Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Mar 1, 2019.
Dat 8k pricing is ridiculous.
Evidence is all over the internet, Samsung has a bad rep for specific hardware issues.... check the biggest net forum I think it's called AV forum...
As for my personal evidence is I've somehow been ending up with Samsung TV's for the past 10 years I guess you could say unknowingly as I was never a big TV guy, was more into PC's. and EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM HAS BROKEN DOWN hardware wise.....
and I just started realizing it with the last 2 tv's because the repairs were in the hundreds of dollars.
It was specifically the motherboard, and when I brought it to repair shop the owner already knew what was wrong with it as soon as I told him the brand and issue over the phone. Told me he sees it all the time with Samsungs more so than any other brand, something about them cheaping out on some capacitors or whatever....
So the way I would word it best is they work fine for about 2-4 years, but when they crap out, they crap out HARD.
And my Best Buy experience when going through the whole ordeal was Sony's flew off the shelves really fast, while Samsungs sit, even at heavily reduced prices.
My Sony TV died just after warranty period was over (dead panel), meanwhile I never had Samsung TV or monitor die. I also never had Samsung HDD or SSD die. I have family members who use Samsung TVs and monitors for 10+ years problem free.
Currently I have 4K 120Hz HDR10 FreeSync capable Samsung TV. Super happy with it.
how many ZERO people OLED that hadnt got burn-in ? more than 10 people ?
the OLED tech used still same despite difference naming just because patent/trademark, it wont change the fact that OLED is easily get image-retention and prone to burn-in due to material limitation
like in forbes article, all the maker acknowledge the burn-in issue
and what they do is putting dimming-algorithm (into the firmware) to prevent image-retention, burn-in specific area
IF maker such LG confident with OLED, they wont just giving 1year warranty for burn-in
thats LG, not sure if other brand like SONY even giving burn-in warranty
even apple saying its "expected-behavior" for their iphone x
well like what is said in https://www.avsforum.com/is-oled-burn-in-a-big-problem/
u buy OLED u know the risk(tech-limitation) of it, take it or not ur choice
I like the way you can buy a Samsung QLED television, connect it to your PC and run the Calman software to auto-configure/colour-correct the picture, instead of having to go to forums and read a lot of BS about what settings you 'should' be using, when all panels are different...
That's pretty cool.
Well, there are many questions buried in that, so I'll have to unpack this a little, if you'll forgive me.
"How many Screen that are used by pros in hollywood, are made by samsung, and how many are sony?"
That's tricky, as post production colour correction can be done in a variety of ways, using a variety of software. So if doing pure colour and NOT doing any editing, then you will use any 12 bit panel that is in the office. You may also use a Laser-Projected viewing room / suite, for executive viewing purposes, like' the director of the movie pays a visit.
Currently, this spot is held by Sony for the monitor - and the laser projector is pretty cutting edge, too - even the short-throw has good colour.
But, those are $20k+ products and, I think they are overpriced for what they actually are (LG panel with 12-bit calibration, or a/n other laser diode producer, plus a/v pass through)...plus some plastic. I understand they are needed, however, but...really?
Now, Samsung do not consider this market on their radar - I'll let you invent a reason as to why, but appear (no pun) to be very successful in all other industries, or, industries they choose to operate in.
So, when they enter that market, let's revisit this, shall we?
Whats your research worth against me using an actual OLED C6P as PC monitor since 2016? Burn-In is a myth. /The END
OLED is the current and micro LED is unknown future, so far they cant even do 55inch 4K model, these panels they have have set resolution and to create 4K resolution you need 70inch of screen space
Warranty depends on your local laws, there is no such thing as no warranty, its 1yr minimum and lots of times 3 years. [we have 3 years warranty for all LG products for example]
All electronic products have issues, all brands..... In this case I'm just stating facts about Samsung TV's having higher hardware failure rates than other brands. Now maybe that's because they move more units so = higher rates, or they actually make shitty hardware... You could draw some very quick conclusions by doing some quick research online, or talking to professionals in the field, or for example look at their recent phone hardware issues (exploding batteries) etc which says a lot about their manufacturing process.
And yes I have the Samsung NU8000 65' myself, so same thing as pretty much as whatever you listed, same specs.... And aside from a few annoyances I mentioned like the forced ADS, and pre-installed APPS you can't delete, and menu not properly saving settings, etc.... it serves it's purpose and I probably would have been happy with it, especially coming from a non smart 1080p LCD.
But having that Sony for about a month before the Samsung, it just makes the Samsung look like an entry level TV.
And the prices actually reflect that, as on release they were almost identical in price, but months afterwards the Samsungs were heavily discounted, so when I actually ended up exchanging my Sony for the Samsung, Best Buy actually gave me back $700 on the difference, because by then the Samsung had dropped so much in price. When I had bought them, the Sony was only slightly more expensive if I remember correctly.
A month or so after that, the Samsung had dropped another few hundred dollars.
I'm sorry to have to do this to you, but your belief is so resolute, I feel I must.
"Image retention is a myth?" you say...then why O why does Sony say this:
Why does LG say this:
I mean...really...truthfully...why would they spend all this time talking about something if it isn't real? They are covering their asses, because they know the tech is flawed beyond their ability to solve the problem.
And, some have linked AV forums, to which I very easily found a 120 page thread (since 2017, updated daily), replete with photos and nightmares stories:
The problem people mainly seem to be having is straight and simple: they cannot use the television the way they want to. They can't have anything with borders whether top/bottom, left/right. They can't have the contrast ratio set to how they want it. They can't have the sun shine on the teevee!
Now, no one is debating the quality of the image, just not agreeing with you on the very simple fact that organic matter deteriorates. You are saying it doesn't and that OLED is fault-free and perfect in every single way.
As I said in another thread: the manufacturers disagree with you.
That thread you posted is 99% posts of people telling the trolls to F off and that there is no issues.
How about you actually read what manufacturers say:
SONY: OLED displays may experience image retention if an image is continuously displayed for a long period of time.
LG: Burn-in and image retention are possible on virtually any display. However, with an LG OLED TV, any risk of burn-in or image retention have been addressed through the use of technology that not only helps protect against damage to the screen, but features self-healing properties so that any short-term image retention that may occur is quickly rectified. It is rare for an average TV consumer to create an environment that could result in burn-in. Most cases of burn-in in televisions is a result of static images or on-screen elements displaying on the screen uninterrupted for many hours or days at a time – with brightness typically at peak levels.
Lets do it your way
Samsung actually agrees that their TVs have Horizontal or Vertical Lines epidemic!
P.S. You also sound like your trolling when you decide to tell someone that actually owns a product and been using it for over 2.5 years that its not what it actually is based on "research" while I have it against my own eyes even now as I type this message and the TV is turned on every day for over 30 hours straight, thats right 30 hours.
I have one and game for hours at a time. No problems here....
Just need to be sure about what you're doing. No different than the good old plasmas from back in the day.
And for this who don't want to jump on an OLED that's a choice you made, but for us that do or did we will appreciate and enjoy the best picture quality money can buy.
If you watch enough of whatever on your tv to burn it in then you personally need to check more than just your viewing/playing shtuff....
Hundreds of hours on many games and hundreds of hours watching movies with and without borders and zero issues at all on my main OLED.
SURE if i watch the news like a pleb every day and drool over my sports with that bar screaming by every second on the top or bottom of the screen then sure i expect something to happen. Just like plasma would and does from years ago.... They had image retention tech built into them that you could visibly see working. Pixels just moving around themselves to save that image from burning in.
Samsung will not pry me away from Sony with those prices. Switched to Sony from Samsung three years back and have never missed a thing. (This is coming from someone who has bought at least 5 Samsung panels).
eh? I think you mean something else as there are only 24 hours in the day j/k
you cannot deny there is a problem with the technology. You just can't. The manufacturers know there is a problem. They list what you might want to try to alleviate the problem, hence; they know it's a problem. This also means you must use the teevee in a very specific way, and most certainly never use any content with a border (u/d or l/r) and if you do, you must use super-wide/zoom (in the case of Sony).
But...they cannot fix an inherent problem with the technology, yet will give a list of sound things to try to off-set this, but not solve it, because it cannot be solved.
Flat out denying it exists is your choice, but again: the manufacturers disagree with you.
I consider myself a techaholic as well as an Audiophile. I have had and owned Samsungs/LGs Sony's etc. Currenty I have a Samsung 9000 series in my living room and a Sony 950 in my basement I love both TVs and both have their own Pros and cons. Saying that because your OLED is great and has been great therefore any other reviews stating otherwise are "trolls" just shows how deep your bias are for your OLED. The equivalent of you saying that is like me saying my Range Rover got 280,000 miles on it and never was in the shop besides oil changes, so all Range Rovers are the best. It simple isn't a real world based assumption that can be made ….and neither is yours.
However I gota side with Looby here …… to the people saying OLED is much better and without flaw is quite simply false. I am on the market for new Tvs and will NOT be buying an OLED due to their many issues. Just looking on forums, as well as talking to people whom work for Geek Squad, and even a local Audio/Visual store they all point me away from OLED saying exactly what luggs stated. The picture quality cannot be matched, however when the panel dies in 6 months and is under warranty its typical to wait weeks or months for a replacement panel. The quality does in fact burn in and degrade. The argument that …. well on my OLED it hasn't therefore this must apply to all OLEDs is just not based in reality. Either the few of you on here won the equivalent of the silicon lottery or you are just not willing to admit that OLEDs have many flaws, but don't want to admit that due to the cash you dropped on it. When people making commission off of them steer you away from buying a $4000 OLED to a $1600-2500 LED there HAS to be many many reasons. And I will take the guy selling/servicing hundreds of TVs over some guy on a forum who has one OLED and thinks its magnificent. End of Story
regarding the pros using certain equipment: what i meant is the fact that they not only "know" what requirements the pros have,
but also can deliver a product that can do it, also allows them to use that knowledge to put into consumer stuff.
how many production cars (more than 25 made) are on the level of a Veyron? part the reason i'm not against buying/owning something similar like the Venom or the Koenigsegg equivalent,
but neither of the other 2 have the same kind of options/financials/hardware to choose from as VW.
why do you think the first Koenigsegg was flying of the track (Top Gear BBC) because it needed more downforce aka a rear wing? you think that would have happened if bugatti had designed it?
i never said that oleds dont have any burn ins, nor did i state that they dont have any issues.
they are made and meant to watch movies/shows and enjoying deep black/colors without the need to go with a projector/plasma.
its the customer that uses the oleds for something they arent made to do:
watch "regular" tv and/or gaming, that has lots of static information being displayed.
and the fact that we have multiple oleds running from 9-9 each day, showing the brand logo after each video, and the sonys showing 4K/HDR (or similar) in the upper right corner throughout almost every video,
yet after one year the sonys didnt have any problems with burn in or image retention (ppl even bought them), when the equivalent LG did have issues (where the LG logo was showing).
i sell them to ppl that use them exactly for that: watching movies, not the news.
so far (14 month) i neith had one coming back because of burnin,
nor anyone that bought one before i "took over" in the shop.
and to me (the store) selling 100-150 oleds/year is more than "one guy in the forum",
and in my view so far does not support "they have problems within 6 month" (when used properly)....
do you also think its the car makers fault, when someone wrecks their two door 600 HP RWD sports car while driving on a snowy road in alaska?
Appreciate the comments, again you must forgive me to unpack them a little bit.
RE: Hollywood Professional equipment.
The knowledge they acquire from professionals doesn't change the problems associated with OLED technology, especially with regards to colour-correction. The standards for colour-space are not set by Sony, they merely compute and calibrate their products for that market. Now, they may and probably do, listen intently to production houses for that market - but the colour science stops at the door of UHD Blue Ray, Blue Ray, DVD, broadcast - as the standards there are significantly different, and of lower 'value'.
Enter stage left: HDR10+, Dolby Vision, HLG, H264, H265, 4:2:2, 4:2:0 etc.
This is versus 4096x2160 DCI 4:4:4 projection quality you'd find at your nearest multi-plex, with a high possibility of the projector being Sony, canonically.
Again...it doesn't alter the issues of organic matter degrading - and Sony are the biggest drum-beaters, for trying to cover their rear ends on this.
RE: "They are made and meant to watch movies/shows and enjoying deep black/colors without the need to go with a projector/plasma. It's the customer that uses the OLEDs for something they aren't made to do: watch "regular" tv and/or gaming, that has lots of static information being displayed.
This is a shocking thing for me to read.
IF Sony were soooooo concerned with people watching movies, then why do they specifically say that you HAVE to switch your OLED teevee to super-zoom/wide, to ensure the whole screen is used, to off-set (not solve!) the problems of image retention and screen-burn?
Y'see? - they are basically telling you that you are not allowed to watch movies in the intended aspect ratio...so....how on earth can your opinion be stating that OLED is for movies, when they undermine the reproduction of the movie on the screen? I can't imagine going back to pan n scan. I really can't. Watching "The Dear Hunter" when DeNiro says 'this is this!' and having to see the picture either pan right to see he is referring to a bullet, or temporarily switch to 'wide' (I used to hate that) would be horrible.
Now...for you to tell someone what they can and cannot do on a television, telling them they are not allowed to watch anything other than movies (with super-zoom/wide) is just...draconian and overbearing.
What you might be accused of doing is telling people to get a projector - which is better than an OLED, as you can watch whatever you want, with a bigger screen. Now the reason I state this, people who really want the best home cinema will NOT buy an OLED, they will get a screen and a projector (probably Sony, good choice for projector tech) - not an OLED! If you are gonna put time and effort in building a really good home cinema setup, the last thing you are gonna do is put a teevee in the room!
Those two points are fallacious and better judgement prevails over them.
As for your production car analogy, well, it is reductive and I wouldn't wish to argue by analogy - I have always found it self-pandering and a clunky way to satisfy the person making it, and the person receiving it. In other words, you can come off as not having a real point, so you argue by analogy and try to reduce the argument. It's a close cousin of the Straw man fallacy. I happen to think that cars should not have the ability to exceed the speed limit. With SAT NAV and microcontrollers, it isn't that hard to limit the speed of a vehicle, and would strongly support such a decision anywhere in the world to enforce manufacturers to cut-off engine output. But that is another topic.
Every numbskull thinks they are Ayrton Senna in a high performance car, and try to drive accordingly, kinda like...every numbskull with $1000 thinks that by buying a 50inch OLED, they are going to be transported into the cinema...nope. The colour values of cinema projection far far far outweigh the reproduction of any compressed blueray movie. Sorry.
So, if you want to watch perfect quality movies, go to the cinema and pay your money.
If you want a television to do whatever you want to do with no restrictions on the content you want to display on it - do not buy an OLED.
If you want the best home cinema experience, get a projector (again, probably Sony - Laser) and whilst doing that, get a complete A/V solution and a third mortgage.
My points have been made, I don't really think I need to expand any further, but if you want to take this off-line, or start a thread elsewhere, then PM me the link and I'll congregate accordingly.
Wasn't meant for you really I was replying to Fallout as he keeps saying over and over his OLED is amazing , no issues and no burn in, so therefore any article that states otherwise is some "troll" or some misinformed idiot. While also insinuating that OLED is better and people who dont buy them just cant afford them. I find that assumption to be hilarious , considering in my gaming room alone I have tens of thousands of pop culture stuff, If i wanted one I would buy one. T o assume one couldn't afford a LG OLED and therefore "trolls" on review websites and A/V forums is just asinine.
"You also sound like your trolling when you decide to tell someone that actually owns a product and been using it for over 2.5 years that its not what it actually is based on "research" while I have it against my own eyes even now as I type this message and the TV is turned on every day for over 30 hours straight, thats right 30 hours." ….. again with the bias. Stating that its not actual research because YOU have done your own research by watching one television. Lets not even consider actual research, standard deviations etc. Since your TV is the gold standard of OLEDs, every other OLED produced must be the exact same. Without resorting to personal attacks your whole basis for argument is so fundamentally flawed its amusing. Not sure if you are that bias, trolling or dense.
So you are a pleb for watching the news every day? XD
In that case i am a pleb, and im glad that i choose to not get an oled - zero image rentention of the news chanel logo etc
Just an opinion I have because how much good comes of the news. "Riiiiiiiight.....?!?" They really like to put them spins as to what you hear/read in regards to which channel you watch, so i choose to watch none as I've lived enough of it personally...
I suppose some countries are worse than others in this regard