Nvidia dll file names?

Discussion in 'Videocards - NVIDIA GeForce Drivers Section' started by trocio2, Mar 31, 2016.

  1. CrunchyBiscuit

    CrunchyBiscuit Master Guru

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    I just mentioned SFV on nVidia hardware, new title, new hardware, new drivers.

    It seems to me people just mentally trick themselves into believeing it's not necessary, to avoid the hassle and time it takes testing various drivers.

    It's not about copying 'untested' *.dlls into older driver sets. It's about copying tested *.dlls from older drivers into the folder of the executable (game, program, application), forcing the executable to use the drivers in the folder, rather than the installed drivers in windows/system32 or wherever they're located. If it doesn't work or creates problems, just remove the *.dlls from the folder and the executable will just use the regular system32 drivers again - not really an issue if you know what you're doing.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2016
  2. CrunchyBiscuit

    CrunchyBiscuit Master Guru

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    EDIT: Good job on figuring out some of the details trocio2! I'll pass this knowledge on to my bro, will save him the time of figuring it out for himself.

    Will probably prove to be very useful to me as well when (if) I switch to nVidia.
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2016
  3. cricket bones

    cricket bones Master Guru

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    Not sure if April Fool's joke....
     
  4. trocio2

    trocio2 Master Guru

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    Ok pal :) The files are inside "Display.Driver" folder and you can extract them with 7-Zip (or via cmd, but for some reason I had to use 7-Zip). Good luck!

    What are you doing here?
     

  5. CrunchyBiscuit

    CrunchyBiscuit Master Guru

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    Neato!

    Maybe somebody that cares about this should request a sticky with a link to an open database containing all the various driver *.dlls from the last couple of years for easy download, like in the AMD Radeon Catalyst Drivers Section here on Guru3D.

    Or maybe something like that already exists. I can't be bothered 'bout it, I'm not on nVidia hardware currently.
     
  6. trocio2

    trocio2 Master Guru

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    double post omg delete this...
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2016
  7. trocio2

    trocio2 Master Guru

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    I think it will happen someday. Cya :D
     
  8. Cyberdyne

    Cyberdyne Ancient Guru

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    By the way, if you want to save some time, you can actually extract the files you want without doing an install. Just download the drivers, use something like 7zip to open the installer as an archive, go to the Display.Driver folder, and there you have it.
    You can extract the DLL's you want like a typical zip file, but you will need to manually rename the extension from .dl_ to .dll.
     
  9. trocio2

    trocio2 Master Guru

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    Ok honey, ty.
     
  10. Cyberdyne

    Cyberdyne Ancient Guru

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    Lol! I found that response simply hilarious.

    I later realized that you already figured that out.

    But man, I wasn't expecting the old grandma "Awww, he tried" response.
     

  11. dr_rus

    dr_rus Ancient Guru

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    You mentioned what exactly? That some person is getting better performance in older drivers in GTA5 and FO4 but for some reason gets bad performance on them in SF5? Where's the benchmarks? Where are the data which will actually prove that this is even true? Who's to say that's this is even a driver issue?

    Yes, I "tricked" myself into believing that this isn't necessary on NV's h/w after 15 years of using it. Sure.

    DLLs from a driver set of a different version will be untested when running with the rest of the driver of a newer version - as nobody has ever even thought of providing such a possibility. The executable is using an API, not the driver. API calls are going to the user mode driver which then translates them to kernel mode driver. With changing DLLs you will be changing the first part at best and no one will guarantee that the older user mode DLLs will work with the newer kernel mode part.

    You are creating more ways for things to break essentially. If there is such a big change in performance you should just use the older version for the game which shows it and report the issue to NV.
     
  12. trocio2

    trocio2 Master Guru

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    I find your picture very hilarious :D
     
  13. trocio2

    trocio2 Master Guru

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    The games won't load with the pasted dlls (I'll see if I can fix it) lol

    damn you nvidia :D
     
  14. DarthElvis

    DarthElvis Master Guru

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    Let us know if you can get it to work. Nvidia may not allow the dll trick, but we both know that with AMD, this capability was invaluable. Uninstalling and installing a different driver for every game is a major pain in the ass so having the same capability with Nvidia would be great.
    Even though I've found less than 5% FPS difference between drivers from 347.88 through to 364.72, hitches, glitches and stutters are a different story. Nvidia drivers are better, but they're not perfect by a long shot.

    BTW, you are expanding the *dl_ files and not just renaming it to *.dll, right?
     
  15. trocio2

    trocio2 Master Guru

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    I'm not giving up! Yes, I use the expanded files.
     

  16. Guzz

    Guzz Member Guru

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    User mode driver contains unique memory offsets for kernel mode driver, so it's impossible to use different user/kernel mode driver versions.

    Here's working algorithm:
    • Copy old user mode driver (nvd3dum.dll/nvwgf2um.dll) to game folder
    • Backup current kernel mode driver by renaming
      C:\Windows\System32\drivers\nvlddmkm.sys
      to
      C:\Windows\System32\drivers\1nvlddmkm.sys
    • Copy old kernel mode driver nvlddmkm.sys to C:\Windows\System32\drivers\
    • Restart kernel mode driver
      run restart64.exe from Custom Resolution Utility
      or run nvidiaInspector.exe with key -restartdisplaydriver
    • Run game
    • When game ended, revert back new kernel mode driver by deleting
      C:\Windows\System32\drivers\nvlddmkm.sys
      and renaming
      C:\Windows\System32\drivers\1nvlddmkm.sys
      to
      C:\Windows\System32\drivers\nvlddmkm.sys
    • Restart kernel mode driver

    Maybe someone can program something like that [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  17. CrunchyBiscuit

    CrunchyBiscuit Master Guru

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    Actually, it's the other way around.

    Nah, I'm not sure how you use your system. If the latest drivers always work out well for you, then that's good. I just think it's kind of naive to think newer equals better. It's rather easy to find zillions of topics and threads all over the internet from users noting reduced performance on later drivers in various older, as well as more recent games on a wide range of nVidia hardware. Sometimes nVidia fixes this in a later driver, sometimes not. I can't test all of these personally, I'm not even on nVidia hardware, but it really seems to me it would be very beneficial if there was a way to use older drivers on a per game/application basis, like on AMD cards. It would provide an easy solution to these kinds of problems.

    It's no biggy, it just kind of surprises me that this method, which has been successfuly applied by many AMD users for many years now, is received by some people in this thread as some kind of new, weird, unorthodox or even 'silly' idea. It's not. It's very practical, on AMD at least.

    The possibiliy of mixing drivers on AMD hardware and using certain specific drivers for certain specific games or applications while the OS runs on the most recent drivers, has never caused a serious problem on multiple systems of mine.

    You might be right however on me underestimating the risks - I'm not very familair with nVidia hardware and drivers. Haven't had one of their cards in my system for over 10 years. I presume solving any issues that might arise would just be a matter of deleting the *.dll files, but maybe not. Maybe things will get seriously messed up, I honestly don't know.

    Thanks for the information. Seems like it's rather hard to do properly on nVidia. I had hoped it would be much easier. That 'Nvidia Driver Launcher' thing seems like a very good idea! Looks very useful.
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2016
  18. dr_rus

    dr_rus Ancient Guru

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    The reason is simple enough: there are no evidence that NV's drivers even need something like this. Latest driver is the best one for 99.9% of all possible applications and when there's some specific problem it's easier to just install the older driver properly and wait for the newer driver which will solve it. That's it.
     
  19. mbk1969

    mbk1969 Ancient Guru

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    I am too lazy to write whole app with such GUI, but PowerShell script or .Net console app (which receives game folder path and required version of DLL+SYS pair and does file copying) can be done.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2016
  20. dr_rus

    dr_rus Ancient Guru

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    It won't work. You'll need a system restart to change the kernel mode component and this will basically be the same as installing the new driver.
     

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