Opamps and Modding thread.

Discussion in 'Soundcards, Speakers HiFI & File formats' started by ROBSCIX, Mar 7, 2008.

  1. Tom F

    Tom F Ancient Guru

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    I've never heard something that measures well sound bad - however the opposite definitely can be true. You can measure anything ;)... though I suppose I would say that because I work for a measurement company.

    Still not sure I believe in opamp sound. Noise yes - that's why I would use an expensive one, rather than sound qualities.

    In a buffer the contribution of the chip will be more than 100db down at audio frequencies - measurable? Just, but extremely hard. Audible? No chance.

    Chips are probably chosen based on cost, supply requirements, output current, noise performance in that order for audio.

    As ever, to each their own - but expecting miracles from swapping opamps will of course make you hear miracles. I don't expect it to make a difference, so I don't hear one.
     
  2. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    You have never seen a source meausure well and yet sound cold, sterile and lifeless? We both know there is more to audio, it is just not all about measurments.

    Well you have heard the saying the "burr brown sound"? That tubby bass with glossy high range?
    There are charactheristic sounds preset for many popular opamps, is everybody hearing the same plecebo affect? I don't think so.
    Nobody is expecting miracles...just some sonic differences. Usually not very large ones either.

    You mention plecebo affect, you know it works the other way also right? You don't expect the hear differences so you don't....You block them out.
    As you said to each their own. Take Care
     
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2013
  3. Tom F

    Tom F Ancient Guru

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    I haven't - but I hate stuff that sounds 'warm' so that could be why :) I'm a clean freak when it comes to audio, heard a reeeeeeally expensive system once with Aesthetix electronics, Sonus Faber speakers and a Clearaudio Reference deck (the one where the platter levitates) and doubtless some whizzy cartridge. Thought it sounded crap - even though loads of people were wetting themselves over the colour and body etc. of the sound. Could've been the room, but I hated everything I heard on it. Just sounded really fuzzy and distorted to me. Much rather have my old Rega and AT150MLx lol

    So I don't think my opinion can be trusted ;)

    But. That's exactly what I'm saying - I'm predisposed to thinking none of this stuff makes a difference so I don't hear one. Same with cables, capacitors and all the rest of it. I don't want to comment on what other people hear - I'm sure they do hear something - but we all know that you can't really trust senses to make absolute decisions on stuff like this. It's one of the things we'll never be able to truly bottom out - "Do you hear what I'm hearing?!".

    Apologies if this always comes across as being negative, that's never the idea - I enjoy discussing this stuff with knowledgeable people :)

    Edit: Don't worry. The irony of me saying how clean I like my audio and then waffling about my record deck isn't lost on me :D

    Edit 2: A picture of that system. To be fair, the room was dire.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2013
  4. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    To stop you at the start, if opamps all measure flat, where does this warm sound come from? IF a unit measures basically flat but has a certain signature, where does the signature come from?

    Honestly, I cannot comment on what other people hear or don't hear...I can only give me opinion.
     

  5. Tom F

    Tom F Ancient Guru

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    Warm is an easy one - a lump in the midbass (mechanical or electrical resonance), or distortion. In the case of the system I mentioned it was probably the latter. It was LOUD!
     
  6. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    Yes, but if it measures flat there shold not be any hump in the mid bass.
     
  7. Tom F

    Tom F Ancient Guru

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    You're right - so we are left with (non-linear) distortion or expectation bias :)
     
  8. ppataki

    ppataki New Member

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    Sound Blaster ZXR op-amp replacement

    Hi Everyone,
    I got a Sound Blaster ZXR card and I am planning to replace the op-amps on it
    I was thinking about the MUSES02 as the I/V op-amp (dual) but I am not sure about the buffer op-amp (single)
    Can you please recommend some nice analog sounding DIP8 buffer op-amp to match with MUSES02? (or shall I just leave the original LME49710NA there with the MUSES02)
    Thank you in advance
     
  9. glfi

    glfi Member

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    Hello

    Quick question here too, i own a SoundBlaster ZXR and using headphones from the headhpone jack, does changing opamps affect headphones too or is it just for the rca line outputs?
     
  10. GenClaymore

    GenClaymore Ancient Guru

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    When I last checked it did effected both front speaker's out and Headphones output.
     

  11. Radical_53

    Radical_53 Ancient Guru

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    I always get the names mixed up but, as far as I know, the two single ones are only used for the RCA outputs. The two dual ones will also be used for the headphone output.
     
  12. glfi

    glfi Member

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    Which opamp needs to changed to affect only on headphone output, thinking on getting opa627 or opa637.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Radical_53

    Radical_53 Ancient Guru

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    The two JRCs need to go. You'd need dual-adapters for the Burr Browns though.
     
  14. tand

    tand Member Guru

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    Is an op-amp an amplifier?
    I always thought opamps works like a pre amp(minus dac) in stereo. Just color the sound.
    But to really power the sound you will need a power amplifier.

    Asking this question because of a motherboard the gigabyte g1 sniper b5.
    It has interchangeble op amps and a headphone amp. But if I read the information correctly, they are not connected.
    The op amp plays from rear jack.
    The headphone amp from front jack.
     
  15. Tom F

    Tom F Ancient Guru

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    An opamps is there to buffer the DAC output - headphones need current which most DACs don't supply. The job of the opamp is to act as a low impedance source. They are NOT there to colour the sound. An opamp that contributes it's own signature is not an opamp, it's a waste of space ;)

    An opamp is exactly the same as a power amplifier (except far higher performance), just with a relatively small power output.

    Glfi - what headphones do you have? If you have low impedance ones, get some with hefty current output capacity .

    NJM4556 is a tank in that respect, and is ideal for driving low impedance loads.
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2014

  16. mst3kld

    mst3kld Member

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  17. bigcid1

    bigcid1 Master Guru

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    stx II opamps

    Has anyone tried the "muse" opamps that came with the stx II
    and if so,are they better also what slots did you put them in?
    thanks
     
  18. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    They have become more popular in recent components both cards and some DAC's however, they are a bit on the pricey side.
     
  19. bigcid1

    bigcid1 Master Guru

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    I meant ,I own one and It came with 1 muse and 2 others (start with NA)
    I was just wondering if it was worth it to change to those
    and which opamps are they a replacement for?
    thanks
     
  20. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    I see. Swapping opamps is up to you. I found the Muse series are pretty good sounding opamps. I know you have the opamp swap kit. You can experiment if ya want. If you are unsure how the opamps are laid out or how to swap them properly, post back and I can outline how to do it and how the signals are laid out.

    To note, I would say, your speakers are limiting your system for sure.
     

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