Samsung lowers prices for 970 EVO and PRO SSD considerably

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, May 7, 2018.

  1. Hilbert Hagedoorn

    Hilbert Hagedoorn Don Vito Corleone Staff Member

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  2. Aekold

    Aekold Active Member

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    Lowering prices is always a good thing (for us consumers, anyway)! Especially on the pricier NVMe SSDs, which trend at roughly 2x the price of the SATA variety.

    Do you think this was caused by lowering memory prices, poor demand for the old pricing model, or both?
     
  3. EL1TE

    EL1TE Master Guru

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  4. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    I am eyeing M.2. With that in mind, Cheapest 500GB SATA3 SSD cost tiny bit more than cheapest M.2 500GB SSD with And they perform about same. Apparently that would be waste of bandwidth M.2 slot offers.
    So, cheapest good upgrade in speed is Kingston A1000 w/ 1500/900MBps r/w costing 27% more than that cheapest 500GB 2.5'' SATA3 SSD. That's very reasonable.

    And for that I think that in my situation:
    128GB SSD for OS
    240GB SSD for Games
    500GB HDD for Games where loading speed is not needed
    500GB HDD for Projects / Data
    ...
    Getting 500GB M.2 SSD with at least 3 times higher read speeds with only 27% price premium is very good investment for cases where speed may be important for quality of life.
    Same goes for 1TB M.2 where 1500/1000MBps r/w comes with only 29% premium over cheapest SATA3 1TB SSD.
    (Fun part here is that while mentioned MX500 costs reasonably less than faster M.2... EVO 850/860 cost about same without delivering speed.)
     

  5. heffeque

    heffeque Ancient Guru

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    I'd compare random read/write speeds, definitely not sequential speeds. There's barely no workload that actually uses sustained sequential reads XOR sustained sequential writes.
     
  6. vbetts

    vbetts Don Vincenzo Staff Member

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    Jesus I'm still rocking an 850 EVO, not even M2! I need to change that quickly.
     
  7. Humanoid_1

    Humanoid_1 Master Guru

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    A while back I saw some guy over at oc.net forums who did a big test of SSD performance with a focus also on game load times.

    Ranging from a control mech HDD, SATA SSDs and M.2 also, sad thing was that games showed almost Zero load time improvement going from SATA SSD to a fast M.2. Apparently something to do with the way they are all made is holding them back massively.

    I'm still interested in one for non-gaming purposes, but I really wanted it for games and sad to say it is totally not worth it for them :(
     
  8. Kaarme

    Kaarme Ancient Guru

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    What are you saying? Samsung lowered the prices because Hilbert told them the prices are too high. Samsung just did what they were told to do. How would they dare to disobey?
     
  9. jdc2389

    jdc2389 Member Guru

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    I honestly think they lowered prices because they were seeing too much competition this time around from Western Digital's new Black g2 m.2 which offered really good perf and was a bit cheaper too. I think there were a few alternatives that were competing as well.
     
  10. Hapatingjaky

    Hapatingjaky Active Member

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    These still are not available in Canada as they do not appear on Newegg.ca, Amazon.ca and MemoryExpress' site....
     

  11. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    That's likely effect of compressed data files. Heavier compression, higher CPU bottleneck vs storage bottleneck.
    I think that today, in time where games are 40GB+ and people still buy them, developers should move from heavy compression favoring HDD and take lighter compression approach favoring SSDs. Then M.2 will see some bigger benefit.

    Then there is single to multiple data files access. Many games use single bigger data file and single file handler thread. Very good for HDD as read is then more sequential. On other hand SSD can't care less and queuing multiple files for simultaneous access brings benefits if CPU can handle loaded data.

    Coding something to have maximum benefit from M.2 reading 3GB/s would kill HDD performance. So middle of the road is best, or having 3 code paths which would handle loading based on 'mini' IOPs+read speed benchmark.
     
  12. Kaarme

    Kaarme Ancient Guru

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    If a game takes 50GB of space, it's not strongly compressed. Lighter compression doesn't really favour SSDs because SSDs are small. Traditional HDDs are many times larger for the same price. Studios began to favour light compression and obscene disk space requirements when HDDs became large and affordable. Then came the small SSDs, but the studios apparently never noticed.
     
  13. Agent-A01

    Agent-A01 Ancient Guru

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    The issue is not that.

    It's due to several reasons.

    Most game files are packaged into certain formats that are composed of many small files.
    Since most assets aren't large contiguous files, there is not much benefit from M.2.

    M.2 is much faster on sequential/write IOs but not much faster if at all on small file IOs, i.e. 4k and less.

    A lot of those budget NVMe M.2s are actually slower in small IOs and have poorer read/write latency which is why they can be slower than a fast regular SATA drive such as an 850/60 PRO/evo.

    Only the top M.2s are really good in smaller IOs, i.e new 970 Pro/evo can do >70mb/s 4k random and top SSDs are around 40-50 max.
    Those will do better than most SSDs, not the budget M.2s.
     
  14. -Tj-

    -Tj- Ancient Guru

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    This one is interesting too, very high capabilities for just 60€ more vs that Kingston a1000
    https://www.integralmemory.com/product/ultimapro-x-m2-2280-pcie-nvme-ssd


    or this, even better
    https://geizhals.eu/sandisk-extreme....html?hloc=at&hloc=de&hloc=eu&hloc=pl&hloc=uk

    or 1TB, somewhat cheap for 340€ with very high spec
    https://geizhals.eu/samsung-ssd-pm9....html?hloc=at&hloc=de&hloc=eu&hloc=pl&hloc=uk


    :D I modded my Z87 to support nvme drives (injected driver into uefi), will test something too soon,.
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2018
  15. The Goose

    The Goose Ancient Guru

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    I have a Samsung 960pro 512gb with my most used games on including Ets2+Promods and rusmap mods, Farcry5, GR Wildlands and SGW3, the loading time difference between my 960pro and my Sandisk UltraII ssd is like comparing night and day, Ets2+Promods and rusmap mods can take 2-3 mins on my Sandisk but on my 960pro....less than a minute.
     

  16. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    Bingo
    It's quite difficult to implement a multithreaded resource loader safely.
     
  17. Biffo

    Biffo Member

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    If you want noticeable speed bumps you are going to have to implement intels cache mechanism, then it won't matter what ssd you use, the cache itself is just blazing fast.
     
  18. nizzen

    nizzen Maha Guru

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    In many scenarios, loading of programs/games is bottlenecked by the cpu. Look at loading of new maps in BF 1 in taskmanager. It's using all cpu threads 100%. Even on my 7980xe :D 36 threads...
     
  19. Agent-A01

    Agent-A01 Ancient Guru

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    I have BF1 and can't confirm that 100% usage.

    Bottleneck is elsewhere on my side.
     
  20. Humanoid_1

    Humanoid_1 Master Guru

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    That is good to hear. I made a decent effort to find the article I mentioned, but came up empty. The selection of modern games he tested did not scale at all well from SATA to high performing NVMe M.2 drives sadly.

    I did find another game that showed some decent improvement though:

    CoD Infinite Warfare:
    WD Red Pro 4TB = 53 secs
    Cruciak MX 300 525GB = 25secs
    Samsung 960 EVO 500GB = 11secs

    It sounds from what you are reporting that more games are getting better coded to take advantage of the speed offered by modern M.2 drive, makes me feel much better about the future :)



    As an aside, I did learn something interesting though: Games showing a steady 60fps, but running off a HDD will repeat frames (hitching) while waiting for map/wolrd data to load.

    As a test of this in an fps game they timed running from one side of a map to the other, the HDD was a full 5 seconds slower than the game run on an SSD.
     

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