suite! Especially the AA shaders.
    While doing a google search I found a paper on CMAA by intel. It seems very desirable, maybe you (or someone else with the skills do to it) could have a look at it and see if it can be incorporated?

    Here is the link to the paper:

    http://software.intel.com/en-us/articles/conservative-morphological-anti-aliasing-cmaa

    There is a download link in the paper that provides the shader, I have no idea how to use it though.

    Regards,

    Spock
     

  16. Crosire

    Crosire Member Guru

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    I'm sorry, but you seem to have a wrong understanding of this. SweetFX is NO INJECTOR. It's a shader library and it makes use of injectors to inject these in games.

    Currently available injectors that do work with SweetFX are:
    • InjFXAA
    • InjectSMAA
    • Boulotaurs Injector
    • Radeon Pro
    • eFX

    Now you already noticed, every of these has some issues. Most of them come because they are old. InjectSMAA and InjFXAA haven't been updated in years (last one was somewhen back in 2011). Boulotaur was busy and had no time to update his one and it had some bugs and compatibility issues here and there. Radeon Pro isn't really an injector, but it has a feature which allows something similar. As you can expect it's not that best solution, as the main focus of that application really doesn't sit on post processing injection. And eFX is the newest one currently and still work in progress. There is an alpha available and well, you can guess it, alphas do contain bugs. A lot of them actually. No developer can write an application with multiple thousands lines of code (eFX currently has over one million lines of source) without a single bug, that won't happen, deal with it.
    Now actually eFX isn't an injector like the others available. It's also an engine, which is built to have support for all the graphic APIs available, including Direct3D, OpenGL and Mantle. Mantle support wasn't added yet, there is not SDK available that I know of, but may come in the future, when it gets more popular.
    Again, these are INJECTORS. You are wrong guessing that you will see any effects in your game by using them alone. They are there to inject shaders in your favorite game, but they don't provide those. You say it wasn't working because you wanted AA. And that's the problem, the injector doesn't provide any ingame AA (a shader does that job). It's SweetFX, which provides the SMAA and FXAA shaders, not Radeon Pro nor any other. The injectors load these shaders and apply them, that's it.
    You say that the developers don't focus on writing one injector which is the best. Now actually that is currently happening and it was mentioned multiple times in this thread already. eFX is the latest result of this. It was build while sharing ideas with the developers of all the injectors listed above.
    Boulotaur and me exchanged some ideas and source, mrhaandi (developer of InjectSMAA) and me had long conversations about this topic and we exchanged stuff too, CeeJay and me are still in constant contact, he passes all the ideas and features he wants to allow improvment of the shaders to me. And that was just a small part of the list.

    Again, Boulotaurs wasn't going to replace anything CeeJay wrote (there is no such injector). It was there to replace the old InjectSMAA injector which is still in use. And he did not dissapeared either, he was just busy. He answered this topic somewhen two weeks ago (and here as well, if you don't believe me: http://www.crosire.tk/?p=113#comment-63).
    eFX wasn't made of OpenGL support too, it was made to improve on all the injectors that are available, that's why I wrote it in cooperation with many of the developers above. And it's also wrong that none of the injectors works on Windows 8.1, eFX does. It did not need a DXGI update, because that's Microsofts job. It just required an update on the injector side to add an export for a function that was newly introduced in Windows 8.1 ("CreateDXGIFactory2").

    Sorry if I may appeared rude in some parts of this post, it isn't meant that way.

    I hope this clears it up a bit. It is important to understand the difference between an "injector" and a "shader library" here. Thanks a lot! :)
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2013
  17. S1eB

    S1eB Member

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    Anyone know of a way to get SweetFX working for BF4 DX11 x64 on Windows 8.1?

    SweetFX 1.4 doesn't work with it due to BF4 being x64 and 1.5.1 gives errors because of not working, at least to my knowledge, with DX11.2.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2013
  18. BenYeeHua

    BenYeeHua Ancient Guru

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    I has checked awhile, it look like the performance hit are same with SMAAx1 at here, and it is not open source I think.

    So...
     
  19. Spock

    Spock New Member

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    Well the source should be able to be used:

    /* Copyright (c) 2013, Intel Corporation
    *
    * Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without
    * modification, are permitted provided that the following conditions are met:
    *
    * - Redistributions of source code must retain the above copyright notice,
    * this list of conditions and the following disclaimer.
    * - Redistributions in binary form must reproduce the above copyright notice,
    * this list of conditions and the following disclaimer in the documentation
    * and/or other materials provided with the distribution.
    * - Neither the name of Intel Corporation nor the names of its contributors
    * may be used to endorse or promote products derived from this software
    * without specific prior written permission.
    *
    * THIS SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED BY THE COPYRIGHT HOLDERS AND CONTRIBUTORS "AS IS"
    * AND ANY EXPRESS OR IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, THE
    * IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE
    * ARE DISCLAIMED. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE COPYRIGHT OWNER OR CONTRIBUTORS BE
    * LIABLE FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, EXEMPLARY, OR
    * CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES (INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO, PROCUREMENT OF
    * SUBSTITUTE GOODS OR SERVICES; LOSS OF USE, DATA, OR PROFITS; OR BUSINESS
    * INTERRUPTION) HOWEVER CAUSED AND ON ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER IN
    * CONTRACT, STRICT LIABILITY, OR TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE OR OTHERWISE)
    * ARISING IN ANY WAY OUT OF THE USE OF THIS SOFTWARE, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE
    * POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGE.
    How did you test the performance? Because the article I posted above states it should cost less performance then 1xSMAA and is referring to the latest method for SMAA. This article seems to imply that too:

    http://www.codeproject.com/Articles/652000/Codemasters-GRID-2-on-4th-Generation-Intel-Core-Pr

    I think it has very good AA results (good enough for my resolution for sure), with less performance hit and less artifacts this should be the way to go. I say this without testing anything though.
     
  20. Zomgerd

    Zomgerd Master Guru

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    SweetFX DX11 in general doesn't work with 8.1 regardless of the 64bit exe, the only injection method working at the moment is radeonpro, you can give that shot.
     
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