Radeon VGA + Geforce Physx works on XP but not on Vista

Discussion in 'Videocards vs General Purpose - NVIDIA Ageia PhysX' started by janos666, Aug 15, 2008.

  1. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    Radeon VGA + Geforce Physx works on XP and Win7 but not on Vista

    I found a little workaround to enable hardware accelerated Geforce-Physx on a secundary card next to a primary Radeon VGA. It works on XP. But I can not do anything with Vista (and Vista is my primary OS). But there should be a way...

    Screenshots and results: (Yes, I know that 8500GT is a slow **** but I did not want to buy a cheaper test VGA until I find the way to use it on Vista. So results are low but it works, better then simple CPU mode)


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    But there is a little problem with Vista. It does not enable to work two cards at the same time (with different drivers).


    [​IMG]


    Is there any idea? (Because this hybrid system can work physically in crossfire or SLI motherboards. There is no any software or hardware limitation in XP.)



    Here is the workaround:
    Remove any VGA drivers. Put your secund card to your motherboard and connect your monitor to both cards. (DVI for Radeon and D-SUB for geforce)
    Install both VGA drivers with device manager and install Physx software.
    Reboot.
    Set your Geforce card (I mean "assigned display" but it is a shorter definition) as primary display (use your monitor's OSD to navigate between Windows desktops). (Reboot -not necessary but may be needed...)
    Open Physx properties and select geforce physx, hit apply. - DO NOT CLOSE.
    Select your Radeon as primary display adapter. - Do NOT reboot or close any panel.
    Select No acceleration - DO NOT APPLY -, select Geforce acceleration again and hit apply now.
    You can close every control panel... Geforce physx now works and radeon card is your primary renderer device. Do some benchmark! :nerd:

    For display selection: Hit right mouse buttom on desktom and choose the last menu. Select the last tab. Here you are. Use the drop down menu.

    UPDATE 2009/06/10: You can find some useful info about new drivers and applications at the foot of the page2. (Mirror's Edge, Cryostasis, Win7 RC1, ect... -> All of the works!)
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2009
  2. thales100

    thales100 Master Guru

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    Cool , hope its possible to have this hybrid system in Vista too.
     
  3. thales100

    thales100 Master Guru

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    sry stupid post :wanker:
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2008
  4. Mannerheim

    Mannerheim Ancient Guru

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    Voodoo2 cards go into sound xxxxxxxxxxxx in Device manager.
    Maybe if it woud be possible to put physX in there ?

    Just longshot quess =)
     

  5. Luka_Aveiro

    Luka_Aveiro Member

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    Vista requires the exact same driver to manage all graphics devices, in order to guarantee the closest fail-safe experience to users.

    No way you are going to install 2 different drivers to manage 2 different graphics devices on the same Vista system.

    The OS just doesn't allow you to do it.
     
  6. Black_ice_Spain

    Black_ice_Spain Ancient Guru

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    aka try to disable that protection =)!
     
  7. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    That is the trick that I search. :pc1:

    Any idea? I did not get good results with custom forceware drivers. (I tryed to change the device class ID to soundcard or Ageia Physx card but Vista is not stupid. I will try a Tesla ID or something.)
     
  8. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    Ok. I rode some WDDM documentation and I wrote an E-mail to microsoft.
    Any idea how I can disable this WDDM limitation and run two different VGA drivers at the same time?
    Microsoft said it should works if I force to install XP drivers. (endless number of different XPDM drivers work, but two WDDMs or WDDM+XPDM is blocked) Ok, I tryed. 8500GT work with XP-x64 drivers (not fine but works), but 4870 can not start with Catalyst-XP-x64. I thought but I tryed, it is not a possible way. (And we need WDDM for DX 10 so...)
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2008
  9. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    I ran out of ideas.
    What is the situation with Windows 7 milestone/pre-alpha builds? Do they allow different WDDMs?
    And I forgot about Severs 2008. It uses the same kernel and driver modell but it may have less restrictions...
    If someone know windows 7.0 or server2008 well then tell me what the situation is with them...

    EDIT:

    OK. I learned that Server 2008 has the same restrictions. But Windows 7.0 will allow different VGA drivers again. :) Cool. I only need a leaked x64 version (I found only x86). :3eyes:
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2008
  10. chispy

    chispy Ancient Guru

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    That is awsome dude , i will try to run my 8800Ultra as a ppu and my 4870x2 as primary card when fedex deliver my new 4870x2 next week.
     

  11. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    Ok. Here is my new screenshots. I said I will prove that we can run two different WDDM drivers at the same time if we really want it. :)


    These are not fakes. But there is a relatively big problem with them. No, not photoshop, these are real, untached screenshots (captured with printscreen and saved with paint). Benchmark ran with hardware accelerated Physx and different WDDM drivers. I let you tip about the problem. :nerd:



    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2008
  12. chispy

    chispy Ancient Guru

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    Can you run 3DMark Vantage ?and tell whats the problem is?, tx a lot for sharing.

    chispy.
     
  13. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    As you wish:

    [​IMG]

    I should overclock this 8500GT somehow. :)

    Your secund question will be answered by this screenshot (check out the watermark on the right-down corner).
     
  14. scratch42069

    scratch42069 Member Guru

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    Having the ability to run multiple WDDM drivers is going to be real handy in Windows 7.
     
  15. mehdi

    mehdi Maha Guru

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    Very nice janos666 so you have to install nvidia drivers and physx drivers to get gforce physx working it wont work with just physx drivers?And how did you get this working on vista?
     

  16. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    Read the topic more heartily. It works on Windows 5 (XP) and Windows 7 (Vienna?) but it does not work on Windows 6 (Vista). And you need the WDDM device drivers (both forceware and catalyst - this causes the problem with Vista).
     
  17. c[00]LsPoT!

    c[00]LsPoT! New Member

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    @ janos666

    Thank you for trying this whole thing.
    I' ve bought a 8500GT for PhysX yesterday. :-D
    But I forgot this crappy WDDM-XPDM-WTF-THING. :)
    I got Vista x64.

    PS: What do you think of a modified VGA Bios?
    Could a modified bios run the 8500GT as a Physx-card or soundcard?

    greetings (I'm sorry for my english! :)

    c[00]LsPoT!
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2008
  18. c[00]LsPoT!

    c[00]LsPoT! New Member

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    Ok. Ithink a modified vga-bios wouldn't work.
    I hope, that Microsoft will fix this WDDM thing someday. :-(

    greetings

    c[00]LsPoT!
     
  19. janos666

    janos666 Master Guru

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    I tryed a lot of thing to use it under Vista x64.
    - Modded forceware (forced detection as a soundcard, ripped display specific entries/files - it has to work as a video adapter, you have to extend your windows desktop to it's monitor!!! - but it can not even start that way).
    - I replaced Vista's PlugAndPlay Device Enumerator files with .dll and .sys files from Windows 7.
    - Lot of various attemps (soft and hard).
    Nothing worked.

    I sold my 8500GT. I will buy a 8600GTS when there are a new Windows 7 leak with 64-bits or an interesting new game with Physx.

    *** Yes. After some tests I changed my recommendation from 8500GT to 8600GT (with overclocking too).

    Warmonger runs smooth with 8500GT but there is some FPS drop (min FPS is about 45). But Unreal Tournament 3 can not run smoot with an overclocked 8500GT (min FPS is about 33 which is noticable in this fast FPS game).

    An overclocked 8500GT is a little faster then an Ageia Card (as I thought when I bought it) but this is not enought for games if you have a fast primary VGA card.
     
  20. Wes Barfog

    Wes Barfog Member

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    ohnoes

    Janos, i tried your walktrought ( on xp ) but it's not working ...
    When i'm using my 8800 GTS as primary renderer, geforce physx enabled, i got a score of more than 3300 o3mark

    When I activate the HD 4850 as primary display, geforce physx enabled, fluid marks runs in software physx :(, and i get only 1200 o3 mark

    Here's a sshot :
    [​IMG]

    Any idea how to solve this issue ?
     

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