Onboard Sound Vs. Add in Sound Card

Discussion in 'Soundcards, Speakers HiFI & File formats' started by ROBSCIX, Mar 10, 2006.

  1. Daftshadow

    Daftshadow Maha Guru

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    lol, i'm one of those. i had no idea onboard cards degraded cpu performance. learned something new today. probably considering getting an add-in card now. and tbh, the onboard sounds as good but good sound cards are cheap these days. so it's worth it.
     
  2. snip3r_3

    snip3r_3 Guest

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    Well here is my thoughts after two years with the Titanium HD (vs onboard).

    Well to be honest, sound processing is not as intensive as you'll think it is. Most of the larger effects were done on older hardware (a long time ago). Also, at least for XFIs most of the effects are run from software instead. You really are buying the card for the output quality instead of CPU offloading (which is marginal anyways). Also, sound quality wise only if you have some really good speakers/headphones will you notice a large difference. If you are running on cheap <$60 speakers/headphones the difference will be minimal. This is especially true for many better integrated solutions that exist today, compounded by software based XFi solutions. Many boards also have higher quality DACs/better capacitors for audio that makes it even harder to notice on cheaper sound gear and vs the cheap $50 sound cards.

    One of my friends recently got a new Gigabyte Z77 UD5 board that has okay-ish sound (Realtek + Xfi software) but it sounds better to him than his Xonar DX (a cheap sound card). I have a hard time discerning between a Titanium HD and the integrated VIA + XFi solution on my motherboard with $250 speakers and Audio Technica M50 headphones. Some places sound a bit more clear, but it is hard to notice unless you specifically listen for it and keep on switching between the two. I'll even say its hard to pick one between an iPod vs the Titanium HD playing the same song (though I definately notice it vs another cell phone) as the devices both play with a certain "style" such as the Titanium emphasizing the highs and the lows letting you feel it being more "clear" though with muddled mids, the iPod having a more "balanced" sound, though both sound pretty good. Its really down to your preference, hence why many cards have replaceable op amps, to adjust to your liking! I am by no standard an audiophile, just a gamer, person who listens to music, and who plays music (piano, drums).

    What I'm basically saying is don't expect cheap $50 sound cards to do miracles, because with improving sound quality on motherboards (unless you have a really cheap/old motherboard).
     
  3. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

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    The performance degradation from using integrated audio vs dedicated is miniscule for all but entry-level systems. For a high-end gaming rig....you might lose .1 to .2fps.....which is nothing to even be concerned with.

    Honestly, if it wasn't for me using voice chat software while gaming....I'd have no use for a sound card. Problem is...some of the people I game with have accents that make them difficult to understand so audio clarity is a major issue for me. I don't play with in-game audio turned on because I find it distracting....have since I started PC gaming 20 years ago....
     
  4. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    A note on quickly comparing two sources.

    Your ears will not notice anything below a sdden and drastic major change, very easily.

    If you want to hear the differences between two sources, you have to give them time. Your ears/brain, have to acclimate to the new sound signature.

    Similar to some people not really noticing a difference between a new card and an onboard everything sound similar.

    Months later you go to return to the onboard and you hear how low grade it actually is. Your brain needs time to hear what is actually being offered if that makes any sense. Another aspect is your brain takes what you think is great sound signature and "stores" it as a reference point. You use this as your comparison. E.g Thinking a tape sound great as it is the best you have heard.
    Later on you start using CD's and when you hear a tape again, it just doesn't sound quite as good anymore. As you have a new reference point in your memory for comparison. There is a whole area of science around this phenomena. Check it out:)

    Quick A and B tests are very difficult and many suggest they will never work for such a comparison. Your ear and auditory memory just doesn't work that way.

    Also add in the fact that many try to do tests using low quality Mp3 etc. So you hear bad and a better version of bad :)
    Hope that sheds a bit of light.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2012

  5. hallryu

    hallryu Don Altobello

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    Just moved from years of onboard sound coupled with some fairly low level speakers to a dedicated card (Asus Xonar D2X) and quality speakers (Corsair SP2500) and the differences are amazing, even to my untrained ears.

    I will NEVER go back to onboard sound.
     
  6. Killswitch

    Killswitch Guest

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    Yes it does sir :)
     
  7. WaroDaBeast

    WaroDaBeast Ancient Guru

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    I'm glad to hear that (in much better quality). Welcome to a brand new world of sensations unfelt before! :D
     
  8. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    Just FYI for those who are stuck with Realtek ALC892 for any reason. It actually does have headphone amp and it's definitely more powerfull, say, X-Fi Titanium line-out. You have to select headphones when you attach you headphones instead of front speaker out (or click connector retasking in Realtek CP and change it). I may make your life a bit more bearable if your using ALC892 and headphones.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2012
  9. ESlik

    ESlik Guest

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    When considering a sound card,or any other piece of hardware,remember one thing...you get what you pay for. If money is tight,and you feel you MUST have a sound card just because it's very inexpensive,don't do it! In the long run,it's far better to wait and save a bit more money. If you buy a lesser quality card now,you're just going to upgrade it later anyhow. Really...get "good",or don't get anything at all. If you're not too sure what "good" is,check the sound card reviews posted here by ROBSCIX. That guy knows his stuff. Just my two cents.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2012
  10. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    That's good advice. If you compromise now, you will just regret it and end up buying a new product anyway. Better off to save yourself some time and money and just buy what you want the first time.

    That is not to say all good soudncards are very expensive and you can always go to the used market.
    You can find all kinds of great gear in the 2nd hand market, sources, amps, receivers, speakers..subs.
     

  11. StewieTech

    StewieTech Chuck Norris

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    Hey guys,

    So since i was in my dad´s balls i had onboard sound,

    Just bought an asus xonar dg and some nice headphones and enabled the amplifier and i´m amazed! Holy ****!

    I hear new things, the sound is way better, it really brings the atmosphere at whatever you through at it.

    Really nice.:nerd:
     
  12. Darkest

    Darkest Guest

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    Just goes to show that you don't need to spend a lot of money to get good sound, which further baffles me as to why people discount investing into audio for their PC's. The Xonar DG is a fantastic card for the money, especially for people who primarily use headphones. Same goes for those Superlux HD681B's, great headphones for the price. I think people tend to have this thought in the back of their heads that you need to spend hundreds to get decent audio.
     
  13. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    Try this if you play lossless material like WAV, raw CD...
    http://jplay.eu/

    Its a player plugin for Winamp/Foobar or a standalone player ([jplaymini] for max quality) but this isnt so easy to get on with.
    It wont play MP3s, the player plugins will automatically default to normal playback for compressed audio, so its not a pita.
    The trial lasts forever but puts a few second gap in the music every so often.

    You'll hear things you havent before.
     
  14. StewieTech

    StewieTech Chuck Norris

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    Darkest: Agree. One have to try.

    Mufflore: Thanks. I didn´t know that plugin. I´ll try the trial, have a bunch of losseless material on my pc.
     
  15. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    Yep, doesn't take much of an investmen to get an upgrade over crappy onboard.
    Ofcourse, there are various levels of upgrade also.
    I have been using Jplay latley also and it is a very surprising little plugin/player.
    Especially if you think you have your system pumping all the audio gooness it possibly can.
     

  16. Killswitch

    Killswitch Guest

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    Imo dedicated sound card is worthy only if one has highend speakers/headphones.
     
  17. The Goose

    The Goose Ancient Guru

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    Well i have an Asus rampage IV with FXIII sound chip but i recently added a Recon3D Fatality pro to my system(another £50...cough cough), yes the sound quality is slightly better and i get extra sound effects but i get no more fps, what would be a worthy upgrade with full universal game support good music and dvd/bluray play back and cost less than £100 oh and be pci_e 1/4, i currently use my Kendwood amp with 2 full range bass reflex speeks but shortly will be changing to 5.1 speakers but not sure if i`ll stay with my amp or change to a pre-amp set like the Logitech Z906 5.1 Surround Sound Speaker System
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2013
  18. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    Not quite.
    Although high end kit will always sound better, an external high end DAC is best suited for high end kit.
    Its a matter of how much better sound you get for the money spent.
    Soundcards arent bad these days, but they are not high end.

    What kit made you draw this conclusion?

    If you want high end audio from a PC for music, games and movies, get the Oppo 105 Blue Ray player.
    Its a 7.1 USB & HDMI DAC.
    I've played with one, its amazing.
    So am getting one soon :)
     
  19. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    Soundcards dont give you extra fps :)
    Sell some stuff and get a ZX or ZXR.
     
  20. ROBSCIX

    ROBSCIX Ancient Guru

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    LOL, that is one of those Catch 22's...

    1. Soundcards are only worthy if you have good speakers or headphones.
    2. Good speakers or headphones are only worth it if you have a good soundcard.

    Do you see the circular logic?

    You have to start somewhere...

    Personally, I couldn't imagine having a PC for entertainment without quality sound.

    @Muff, I don't know about the idea that soundcards aren't high end these days as you have many cards out there with impressive specs that easily surpass specs of much higher priced components.

    Many new cards can also produce sound quality on par with devices worth much more. You have to really invest, to surpass the flagship cards from the various companies right now.

    I am not of the opinion that only external DAC's/ gear can produce great sound quality. I have tested pretty much every high end card avaialable right now and also have many high quality DAC's. There are great sources in both the external and internal areas. As you know source is only part of the chain.
    To each their own though, we all use very different systems.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2013

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