Should MFAA be forced ON Globally? (Nvidia)

Discussion in 'Videocards - NVIDIA GeForce' started by BlindBison, May 4, 2019.

  1. BlindBison

    BlindBison Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,432
    Likes Received:
    1,156
    GPU:
    RTX 3070
    Hi there guys,

    My understanding is MFAA won't have any effect unless MSAA is enabled for the game in question.

    If MSAA is enabled for the game in question, it seems like using MFAA ON would be a given unless I'm missing something there.

    Provided my understanding here is correct, couldn't MFAA just be forced to ON globally in the control panel where it'll be harmless in games that you aren't using MSAA in, but helpful in games where you are using MSAA?

    Thanks for your time
     
  2. BlindBison

    BlindBison Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,432
    Likes Received:
    1,156
    GPU:
    RTX 3070
    EDIT:

    I've read in some forums that apparently MFAA can cause performance issues in some games due to disabling DirectX command list or some such. I've also read here and there that at fps lower than 60, it can in some cases cause pixelated/blurry frames.

    This was just in reddit comments though and I haven't seen a source on either of those yet so I'm uncertain what to think here really here especially given those were comments from a meaningful time ago. I have also read that MFAA could break Motion Blur, but again that was just in some forum comments so nothing concrete to note. Anyway, til I learn more, best to leave it off I suppose.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2019
  3. RealNC

    RealNC Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    5,327
    Likes Received:
    3,572
    GPU:
    4070 Ti Super
    Edit: What I wrote below is wrong. NVidia has enabled MFAA for most (all?) games using MSAA.


    Old post:
    The game supporting MSAA is not enough. The game itself must be explicitly supported. MFAA is not an automatic enhancement over MSAA. It needs to be implemented specifically for each game. And the list of games with MFAA support is very short:

    https://www.geforce.com/hardware/technology/mfaa/games

    In other words, it's a failed technology because it didn't take off. However, when you play one of the games that support it, and your GPU supports it, then you can enable it and see if you can improve performance by lowering MSAA from, say 8x to 4x and enabling MFAA. The theory is that MFAA should give you 8xMSAA quality but perform similar to 4x.

    Frankly, I never use it though. At 1440p, the difference between 8xMSAA and 4xMSAA is, at least for me, not detectable.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2021
    BlindBison likes this.
  4. Hulk12

    Hulk12 Master Guru

    Messages:
    310
    Likes Received:
    90
    GPU:
    Zotac RTX 4090 :D
    MFAA doesn't support your GeForce GTX 770M but yes mininum Maxwell (GeForce 900) or newer.
     

  5. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    17,097
    Likes Received:
    7,418
    GPU:
    GTX 1080ti
    You're referring to out of date information, there is no longer a restriction in the games it can be used with, if you can turn MSAA on in a game, it'll work. (There are some exceptions where it breaks games though)

    However,

    yes. it has been found on these very forums and other locations that MFAA reduces performance in different situations.

    It was tested just recently by a geforce forums user to drop FPS in Los Santos / GTA5 by 8 FPS.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2019
    fry178 likes this.
  6. RealNC

    RealNC Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    5,327
    Likes Received:
    3,572
    GPU:
    4070 Ti Super
    Never heard of this. Where is this documented?
     
  7. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    17,097
    Likes Received:
    7,418
    GPU:
    GTX 1080ti
  8. tsunami231

    tsunami231 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    14,777
    Likes Received:
    1,885
    GPU:
    EVGA 1070Ti Black
    I still have yet to even see MFAA in anygame I have I tried forcing it in come game I know that use MSAA but it never did anything I guess the game needing to support it explains why


    I never liked TAA ? there is supposedly newer verison TXAA ? supposedly fixed the weird effect TAA had on moving objects, which why I wont use TAA. I tried playing the Skyrim SE with TAA and and with in seconds of play the game with TAA I was like eww no,

    I still use FXAA for most part unless game actual support MSAA in which case I will use that but that rare thes days
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2019
  9. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    17,097
    Likes Received:
    7,418
    GPU:
    GTX 1080ti
    Game doesn't need to support it, but there are particular games which cannot use it because it will introduce issues.

    the idea was to set msaa to 2x, and get 4x like antialiasing at the performance of 2x.

    At high enough framerates it doesn't cause smearing.
     
    fry178 likes this.
  10. tsunami231

    tsunami231 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    14,777
    Likes Received:
    1,885
    GPU:
    EVGA 1070Ti Black
    well the guess my question would be is should I leave it on in Global? would that mean IF a game support MSAA, MFAA will take over and do it job? and if it dont support MSAA MFAA being on in global will do nothing?

    Cause like said when I tried to see what MFAA does in game that did support MSAA and had it on in CP I saw no diffrence at all. So I kind left on nvidia defualt with is off
     

  11. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    17,097
    Likes Received:
    7,418
    GPU:
    GTX 1080ti
    No, you should turn it on for particular games where you find if improves visuals and performance, alot of whats out now is cpu hungry and will suffer from having no command list support.
     
    fry178 likes this.
  12. tsunami231

    tsunami231 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    14,777
    Likes Received:
    1,885
    GPU:
    EVGA 1070Ti Black
    so only for indivual games that use MSAA, next time I play one of those game I will see if MFAA actual does someithng, last time I tried was back when I first got my 1060 and MFAA did nothing in any of the games that use MSAA only on I can remeber at this point was Swtor
     
  13. BlindBison

    BlindBison Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,432
    Likes Received:
    1,156
    GPU:
    RTX 3070
    Thank you for your replies, this has been very helpful!
     
  14. A M D BugBear

    A M D BugBear Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,475
    Likes Received:
    659
    GPU:
    4 GTX 970/4-Way Sli
    I usually have that turned off, If I inject any AA through nvidia inspector, Either SGSSAA or SS(IF the ingame AA is not enough for me).

    Always have it off, no need.
     
  15. fry178

    fry178 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,082
    Likes Received:
    382
    GPU:
    Aorus 2080S WB
    love when ppl tell others what they "should/shouldnt" with their hardware.

    i play less than 10 games at a time, right now i have 2 titles that support it, and just saw that F1 2012 supports it too, so turning it off would impact 30% of my games for no reason.
    the same way saying (globally) on is wrong, "always" off is the same.

    Nv had a MFAA guide with some side by side stuff and was listing the games that support it, but the link i had now opens their news segment.
    i remember mfaa will work with or without using other types of AA, and no matter what type (MSAA/TAA, but not FXAA/TXAA).
    meaning i can turn on MFAA, not use any other form of AA, and you should get MSAA quality with (almost) no performance hit.

    https://nvidia.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/3605/~/multi-frame-anti-aliasing-(mfaa)-supported-configurations-and-titles

    match it with the games your playing (GFE will list it under game optimizations if its supported),
    all others you can switch it to on and play a few min to see the impact on FPS.
    the only games i had trouble with are the console ports (NFS rivals/Ace Combat).

    i like that it usually doesnt make the image blurry, by the (different) way it works (pattern),
    removes aliasing better than without it, especially when i have enough HP to run it and/or games that are less demanding.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2022

  16. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    17,097
    Likes Received:
    7,418
    GPU:
    GTX 1080ti
    globally on is wrong.

    globally on will break not only command list, but prevent some dx12 titles from starting.
     
    Last edited: May 23, 2021
    Darren Hodgson likes this.
  17. RealNC

    RealNC Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    5,327
    Likes Received:
    3,572
    GPU:
    4070 Ti Super
    I know this is an old topic and nobody cares about MFAA anymore, but I wonder: what happens if you enable MFAA and use 8x MSAA in-game? Do you get something like 16x MSAA?
     
    BlindBison likes this.
  18. itpro

    itpro Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,364
    Likes Received:
    735
    GPU:
    AMD Testing
    Not really close. Different approach. But you do fight aliasing as hard as possible.
     
  19. SpookySkeleton

    SpookySkeleton Member Guru

    Messages:
    153
    Likes Received:
    23
    GPU:
    RTX 3090
    Damn this MFAA stuff, haven't heard of it in a long time, the most useless AA techique i've ever seen, i remember the hype, just to be compatible with a few games (glad team fortress 2 was one of them).

    This thing was the reason dlss wasn't so well received at the beggining, bad memories, glad nvidia did not let dlss die and did a great job with the new versions.
     
  20. BlindBison

    BlindBison Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,432
    Likes Received:
    1,156
    GPU:
    RTX 3070
    For me it depends on the TAA implementation. Some games like Final Fantasy 15 have very poor TAA implementations whereas something like DOOM Eternal's TAA looks pretty awesome to my eye.

    This is something Digital Foundry talked about quite sometime ago iirc in their motion blur video where very early attempts at TAA had a load of issues. These days in the more modern solutions it seems that many of those problems have been considered so you can have an AA solution with a modest perf cost and quite good coverage with only minor downsides to sharpness for example, but it really depends on the game and implementation.

    For me, I find if I have to choose I prefer a softer image with little to no aliasing to a sharp, but aliased one (although ideally you'd have a sharp image with no aliasing -- I can't wait to move up to true 4K in time).

    Nvidia DSR exists, but I have two primary issues with it:
    1) Some UI elements end up looking super wonky in my experience (for example the RTSS overlay if you scale it up just goes to crap visually when using DSR seems to me)
    2) whenever I close the game, windows then reverts to native resolution and all my windows get mucked up in terms of size and placement and don't stay where I had put them which is just annoying I find.

    I guess another potential problem I struggle with for DSR would be I have a tough time getting the balance of DSR smoothness right so I just gave up and use native rez now lol.
     

Share This Page