POLL: Working from Home, salary reduction. [UPDATE 10TH August 2021]

Discussion in 'The Guru's Pub' started by Loobyluggs, Aug 4, 2020.

?

Would you accept a pay cut to work from home?

  1. Yes

    10.5%
  2. No

    64.9%
  3. Depends on how much of a pay cut

    24.6%
  1. DocStr4ngelove

    DocStr4ngelove Master Guru

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    I'd say ok that's ok for me and then send them the following email:

    1. I need a fast internet connection because my current one is slow AF and sending both private and business data isn't advisable. Also you can't force me to use my connection for work.
    2. I need a 10% raise because statistics show that months of home office will make ppl gain more weight. Thick ppl need more food, bigger suits and SUVs.
    3. In 3 months i will move from my current location to a new home resulting in 180% of travelling distance. So after the current home office phase ill need another raise to compensate for that
    4. I'm single and stats show that esp singles are having a hard time being isolated during covid. I will surely miss the uplifting atmosphere in the office with colleagues so i'm asking for an addional raise for regularly bookings of professionals and erotic dancers at home.

    :D:D:p
     
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  2. AsiJu

    AsiJu Ancient Guru

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    Now THAT'S how you negotiate!
     
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  3. rm082e

    rm082e Master Guru

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    [​IMG]
     
  4. I think the moment OP stopped taking their own thread seriously this is the response it needed.

    It’s not incumbent on you to remind your employer what you charge for your years of experience as a professional. DOE etc. The longer you are with a company pay will increase unless something is wrong with you or said company. Enough with the splitting of hairs and but she said he said.

    I am right darn it and the rest of you are all allowed to go give yourselves a raise’ but beware the @Clawedge he walks lurking with sticky fingers
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 5, 2020
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  5. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    Tho regarding my country Finland. Employer would never pay another person more for longer commute even if that person had the experience they needed. They would just more so ask to move closer. We get tax reliefs albeit small ones if we have a long long commute in Finland. And the thing is that is why Employers will never ever take that in to consideration when negotiating wages. It's our choice to live further away and suffer the consequences of that unless we can work from home office ofc which is also supported just a tad with tax relief albeit not as much.

    I think how things have been built here regarding working it wouldn't ever come up. Some places offer possibility of working from home others don't. But it never reflects in salary as negative if you do work from home or wherever. Some companies prefer that as they do save a lot when not having to have huge offices.
     
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  6. AsiJu

    AsiJu Ancient Guru

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    ^ yeah, ask for a raise for commute in an interview here and you'll be kindly thanked for your time and told you'll be contacted if anything comes up...
     
  7. Loobyluggs

    Loobyluggs Ancient Guru

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    Is it (should it) be incumbent on an employee to negotiate a salary? Like at the annual pay review? Or, should salary increases and decreases be automated?

    In addition, is it right to penalise a member of staff who negotiated a higher salary, yet another member of staff did not, yet do the same job? And furthering that point, if the terms of your work change (like where you have to report to everyday) then should it be that your contract also be automated in its terms?

    It's perhaps not as simple as we would wish, in that "I'm paid X. IF I was given the option to work from home, I should automatically be paid X".

    Nothing is automatic, and nothing is beyond the realms of negotiation of an employment contract.

    You change where you operate your job, and you will need a new contract - that leads to a new negotiation of the terms of your contract, no different than getting a new contract when your get a pay increase, or, role change.
     
  8. That's assuming that your employer is even open to open-ended negotiations with whomever at whatever points of intervals which I doubt as most are not unless you pull enough clout or weight in your respective position or line of work to be able to do that or joined the role with that understanding in the first place. Also not everyone works under the same employment contracts. Draw the distinctions or there will be confusion. It can be a very relative/subjective term the phrase "employment contract" can apply to NDAs, salary, term of work, duration on a project, responsibilities etc.. or agreements drawn up for independent contractors - something else entirely different from staff. This entire subject is very unrealistic and fantastical from the relative or general norm to what most people can expect, or will often times experience in the workplace.

    EDIT: For most people what you are talking about is a fast-track to getting fired. The better alternative is learning from experience; interviewing elsewhere and negotiating upfront a solid employment agreement on staff with your many stipulations.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 5, 2020
  9. rm082e

    rm082e Master Guru

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    I don't understand how you think this is relevant. The work performed and the output delivered is what determine the salary, not where the work is performed. Are you assuming the quality of work delivered is measurable worse, or measurably less than it would be if the work were done in an office?

    Also, if I'm not going into the office the company is already saving money by not having to pay for an office footprint (electricity, water, internet bandwidth, amenities like coffee, etc.). My company is talking about moving to a much smaller space that has a few dedicated offices and a small cubicle farm with generic setups people can just plug their laptops into. If we could reduce our office overhead by 1/2 or 2/3 by having most people work from home, how could they justify paying us less?
     
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  10. Loobyluggs

    Loobyluggs Ancient Guru

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    You'd need a new contract if you change location - that would need a reneg.

    I think it would be quite different if a company ordered you to work from home, I'm talking about your boss telling the relevant member or members of staff they have a choice:

    Choice one: KEEP THINGS ARE THEY ARE NOW.
    Choice two: WORK FROM HOME, BUT AT A REDUCED SALARY RATE*

    *to be agreed.

    Now, the amount of reduction would have to be agreed on, and, a lot of that will come from the 'we do NOT want you to be out of pocket' so, let the negotiation begin.

    Y'see? You are not being TOLD how much of a reduction, neither are you being TOLD that you have to work from home.

    You are being given the option, the choice - so, the company (if you wanted to be spiteful to yourself) can continue to pay you the amount you are getting as per the agreed contract, or, you can reneg for less, but work from home.

    Your choice.
     

  11. Loobyluggs

    Loobyluggs Ancient Guru

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    I think you''ll find the company will pay flat rates to building owners/leaseholders. Yes, including electricity, unless the building is 'light industrial' and you are renting out a mini-wharehouse with heavy electrical needs for power tools etc.
     
  12. itpro

    itpro Maha Guru

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    Happy and blessed are only those working for the state, public servants, people in uniforms, government agents, etc. We the plebs from private section of economy either have to take whatever comes to us, or choose the unemployment's benefit. Sad times for the majority of the real workers.
     
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  13. rm082e

    rm082e Master Guru

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    Okay, I must have missed the part where it's a choice. In that case I would keep coming into the office, but it's such a stupid and unjustifiable proposition I would still look for a new job. If the leadership is looking to cut costs by skinning their people, it's usually time to move on.

    You're probably right on water and electrical.
     
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  14. TaskMaster

    TaskMaster Maha Guru

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    Oh, I would just like to add that my company (a government entity) has provide us the option to work from home 2 days a week. Doesn't affect pay at all. A very generous and wise thing to provide although myself I prefer going into the office. Feel more productive.

    Of course you have to be fully on call during those 2 days during work hours which is a given.

    My heart goes out to all those folks who lost jobs because of this situation, must be extremely hard. Pilots have been hit super hard too.

    For all of us who still have full paying jobs we should be really thankful right now.
     
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  15. AsiJu

    AsiJu Ancient Guru

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    Well said.

    Want to make it clear that even if my stand on the topic is strict, I'm grateful for having a paying job.

    Have actually had my work time reduced - and in turn pay - by 20 % temporarily since April.
     

  16. Loobyluggs

    Loobyluggs Ancient Guru

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    It's an interesting point, but, if someone is being interviewed I would have to assume two points:

    (1) They want the person they are interviewing
    (2) The person will state that if they are to work at that location for that company, then the cost is going to X - which is standard negotiation..."this is how much it is going to cost you to employ me"

    Safe assumptions?
     
  17. rm082e

    rm082e Master Guru

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    Not really. I've hired a handful of people since I became a manager. When I brought someone in for an interview, I didn't "want them". They simply passed through the initial screening process, and came across as reasonable during a phone interview. They've just done the bare minimum to catch my attention at that point.

    The interview is where I'm looking for them to sell me on their value. I want to know about their work history, their personality, how they carry themselves, their values, etc. I'm looking for them to show me what kind of team member they will be. If they impress me, then I give HR the thumbs up. HR then get's into negotiating with them over salary.

    If I were interviewing, I wouldn't get into negotiating unless the employer brings it up. I would only look at negotiating terms if they've extended an offer of some sort. Usually this means you've done an interview or two and HR is reaching out for details.
     
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  18. AsiJu

    AsiJu Ancient Guru

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    Yeah both true and obviously when you present a salary request no one is going to ask you to break it down in detail.

    Or to be more precise about point 1) if a person is interviewed he/she has potential for the job or passes some pre-defined criteria.

    Don't know about other countries but here getting to an interview is often like passing the first round.
    Positive of course but depending on the job, company and number of applicants might not mean much yet.

    In the worst case you might be interviewed because "we had no one better to interview".

    Depends though, once I went to an interview where I was immediately passed on to an aptitude test and not too much later got a job offer.
    That was a smaller - medium sized company (about 50 ... 60 employees total) and apparently I "aced" the aptitude test.

    (Besides I wasn't exactly being 100 % serious with that earlier comment. More a nod towards a fellow Finn.)
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2020
  19. I've typically given my minimum salary and said this is the lowest I'll accept. Once offered the job, I've always negotiated with a manager from HR. Never recall doing so with my hiring manager nor myself doing this with anyone I ever hired. Are you taking a class @Loobyluggs ? :cool: Now I am starting to get kinda curious.. hehe
     
  20. dark_surge

    dark_surge Master Guru

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    Depends on how far away the job is. If it's an hour away or longer then I'd take a $1-2 cut. I'd save that in gas so it'd even out.
     
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