Qnix V Tempest V Catleap LPS/IPS overclockable Panels

Discussion in 'General Hardware' started by Vengeful#1, Oct 27, 2013.

  1. Vengeful#1

    Vengeful#1 Member Guru

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    I am in need of some opinions here guys, i wanna make the leap into 1440p via a PLS or IPS panel and cannot decided which to choose. Cost is a factor to a degree, as i don't want to pay big $$ for a technology that is kinda new and will be improved upon within the immediate future.

    What im basically after is a good quality panel with the ability to overclock, i would like to be able to hit the magic 120hz mark if possible for gaming purposes while still retaining excellent IQ.

    The panel that has caught my attention big time currently is the Qnix QX2710 evolution II, but from what i've read its a bit hit or miss getting a good panel even though most seem to be good OCer's but on the other hand they are also priced competitively.

    I also considering the Tempest X270OC which has a lot of good features but after seeing one in action im not sold on a few things with it..mainly the shipping fee's to get one here (AU) and the the way it displays certain colors looks a bit flattish to me?..i have one of these upstairs that belongs to my house mate.

    Finally there is the Catleap? which seems like a variant of the the LG IPS panel which the Tempest monitors use and slightly cheaper then the Tempest.

    Thoughts, idea's, Opinion's, welcome!
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2013
  2. thatguy91

    thatguy91 Ancient Guru

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    As I said in another thread recently, a friend of mine is basically disappointed with their catleap. It just doesn't jump out at you when playing games, he thought my BenQ GW2760HS was better in game. Photos are good too! His monitor does make the desktop look good though. However, power use is quite high on them, his monitor runs quite hot even at 60 Hz, mine is cool to the touch. His monitor can only do 65 Hz too. Mine is at 72 Hz, which is actually within specs.

    Other concerns is warranty. I'm not saying they're bad, just it's a hit and miss, especially with overclockability.
     
  3. yasamoka

    yasamoka Ancient Guru

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    I'd venture to say that all Qnix QX2710s are good overclockers; it's just the users, some are good overclockers and some are meh :D

    Almost all can hit 96Hz, where there is no need for tightening timings, GPUs can push that easily, and cables can take that easily. Above 96Hz, you get into high pixel clocks where you might want to switch the DVI port you're using (slight variance, not very important), change out cables for one that can OC (there can be quite some variance between cables, thicker = useless and shorter = better), AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, tighten your timings to stay at or below 450MHz which is the native capability of the EP269 display controller used in all these Korean monitors.

    Now for some comparisons, the Catleaps that can OC are horribly overpriced. The Overlord Tempest is S-IPS, overclockable, good US warranty, fair price, mostly out of stock. Overlord Computers don't offer pixel perfect option anymore I think, and you might want to check if their policy towards getting an A- or A grade panel (by choice) is now different.

    The Qnix QX2710 is PLS which has a higher contrast ratio and slighty more vibrant colors (due to a slightly larger color gamut). Many prefer PLS to IPS, but it can be a matter of opinion.

    Overclocking the Qnix introduces the following side effects:

    1) Panel brightness uniformity: seems to be an issue when the pixel clock is (quite) above 450MHz.
    @60Hz default timings, @96Hz default timings, @110Hz default timings (443MHz), and @110Hz tightened timings (~420MHz), there are no brightness uniformity issues (measured 15 spots on the screen with a Spyder4 colorimeter).

    2) Image retention: seems very variable, partly due to different overclocks, timings, and usage patterns (I don't keep my monitor on for a few hours on the same image doing nothing, that's just wasteful, but I do work hours at a time on Word documents, programming, powerpoint presentations). Can happen anywhere above 60Hz, even @96Hz or with tightened timings. Goes away once you set it back to 60Hz and leave it there for a while.

    Image retention (temporary) does NOT equal burn-in (permanent). LCDs do not suffer from burn-in except if the display has poor electronics and has been left for days or months on the same image (example, a widescreen TV running 4:3 content for months or years, had that happen to me, probably fixable).

    Getting image retention? Set Desktop @ 60Hz and games @ 120Hz. Games do not (seem to) introduce any image retention due to their variable nature. I've not seen anybody get image retention on games, even if you think that HUD elements in-game can induce image retention.

    I don't get any image retention. The monitor's been with me for 25 days and I've been using 110Hz for about a week or more, even on desktop.

    3) Gamma shift; Unavoidable, even with low overclocks or tightened timings. My gamma results are:
    ~2.09 at 60Hz
    ~2.6 at 96Hz
    ~2.93 at 110Hz tightened timings (~420MHz)
    ~3.03 or 3.08 at 117Hz tightened timings (~450MHz)

    They can be corrected by calibration or jacking up the brightness / gamma setting in Nvidia CP / CCC (not as accurate). There are many ICC profiles for 60Hz, 96Hz, 110Hz, 120Hz. I myself have 60, 96, and 110 ready and can confirm they look fantastic.

    One point you can nitpick on is that using ICC profiles to correct large deviations can lower the color palette, the number of available colors for display. Nvidia & AMD deal with this differently, Nvidia allows banding but more accurate colors, and AMD prefers no banding but is less accurate. This is not fully confirmed but thought I'd throw it out here. We're talking differences so slight they only matter to professional users that are on monitors that cost a few grands and have hardware (rather than software) calibration features.

    HyperMatrix @ 120Hz.net is currently using the Qnix QX2710 over his Catleap. That started from some curiosity to check out how the new overclockable PLS panels react to overclocking :D

    Hope this helps.

    EDIT: HyperMatrix recently mentioned in a reply to me that overclocking the Korean IPS monitors (can?) causes scan-line brightening so they all can suffer from side effects one way or another. The side effects are, of course, different.

    Catleaps had some issues (not serious) with starting up in a cold environment, check out 120Hz.net for that.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2013
  4. Deathchild

    Deathchild Ancient Guru

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    How the heck do you overclock a monitor anyways. :D
     

  5. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    Run the display at as high refresh rate as possible. I have my 1080p IPS display "overclocked" to 75Hz. Quite many displays do 75Hz fine with custom timings, it's noticeable boost over 60Hz.
     
  6. Deathchild

    Deathchild Ancient Guru

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    Hmm, damn. But I got this SAMSUNG BX2350 23" monitor, how could I do it on this one too?

    I take it through setting a custom refresh rate and display and so on, right? Or through some specific way?
     
  7. thatguy91

    thatguy91 Ancient Guru

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    Download this:
    http://www.monitortests.com/forum/Thread-Custom-Resolution-Utility-CRU
    • run it, and select the correct monitor from the dropdown list
    • on the right hand side top window (detailed resolutions), click on the entry and edit
    • select the timing option 'LCD - Reduced" (you can usually get higher timings with that set)
    • manually put in your desired refresh rate, according to your monitors specs page - some can go higher :)
    • click ok, then ok again, and it is done :)
    • reboot
    • right click on the desktop and select 'Screen resolution'
    • select the correct display
    • click 'Advanced Settings'
    • click the 'Monitor' tab
    • select your new refresh from the drop down tab
    Reason why you can edit the settings instead of adding a new entry is that 60 Hz etc will remain on the list, so no need to add an extra item to that list.
     
  8. Vengeful#1

    Vengeful#1 Member Guru

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    Cheers yasamoka! i couldn't have hoped for a better reply, very informative so thankyou. :)

    I think this seals the deal for me on the Qnix then..been spending hours reading up on all this and it seems like the best way to go.

    As a side note, my housemates Tempest was an a- panel and it came with 2 dead pixels and a light scratch on the top of the screen..he didn't wanna pay the extra for the pixel perfect panel though so i guess that's the gamble you take.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2013
  9. yasamoka

    yasamoka Ancient Guru

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    It's all a gamble, honestly. The difference between branded monitors and the Korean ones is that there's sort of a better assured support, but even with that you have issues. You have people on the PLS club (OCN) who exchanged branded monitors 8 times or so before they settled on a Korean monitor and they became fully satisfied.

    It's weird when these monitors can do what the other monitors twice and three times as expensive can't.

    To throw a wrench into this enthusiasm you are probably feeling right now, it's not known how overclocking IPS panels impacts their lifespan. We know that the boards are capable of such overclocks, but what about the panels?

    HyperMatrix says that (in my own words) LG found out (?) that IPS panel lifespan is shortened significantly @ 120Hz, and some others (very few) talk about overdrive impacting lifespan on an IPS panel. Google shows all of 3 results when 120Hz IPS panel lifespan etc... keywords are entered.

    Overdrive has been tested to be the same @60Hz as it is @120Hz, contrary to the 1080p 120Hz TN panels which have overdrive algorithm for multiple refresh rates, e.g. 60Hz and 120Hz.

    Would using the same overdrive algorithm impact lifespan? Were LG implying that a 120Hz overdrive algorithm would shorten lifespan? Argh we don't know, I'm hoping to find out eventually.

    Shall we then run 60Hz @ Desktop and 120Hz @ games? Desktop usage is MUCH less intensive on the panel then games. Few pixels change state every few seconds (or even longer), you got a cursor moving, a window or two every once in a while, characters being typed (then staying there), so pixels are not transitioning enough for overdrive to even start to matter relative to how much it's used in games. Unless my understanding of overdrive is flawed and it's used even when pixels stay the same between refreshes. LCD in its resting state shouldn't behave differently between different refresh rates if the same voltages are being applied (disregarding the color discrepancies that the display controller introduces e.g. gamma shift).

    If Overlord does not have a pixel perfect option anymore (I'm not sure), then that might say something about the batches they're getting. Might be a higher chance of getting dead or stuck pixels now.

    Stuck pixels are not much of an issue, they can probably be unstuck if you flash RGB on that pixel long enough, but dead pixels are *dead* so...

    Note that even branded monitors have dead and stuck pixels sometimes but with those that might be a good reason for an exchange (or not, depends on warranty).

    BTW, with the money left over compared to a Tempest, you could go for a colorimeter if you desire more accurate colors. The Spyder4Express package goes for $100 and you can use 3rd-party open-source software with that. That's what I use. It's great for its price but it has trouble measuring black levels. Skip the Spyder4Elite as that is $250 for more software (and 99% the same sensor + ambient light sensor), same price as the i1 Display Pro which is better. Or you could borrow one if you know someone who has a colorimeter.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2013
  10. thatguy91

    thatguy91 Ancient Guru

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    Yeah, it can be a hit and miss. They're not quite so consistent between monitors as brand names, but that's what you get for the price. I think I was probably just put off by my friends monitor, I know some of them can be quite decent!
     

  11. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    This has worked on every 1080 monitor I have:
    [​IMG]
     
  12. Deathchild

    Deathchild Ancient Guru

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    Thank you man. :D +rep
     
  13. yasamoka

    yasamoka Ancient Guru

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    You...you can't... :nerd:
     
  14. Deathchild

    Deathchild Ancient Guru

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    Yeah I know XD :D rofl.. sux. :p
     

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