Official CFB 2010 Thread

Discussion in 'The Guru's Pub' started by sava700, May 5, 2010.

  1. Palerider

    Palerider Ancient Guru

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  2. hawkeyefan

    hawkeyefan Maha Guru

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    I don't think it changes anything, and it's nothing more than a stall tactic by Texas to keep TAMU from scurrying off to the SEC, something the Aggie leadership was on the fence about in the first place because of the crap academics in the conference. TAMU engaged Texas in a staring contest, and Texas flinched first.

    A reshaped Big12 minus Nebraska and Colorado isn't viable in the long term, and Delaney has already exposed the fault lines around which the conference will ultimately crumble. What are they going to do...add TCU and Houston? Or Rice? That won't last long once Mizzou, ISU, and the Kansas and Oklahoma schools realize that Beebe was drunk with a calculator when he cooked up those bogus revenue figures.

    Then, it becomes a question of whether Texas is willing to let TAMU go to the SEC, with the resulting raid of Texas state prospects, or whether they'll prod TAMU into joining UT in either the Pac 10, where they won't receive any particular academic benefit or substantial revenue package...or the Big Ten, where the academic outlay is MASSIVE and the revenue sharing package is as good as it gets, walloping the SEC's contracts at that point. And that isn't even counting ND + Pitt or ND + Rutgers.

    I still really can't see Mizzou being brought in unless Tejas can't drag TAMU to the Big10 kicking and screaming, and then only because Texas would want another former Big 12 crony as part of the voting bloc. They want OU to come and Delaney and the presidents have already put that notion to rest in no uncertain terms. Mizzou is a less difficult pill for the Big Ten to swallow, but still not something they'd prefer to do. Mizzou was never anything but bait for Nebraska and UT, and for sending a couple schools scrambling towards the Pac 10 in order weaken the Big12, so as to shake Texas and TAMU out of the tree.

    Delaney looks like an evil genius right now.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2010
  3. Stukov

    Stukov Ancient Guru

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    Oh, I didn't see them on the list, they got on in 2001. I've not understood by what is meant "culturally" they have said that in the news (B10 commissioner) and I don't quite get it.

    So the Big 12's new name is the Longhorn Conference?
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2010
  4. hawkeyefan

    hawkeyefan Maha Guru

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    Texas (and Austin), culturally, economically and politically, is an awful lot like the BigTen schools and cities. Massive institutions that lean hard left but that place immense value on history and sporting tradition, surrounded by left-center populations of highly educated, young, affluent upper middle class Americans, mostly less than two generations removed from blue collar roots. That is almost the rule across the BigTen alumni base and on its campuses. Austin shares far more in common with the values of Minneapolis, Iowa City, Madison, Champaign, Chicago, Bloomington, Ann Arbor, State College, etc. than it does with Norman, Westwood, Tempe, Palo Alto, or Stillwater. Out west, Austin is most similar to Berkeley and Eugene, which themselves probably fit better culturally amongst the BigTen schools than they do within their own conferences.

    TAMU is a whole different animal. They're basically a gigantic ROTC compound that concentrates heavily on agriculture and animal husbandry, petroleum and energy (oil money), and various engineering fields, and they do those really damn well. One of TAMU's two branch campuses is located in freaking Qatar, and their library is named after Bush Senior. Their band, cheerleading and student section consists almost entirely of jackbooted ROTC members, the Corps of Cadets, and various military subgroups, most of whom are destined to become decorated officers at some point after graduation. Their student body consists of more men than women (very unusual), is almost entirely from small towns in Texas, is extremely religious (Baptist mostly), and extremely politically conservative. Not that any of these are necessarily negatives, but clearly none reflect any BigTen institution to put things mildly. TAMU is more SEC than the SEC. Culturally, they fit well with schools like Virginia Tech, The Citadel, Baylor, Army, Navy, Mississippi, Alabama, Auburn, etc. This is what people mean when they refer to the political and cultural divide between TAMU and conferences like the BigTen and Pac 10.

    Now, all that said, Texas, in all their hippie glory, and TAMU, in their patent leather and summer khakis, marching in formation, are, and have always been, joined at the hip in an unholy alliance that rules the state of Texas, which is no small feat in itself. So when Texas says "jump", TAMU typically asks "how high?" Partly because that it what they are trained to do (hehe) and partly because they've assumed this role for themselves, as their own success depends on it. TAMU in the SEC will melt into obscurity behind the likes of Mississippi State and South Carolina, and they know it, and that's why they balked when Texas blinked and asked them to come home. TAMU also knows that they are miles beyond those dumb yokels and their horrid schools, and that they belong alongside the Texases and the UCLAs and the Minnesotas and the Penn States of the world.

    So TAMU rides the fence, because their heart tells them to join the SEC (cultural fit) but their head says NO, join the BigTen alongside Texas, because they're our intellectual equals, the rewards are great, and the cultural rift can be overcome easier than the intellectual rift (jesus, Mississippi Flipping State??? Seriously???).

    And in the end, you come up with a scenario not unlike what I referenced above. TAMU and the BigTen each choke down a tough pill culturally in order that the two can benefit academically from each other. TAMU and Tejas enter as a package deal and reap the benefits of the CIC. Everyone wins except Oklahoma, who nobody gives a crap about.

    So you can see why TAMU is in their current predicament. They want nothing more than the old SWC, ruled by Texas with TAMU at the right hand. But what they'll get is more a frankenstein with Tejas in the driver's seat, and they'll figure out soon enough that such an arrangement is not in their best interest.

    This is why, while TAMU is not a cultural fit for the BT, strictly speaking, they might well come as a package deal with UT, because the academics and the athletics benefit them immeasurably, even if we're not a lot of Baptist officers in the Army. Some of these cultural considerations are hopefully left along the wayside.
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2010

  5. KCjoker

    KCjoker Ancient Guru

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    I think we(Mizzou) was bait to get ND to the Big 10. I'm not saying if Mizzou joined that would force ND. I simply think they thought by destroying the Big 12 ND would get scared about being left out of the Super Conferences and join. Then what happend was Texas, OU, A&M, OkSt, Tech, said they'd go Pac 10 which scared NU to join the Big 10. Big 10 likely figured getting NU would force ND more than Mizzou. Thing is I knew right off the bat that Texas was bluffing about going to the Pac 10. Texas has control and won't leave unless absolutely forced. The key wasn't Mizzou or NU...it's A&M and I'll never understand why they let Texas control them. Mizzou, KU, KSU, ISU, Baylor, OSU don't have much choice but why OU and A&M let Texas dictate I'll never understand. I know Mizzou looked bad in some of this but atleast we tried to stop Texas power control. OU and A&M put up with it for no reason. Oh well I guess we'll take CU and NU's buyout money and put it towards facilities.
     
  6. hawkeyefan

    hawkeyefan Maha Guru

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    There is some truth to that, though I think the ND plan is much longer term (two years or more from now) and centered around the distractions that Paterno and Delaney have created out east with Rutgers, Syracuse, Maryland, Virginia, BC and others. I do also think that Mizzou in the Big Ten still isn't out of the realm of possibility given ND + Pitt joining, or a similar scenario, but only if and when all hope is lost on Texas.

    I agree completely with regard to TAMU though. I do think a couple things could happen here in the next several months to two years or so. 1) TAMU bolts for the SEC if/when Beebe's phantom television contract money never appears, and it becomes clear that the new Big12 is just Texas plus everyone else. 2) OU, TT and possibly Okie Lite bolt for the Pac 10 superconference when they realize the same. 3) TT refuses to sign on to the deal, which they're balking at right now, thereby significantly weakening what is already a really weak conference even as it stands. 4) others bolt for more stable arrangements...could be Mizzou, ISU, the Kansas schools, whether it's to a rebuilt MWC or to a combined conference with members of what is now the Big East. I think the last possibility is by far the least likely, though it might be in the best interest of those parties.

    Lastly, Texas and TAMU will continue talks with Delaney and the BigTen and may ultimately tell the rest of the conference to eat a dong and take their little party to greener pastures, without OU, who would immediately bolt westward.

    ND is in a tough situation right now given the Big East's ultimatum (join or we don't schedule you), and given the reality that the Big Ten, SEC and Pac 10 will continue to gobble up teams and further dry up ND's scheduling opportunities. In order to maintain their academic dignity and their historical rivalries, they'll have no choice but to join the BigTen, and Pitt will likely come along as an eastern package deal.

    The big question with regard to Texas is whether a Texas + TAMU voting bloc will be sufficient to appease their desire to have their regional interests represented in a northern conference, or whether TT, OU or somebody like Mizzou or Kansas need to be part of a package deal. I can see the BigTen making room for any of those apart from OU or TT if both Texas schools get on board.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2010
  7. KCjoker

    KCjoker Ancient Guru

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    Call me crazy but don't put it passed Texas.....

    http://blogs.mercurynews.com/collegesports/2010/06/15/pac-10-expansion-the-texas-conspiracy-theory/

    Pac-10 expansion: The Texas conspiracy theory

    Posted by Jon Wilner on June 15th, 2010 at 2:26 pm | Categorized as Big 12 football, Larry Scott, Nebraska football, Pac-10 Conference, Pac-10 expansion, Pac-10 football, Texas football

    As regular Hotline readers know, I’m not against proposing an occasional conspiracy theory so long as it’s presented as such — it’s good to think about issues in an unconventional manner.

    And in the case of the Pac-10’s commendable but failed pursuit of Texas, I can’t help but wonder if the Longhorns manipulated the whole thing from the start … if athletic director DeLoss Dodds played everyone like a fiddle.

    Let’s take it from the start:

    *** Dodds has been in contact with Pac-10 commissioner Larry Scott and deputy Kevin Weiberg and knows they are taking a bold, aggressive approach to expansion — that they plan to make a serious run at Texas, A&M, Oklahoma et all.

    He also knows the Big 12 and Pac-10 are getting set to negotiate new TV contracts.

    And he knows that Nebraska and Missouri are on the Big Ten’s expansion radar.

    *** So during the Big 12 annual meetings, Dodds (or one of his lieutenants) leaks the Pac-10’s grand plan to Orangebloods.com, a Rivals.com website affiliated with Texas.

    (The Pac-10 had been working on its superconference scenario for weeks/months. Why leak the news during the Big 12 meetings unless you want to manipulate the situation?)

    *** News of the Pac-10’s pending raid ripples through the Big 12 with the intended effect: Causing panic and anger, further fraying fractured alliances.

    (The leak’s other intended effect: Their plan suddenly out in the open, Scott and Weiberg are effectively cornered — no turning back now! — which gives Texas even more leverage.)

    The Big 12, desperate to stay intact, issues an ultimatum to Nebraska and Missouri: Pledge your allegiance within a week … or get the hell out!

    *** Contrary to what Dodds reportedly told a Big 12 athletic director — “We don’t think the Big 12 without Nebraska is real viable” — I believe the Longhorns actually wanted Nebraska out of the conference.

    Why? Because Tom Osborne had become a thorn in UT’s side with his complaining about the South-centric nature of the Big 12. And with only 10 teams, there’s more money for UT.

    (And I should have added in the original post: With Nebraska out of the way, UT’s path to the BCS is far, far more manageable.)

    *** Thinking the Big 12 is doomed, Nebraska bolts for the Big Ten – Osborne having fallen face-first for the ruse — and the Pac-10 moves in for the kill.

    *** At the last minute, the Big 12 (predictably) devises a plan to save the conference by opening the vault for Texas:

    The Longhorns get an even greater share of the revenue and the option to start their own network — a package reportedly worth about $25 million annually.

    *** Meanwhile, after knowing the terms of the Pac-10’s proposal, the Longhorns change course and ask for something they know they won’t get: an unequal share of the superconference revenue and their own network.

    (Citing a source close to the Pac-10’s expansion negotiations, the Denver Post reported the following:

    (In the 11th hour, after months of telling us they understand the TV rights, they’re trying to pull a fast one on the verge of sealing the deal in the regents meeting,” the source said. “They want a better revenue-sharing deal and their own network. Those were points of principle. ((The Pac-10)) wants to treat everyone fairly. It’s been that way for months of discussions.”)

    *** The Pac-10 responds exactly the way Texas expects: It doesn’t budge.

    The Longhorns then back out, happily agreeing to the silver-platter proposal fashioned by desperate Big 12 commish Dan Beebe.

    As an added bonus, they look like heroes for saving the Big 12 and preserving the college sports landscape.

    *** I also can’t help but wonder why Mike Slive, Jim Delany and Jack Swarbrick — three huge figures in the superconference game — stayed so quiet during the Pac-10/Big 12 tango … unless they didn’t believe it would happen.

    *** Or why Oklahoma AD Joe Castiglione was so adamant about the Big 12 staying together sticking — to the point of looking foolish if it had dissolved — unless he never thought Texas would leave …

    So there you have it — my Texas conspiracy theory.

    Admittedly, I’m not sure I believe it. But at the same time, I don’t think it’s an outlandish scenario, either.

    And if it’s true, then DeLoss Dodds is a freakin’ genuis.
     
  8. KCjoker

    KCjoker Ancient Guru

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    Ok...now THIS is 100% hilarious....

    Hey a$holes

    I am a third generation aggie and class of '06. my family and I, including many extend family members have had season tickets at kyle field for up to 20 yrs.

    We also tailgate spending a lot of time and money during the fall in college station. That all ended today

    We are canceling our season tickets and will never again donate to the 12th man until there is all new board of regents minus Gene Stallings, a new ad, new president (that guy is a disgrace).

    Dollar bill, I hope you have time to pull your tongue out of dodds butt to read this email

    Sincere regards

    Richard Rogge

    ......and then Byrne's response....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCHGLof8KIE
     
  9. Palerider

    Palerider Ancient Guru

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    Man if that's really Byrne I'm amazed.Is he really that thin skinned as to want to beat up an angry alum? At first glance, it's funny, but the more you look at it, it's a disgrace to the university.
    Hopefully the board of directors deals with this moron quickly.
     
  10. hawkeyefan

    hawkeyefan Maha Guru

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    That linked piece is the most insane thing I've ever read. It makes absolutely no sense. Beebe is an ineffectual twat and Dodds just got brutally pwnt by Byrne. And probably will again.

    Dodds won't look so brilliant when TAMU, TT, or any number of other schools pull the plug within the next couple years.
     

  11. sava700

    sava700 Ancient Guru

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    Ok guys:

    List your top 10 starting off for the season of what you think it will look like going into Labor day weekend?
     
  12. KCjoker

    KCjoker Ancient Guru

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    Sorry but I refuse to name a Top 10 before fall practice. :)
     
  13. sava700

    sava700 Ancient Guru

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    I hear ya.. I like thinking about it but I'd rather not see any numbers beside any team till at least week 5 since many teams get hyped up way too fast and I blame that on TV ratings.
     
  14. Palerider

    Palerider Ancient Guru

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    I think it's fair to carry over the previous top 10.If Bama won the NC, they should be the pre season #1 ( if there must be a pre season # 1 )

    Schedules will play out, and rankings will become earned by mid season.
     
  15. sava700

    sava700 Ancient Guru

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    How is it fair to do that when you could have so many of your starters graduate and not return? After all most polls are based off of players stats way before scores or team stats.

    Naw at this point I don't think its fair to put Alabama at #1 after they've lost many players from last year. This is why I support a no poll numbers setup till at least week 5 so you can get a feel to what team is where in all positions.
     

  16. Palerider

    Palerider Ancient Guru

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    It's just my opinion, but an OSU win is not a Terrelle Pryor win , so the individual stats would be taken OUT of the equation for pre season polls.
    It's an absolute that the tide won the NC,and it's unfair speculation to say Pryor looked great in the Rose Bowl, therefore he must have developed into a complete QB, therefore all teams in the Big10 are going to be squashed by his dominance.
    A team wins as a team, and loses as a team, therefore should be ranked according to the accomplishments of the team.
     
  17. sava700

    sava700 Ancient Guru

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    I have not really looked at much of OSU so far this year..all I can tell you is Terrelle Pryor is no leader, he opens his mouth too much such as he did last year and that is what hurts the team. He's a horrible QB that without the leader status is just a strong arm that can throw the football. I'll be honest, until OSU gets rid of him, they won't get even close to another National Championship.
     
  18. Palerider

    Palerider Ancient Guru

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    I used OSU as an example, because they are who I follow.

    You didn't hear TP mouthing off last year, because it's team policy not to let underclassmen speak for the team.
    It's obvious you don't know about the Buckeyes, and that's OK, you're from VA, but you shouldn't make hasty assumptions, based on personal grievances.

    Of all TP's faults, leadership isn't on the list, and of all his strengths, a strong arm isn't on the list.

    My point was, at years end, there is a top 10.IMO, at the beginning of the next season, if there has to be a pre season ranking, I think it's fair to carry over the previous ones.
     
  19. Stukov

    Stukov Ancient Guru

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    Well from the OSU games I saw (though I didn't see them all) TP gameplay problems mostly revolved around poor decision making.
     
  20. hawkeyefan

    hawkeyefan Maha Guru

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    Yep. Ask me around the second or third week of October and I'll give my thoughts on a top 10. Only changes I'd make to the season ending list would be to drop Cincy and Penn State and replace them with any among Wisconsin, Georgia Tech and Nebraska.

    It is interesting that doing so could mirror some of the preseason rankings (mostly worthless of course), in that four of the top ten teams would come from the Big Ten + Nebraska.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2010

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