SOS Pullin' my hair out, why can't I set monitor to 10-bit with XPS 9575 (Intel HD630/Vega M GL 870)

Discussion in 'Laptops & Notebooks' started by Arthur Aardvark, Oct 4, 2020.

  1. Arthur Aardvark

    Arthur Aardvark New Member

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    Hey all, so I just got my HP z27x G2, all giddy in anticipation for the wonders of 10-bit color (half joking, can't imagine it's night and day haha). Unfortunately, for whatever reason, my XPS will not let me. And I am at wits' end. After spending 8+ hours scouring the internet to resolve the issue, I threw a hailmary in desperation, knowing AMD and Dell Support wouldn't do/know jack diddley. Of course, they just told me to go ask for the other company's help...

    So I came here because generally speaking, Guru3D definitely tends to be the most knowledgeable community, leagues above Tom's Hardware and Reddit.

    Didn't know this until an hour ago, but apparently the Intel HD 630 supports 10 bit. So that may be the path of least resistance (but obviously my Intel Graphics settings didn't offer a 10 bit option). I thought only the dGPU, Vega 870, was capable.

    So prior to this revelation, I was trying to figure a workaround, stumbled upon a dGPU passthrough - not even sure if that's accurate, basically wanted to force the monitor to use the Vega as the display adapter (I know that technically you're stuck with whatever is assigned to the physical connection of the port you use, but seemed the passthrough works).

    I also contacted AMD because I figured that there may be some capability to do the aforementioned under the display tab...that's conveniently missing in my laptop's Adrenalin 20.4.1. Could I set the dGPU to be the display adapter + 10 bit in that tab? And if so, do y'all think that is the easiest solution? Mind you, I uninstalled/reinstalled the Adrenalin drivers with DDU, it did provide me with the "Video" tab which was missing the first time I downloaded 20.4.1. I saw some workarounds but I'm wondering what is the easiest/best way to get that tab.

    Another route I figured I'd try is fiddling with my bios/UEFI but Dell has the peripherals/display adapter settings disabled of course. If having those options would do the trick, is there some .exe or script out there that can enable them? (...that won't likely brick my system lol)

    And finally, I stumbled upon that Radeon Mod Utility, will probably just need to go to that thread to ask, but could that resolve my issue?

    I pray that someone has a solution for me, because, sadly, I can't afford an external graphics card or a desktop for the time being.

    Y'anyways, thanks for reading/the help! I apologize for all my rambling and hope this is the best subforum for this Q. Wasn't sure since it encapsulates many different topics.
     
  2. DannyD

    DannyD Ancient Guru

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    make sure to use high speed /quality cable.
     
  3. Arthur Aardvark

    Arthur Aardvark New Member

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    Ah, good point. It is just a run-of-the-mill USB C to USB C, alt mode (DP 1.2, monitor doesn't support 1.4, sigh). I'll look into that. I'm thinking I'll grab a high quality Thunderbolt 3 to T3 cable (though the monitor is just USB-C 3.1, but never know when it may come in handy in the future). Thanks!
     
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  4. DannyD

    DannyD Ancient Guru

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    For sure, a good cable is a good investment!:)
     

  5. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    Even with a poor cable you can test 10 bit colour, at lower res.
    Change to 10bit colour in your gfx cards control panel, not the monitor.

    If running at UHD (4K) with HDMI 2.0 you will not get 10bit option available when using RGB.
    You must use YcBcR 4:2:2 or 4:2:0 to reduce the bandwidth enough for 10bit to fit down.
    This can make the desktop look a bit smudged because the colour is compressed (thats what 4:2:2 and 4:2:0 modes are).
    10bit mode is for HDR. Unless displaying HDR content theres not much point using it due to the potentially reduced colour quality.
    Movies are already 4:2:0 so no problem there and games you probably wont notice the quality drop.
    Your display might even do HDR with 8 bit RGB, mine does (Samsung Q9FN TV)

    Changing to 10bits per colour in the display control panel, you wont see any difference on the desktop other than the 4:2:2/4:2:0 reduced colour quality perhaps, because only HDR material will extend the range of colours with higher brightness.
    NOTE: Changing to 10bit colour does NOT enable HDR, it simply gives you the same range of colours using 30bit resolution instead, you dont get an extended colour range.
    Either the program/game you are using will enable HDR for the game/movie or you might have to enable HDR in windows.
    If you enable HDR in Windows it can look gaudy, because the Windows desktop colours are not HDR ready, but it readies the system for HDR use.
    All the windows setting is for is to enable HDR for games / movies.

    ps ycbcr stuff posted for people using HDMI 2.0 at UHD res. You dont need it with DP 1.2 upward and HDMI 2.1, they both have enough bandwidth to set 10bit with RGB.
    But... you might need DP1.4 for HDR to work. I know some older NVidia cards have a DP1.4 update for this reason, my 1080ti needed this to use a DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.0b adapter with HDR.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2020
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  6. Arthur Aardvark

    Arthur Aardvark New Member

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    Well, I'm actually only using 1440p on a 27" monitor. So I should be able to use 10 bit for that with a USB-C Displayport alt mode in 1.2. However, I found out that MS only lets you set 10 bit via their settings if you have HDR enabled (...and unfortunately this monitor isn't HDR). Which leaves me to utilize Intel's software, and at least with the Graphics Command Center, there is no option for 10 bit. And from my research, it sounds like they don't have that out yet - but plan to implement it...I think they had said that back in May. I'm using their UHD 27.20 drivers which was just released 9/29. I imagine Dell's drivers would be the same (as far as the actual GFX drivers/software goes, maybe they have some kind of proprietary graphics/video support driver/software that'd help, I'll have to look into it).

    So I did find out some things - RadeonMod allows 10 bit to be turned on. Still would need to figure out how to force the monitor to utilize my Vega as the display adapter. I don't think that's possible. I imagine asking in the RadMod thread is my best bet with that.

    I got my Thunderbolt 3 to T3 cable today and that hasn't made a difference. Although, that certainly rules out the issue of a crappy cable/the potential lack of bandwidth (tho I suppose if my monitor is bottlenecking the T3 since it's only a Type-C 3.1 port, it isn't going to get that extra bandwidth.)

    Lastly, I found a program that *should* force my monitor to run in 10-bit - CRU (Custom Resolution Utility). I don't know if the settings it affects would show up in the Display Settings (it's still showing as 8 bit in there). Plus, I was having issues accessing the start menu after I made the changes until I restarted it, so maybe the settings didn't take effect correctly.

    So if Dell/3rd party Intel management software/RadMod/CRU don't work, I'm going to throw in the towel sadly. Don't know what I'll purchase, when I have the $$$, to make this work. Either an external graphics card or a desktop with a damn AMD gfx card (I think nvidia would work too).

    Edit: Forgot to mention one strange thing in my device manager. Under monitors the HP DreamColor z27x is there, however, under "Other Devices" there's also an "HP Monitor z31x/z27x-g2" that is not installed properly. Maybe this has something to do with it? I don't think so.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  7. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    Without HDR, you arent missing anything.
    You will not see a difference because only HDR material makes use of more than 8 bits, unless you are creating/editing images etc using 10bit media.
    Without HDR, the spread of colours is exactly the same using 8 bit and 10 bit, 10bit is no more vibrant.
    The only difference will be finer gradation between colours when working with 10bit (none HDR) material.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  8. Arthur Aardvark

    Arthur Aardvark New Member

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    That's the problem, I'm using this for graphic design so I can definitely use 10 bit. That's making me question my purchase, though. Decided to cheap out with the HP z27x-g2 when I could've spent double on the Asus ProArt 32UC - with 4K, HDR (1000 nits) + Local Dimming. But I thought 32" is too big (and may still need to upscale text) and wouldn't want to sit in front of it at 1000 nits. But it also has Thunderbolt 3 ports, which means I'd definitely have no trouble with the input, and couldn't have known before that it would've been such an easy setup compared to this...10 bits would've just been a click of a button. I could still return this and get that. The only downside, besides spending another $500, is that it's contrast ratio is worse than the HP z27x (1000:1 vs 1500:1).

    But an update, I stumbled upon this software called madvr - seems people typically use it for video playback, but as far as I can tell, it controls/overrides your graphics settings/software so it should allow 10 bit! Fingers crossed it works. If it doesn't, definitely going to return this and go with the Asus PA32UC.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2020
  9. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    MadVR can only use what is already presented by the video driver.
    It allows HDR flags to be sent to the display without HDR mode enabled in the OS, I use it in Windows 7 for HDR playback. But it requires you to have an HDR capable display otherwise the flags cannot have an effect.
     
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  10. Arthur Aardvark

    Arthur Aardvark New Member

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    Agh. That's annoying. I don't even know where I should ask this, but is there a Radeon Mod Utility for Intel GPUs? I scoured the internet, but unfortunately all the gamers overclocking their CPUs flooded the 10 or so results pages I looked through. I'm going to try again with "-CPU" but I have a feeling it won't make a difference.

    Honestly I'd have given up already but the 1 of 4 used Asus PA32UCs on the internet, the only one in my price range, sold :(. Giving up my dual monitor setup is harder than giving up crack - knowing I'll be without the PA32UC for weeks if not months.

    Edit: Realized I don't necessarily need a utility when I can do what Rad Mod does, edit the registry. Just a matter of finding the 10-bit control for the Intel GPU. I'm surprised that I can't find info on the web about that.

    Not confident, but it appears it may be under HKLM -> Current Control Set -> Control -> Video, however, so many options to sift through. When I looked up "BitsPerPixel" in regedit, nothing showed up, but that's the setting that needs to be changed, according to some random article I found. For W7 but can't imagine it's different for W10.

    Edit 2: I found some registry adds to make that supposedly enabled 10 bit, but they didn't do diddley. I'm waving the white flag. Time to find a PA32UC.
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2020

  11. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    I personally would go for a product that is better if possible, price is nearly always a factor though.
    However, you could get in touch with the mfr of your monitor, I'm sure they will help you resolve the problem.
     

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