Starcraft II Commercial

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Guru3D News, Jun 11, 2010.

  1. proFits

    proFits Ancient Guru

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    ^ +1, if anything SC2 is too balanced, terran should be more powerful.

    I can't believe they nerfed my tank just before the end just to piss me off -_-
     
  2. Stukov

    Stukov Ancient Guru

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    I was in the middle of trying to explain the problems and explanation of what a "hard counter" system and other responses to what you said, and to be honest if you have played beta, you aren't going to see anything new, unless you don't read the beta forums.

    It comes down to three major themes in the game that has it flawed. + damage to specific type of unit (light, armored, biological, etc), having so many air only, ground only, building only type of units, and viability of defense. I could go in depth but I don't think it is going to change your opinion.
     
  3. InfDaMarvel

    InfDaMarvel Ancient Guru

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    Terran are weak? I havnt played a lot but I cant agree with that.
     
  4. HellsAn631

    HellsAn631 Master Guru

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    im an open person, open to change. but i do think you should watch those videos i posted. if there were such a thing as hard counters being the end all be all, i don't think there would be a competitive scene for sc2. also, you know, these things (the exact same mechanics) existed in sc1.

    and to be honest, those beta forums are the worst ever. everyone complains about every little thing, and that everything is broken.

    an average forum viewer on the sc2 forum thinks:
    "since it is beta, it is my duty to argue about how the game Should be, and only my opinion matters, because obviously, the game is broken, because it is in beta, and blizzard doesn't know how to make a not broken game without my help."

    Instead of trying to optimize and play their best inside of the system they are given, and trying to win within that system, they seek to tear down the system and remake it. which is the wrong thing to be doing.

    They also don't realize that it is an entire new set of rules, and they can't just rely on the old set of rules, because it is not the same game, and not the same engine, as sc1.

    I actually used to think this way as well. but overtime, as i played the game more and more (and i lost a lot in the beginning, and stopped playing because i was so frustrated.), i began to realize that my issues weren't because of imbalance, but because i was, myself, a mechanically bad player. and that i wasn't doing my best within the rules of starcraft.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2010

  5. Stukov

    Stukov Ancient Guru

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    It is beta, you are supposed to complain and give advice.
     
  6. IPlayNaked

    IPlayNaked Banned

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    Well.

    The viability of defense is a gameplay philosophy and taste question, and really says nothing about how good or not the game is. I think it's pretty obvious that they sought to lessen turtling and wanted to make the game more about the units.

    And we are of course aware that the counter system played out in the first Starcraft as well? I mean, why didn't people build vulture or ghost swarms? Cause they did concussive damage and sucked hard against anything with armor.
     
  7. HellsAn631

    HellsAn631 Master Guru

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    in beta, your supposed to play the game and report bugs. its just like with a beta testing an application. your supposed to use the product as is, and give feedback.

    Now, feedback is something to consider here.

    When playing the game and giving feedback, it is important to consider what could help. Complaining is not the right thing to do. If you don't know the solution to a problem, just say that is it a problem.

    You must, however, distinguish between the problem being a problem with the game, or a problem with your playing ability. This is where the issue of imbalance occurs. Just because you can't beat a strategy, doesn't mean its imbalanced. Any strategy in starcraft has its weaknesses, and those can be exploited, and you can win.

    Because of this, i believe there is no such thing as imbalance when you look at a complex game like starcraft. Something that is imbalanced, would be something that cannot be beaten. If it can be beaten, then why is it imbalanced?

    If there is an imbalance, then this will show statistically throughout the game, and it will be fixed. Just like the many tiny things that blizzard has fixed. (personally, i liked every change by blizzard in every patch, and am enjoying the balance of the game so far.)

    I think one of the issue's that makes everyone cry and complain about imbalance, is because of the ladders. Since a lot of people just play ladder games, and only ladder games, they don't have time to fix the little issues that they themselves are having. Like their micro, macro, when to expand, where to position things, how to tech, etc. They are facing different opponents all together, and only focus on how the game plays and feels against different opponents.

    Now this alone, wouldn't be cause for concern for people who are enraged about balance. But take note, that it is beta. So, we have to "complain and give advice." meaning, that it is the game that is broken.

    I myself have trouble with the PvZ matchup. I just can't seem to overcome players who are decent at PvZ. I don't blame this on imbalance. I have seen a lot of zerg players who have the same issue with the match up. They cannot beat protoss. So this means that something is imbalanced? No, it simply implies, that it is the player having issues.

    There will still be a lot of people who think about imbalance after the game is released, because its a new game, and the same logic applies.

    A game like sc1 though, has been out of years, and people compete in it, so its obviously balanced comparatively.

    It is the dynamic nature of the game, the fact that not 1 strategy rules them all, which is why the game is balanced. Not because of the patches.

    /endrant on imbalance issues
     
  8. Alexstarfire

    Alexstarfire Ancient Guru

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    Terran is probably the most powerful in the game and you want them more powerful? That's a joke, right?

    What I think makes Terran so powerful is there versatility and recon abilities. Terran has at least as many possible strategies as zerg and protoss combined (from what I've seen), and their recon ability allows them to pick the best strat for the given situation. Seriously, all they have to do is wall up, send some reapers for harassment and then use the scanner ability to see what the other player is doing. Unless they are playing against another terran it's going to be painfully obvious what the other guy is doing.

    The biggest problem with terran though was the fact that they can block off with little to no consequences for doing so. And they can do it very early in the game. Protoss can do it, but it means they'll be slow. Zerg can do it but it takes them a while and/or slows them a good bit. And it's not even worth zerg blocking off against terran. Marauders rape any type of defense a zerg could set up.

    Anyway, there isn't a need to get into further details. The point is that terran is far from weak even in the most mediocre of hands.

    That's quite ironic because I think protoss is the easiest race to destroy when I'm zerg. Now, if you keep messing up then protoss can end up slaughtering zerg, but from my experience that's pretty much never been the case.

    I believe that terran really is imbalanced. Perhaps not against protoss, but playing against zerg it's like impossible for terrans to lose. Only terrans I've beat are ones that are very crappy.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2010
  9. HellsAn631

    HellsAn631 Master Guru

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    i don't think that is a game issue, i only thing its a player issue. As zerg, against a meching Terran, you really need to abuse the terrans i mobility and make a few drops here and there.

    idra has done decently against meching terrans.

    here is a a video to watch on how to beat a really good Terran when they go mech.

    http://day9tv.blip.tv/file/3732380/
     

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