Nvidia CEO: Radeon VII is lousy and nothing new

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Jan 10, 2019.

  1. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    First of all, plenty of people here admit he's not wrong. But it seems you missed the point. It doesn't matter if he's right or not - that's not something he should be saying. It's petty and immature at best, and implies he's worried at worst; investors do not want to see the CEO of a multi-billion dollar company feel threatened.
    EDIT:
    If he were truly confident that Radeon 7 is as lousy as he says it is, he wouldn't have to say anything - he'd just let hardware reviewers do the work for him.
     
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  2. holler

    holler Master Guru

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    and full scene ray tracing is STILL a pipe dream. RTX implementation can only be used sparingly or it TANKS performance- the scenes are still 99% rasterized, its glorified Physx again, but this time they are making the consumer pay dearly for it and taking away GPU real estate, so they can "differentiate" their product in the worst ways...
     
  3. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    this is the era of trump, you may find many public speakers actually speak their mind with real talk rather than sugar coating it. because it seems the general public want that.
    anyway should he have done something wrong he will pay for it, why are people meeting petty behavior with even more petty behavior?
     
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  4. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    They barely put any money into RTX. BVH acceleration is useful in self-driving applications they just pivoted the tech to RT - same goes with Tensor/DLSS - it's all just pivoted tech. The shares of Nvidia dropped entirely due to poor guidance due to coin mining collapse and Nvidia sitting on a massive Pascal inventory.

    Also as I've wrote several times in this thread RTX isn't the only feature Turing has and AMD already announced that it's supporting an acceleration for DXR (it's own version of RTX). So the idea that RTX is somehow flawed and a failure is insane.
    Except DXR is ratified into DX12, AMD is supporting it and RT takes up essentially no GPU real estate.

    No one is looking at Jens at that Q/A thinking he was threatened. Guy was laughing and smiling and fielding questions left and right.. you guys are reading this like he was in some sour mood or something. He regularly cracks random jokes at his own expense and competitors during interviews and stuff. The guy is an engineer at heart and started the company from scratch - he's not like some suit executive businessman. I think the comments calling him "unprofessional" are ridiculous lol
     

  5. Jumbik

    Jumbik Member

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    If the Radeon 7 has so much computing power, more than 2080ti, could that also mean, that if AMD would release their own Raytracing solution (no need for RTX cores when Volta can do it without them), wouldn't it beat the Ti in the new Raytracing benchmark? :D
     
  6. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    No because RT isn't entirely based on compute. Any card can do RT but the BVH acceleration that RT cores provide accelerate one of the heftier portions of the overall calculation. That's why a Titan V is roughly 25-30% slower than 2080Ti in RT despite having more compute power overall.

    It's possible that AMD has developed some solution that helps keep them competitive or perhaps their architecture is just naturally good at calculating ray intersects or something but compute power isn't the only factor.
     
  7. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Uhhh..... unless you're talking former Yugoslavia or southern "red states", the general public (American or worldwide) is not fond of Trump. So that logic doesn't work as well as you think. Also, you're the one questioning everyone's responses here, so didn't you just contradict yourself?
    Huang isn't going to pay for anything other than souring people's impression of him. Nvidia as a whole isn't really going to take a noticeable hit and I'm sure people will forget he said this in a few months.

    More often than not, laughing (in this context) is a form of bluffing... You bluff to make yourself seem like you're in a better position than you're actually in.
     
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  8. Clawedge

    Clawedge Ancient Guru

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    oh wow. That of immature of Jensen.

    Very disappointed.
     
  9. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    trump isn't the only one doing it, its almost as if its become a fad to "real talk" people now, even the blue states are getting in on it.
    anyway both of those last comments were rhetorical comments.
     
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  10. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    There's a big difference between being blunt or "real" vs being deliberately antagonistic.
     
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  11. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    Idk man like I keep seeing all these posts that he's actually scared or something - what does he have to be afraid of? AMD is rebranding an Instinct 16GB HBM card on an expensive brand new process to compete against tier 2 gaming card at the same price point. They are doing it at 20% more power, it's launching 5-6 months later and it's lacking a lot of the features Nvidia is actively pushing into the various standard libraries - oh and according to AMD's own benchmarks it doesn't even match 2080 performance on average.

    There is no way the 2080Ti costs $1200 to manufacture so likely the margins on it are insane and it's priced that way because they knew stock was going to be low for a while (it constantly goes out of stock & that's with most selling at inflated prices of like $1400+ on amazon).

    I just don't see it and his attitude didn't show it.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  12. vbetts

    vbetts Don Vincenzo Staff Member

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    I don't think this has anything to do with him being scared, I honestly believe he's far from that.

    Worst case scenario for Nvidia, people don't buy the 2080 they have 2 cards right under it for less. They still win. Out of the new cards, what does AMD have to offer?
     
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  13. Memorian

    Memorian Ancient Guru

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    Scared ? Lol..He's just really confident because he knows he's way ahead..
     
  14. HardwareCaps

    HardwareCaps Master Guru

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    Laughing on the competition is not something that a CEO should do.
    a few quick notes:
    nvidia lost half its value in the last few months.
    RTX was negatively covered in most media channels.
    This has to do less with AMD being a real threat and more about Nvidia not succeeding in selling the "RTX" to consumers.
    this is why the 2060 is at 349$. they want RTX to be adopted, if its not the case RTX is going to end up just like Hairworks.
     
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  15. craycray

    craycray Member Guru

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    I think you can say the same about 1080ti and 2080 as well then. :)
     

  16. Undying

    Undying Ancient Guru

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    Confident people dont act like that. If he knew hes way ahead he would said something like "good for them".
     
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  17. MonstroMart

    MonstroMart Master Guru

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    Should work on his products instead.

    I know i'm probably alone but personally i think the RTX series is a big failure. RTX 2080 is pretty much a 1080Ti for the same price. 2070 is pretty much a slightly improved 1080 for the same price (in fact slightly higher msrp than 10x0). 2080Ti is way too expensive for 99.99% of the gamers out there and the 2060 while a good bargain for people having old cards is not optimal for 4k or 2k/high refresh rate (and not really good enough for RTX moving forward) and is not really an upgrade for people having cards able to handle high refresh rate at 1080 like the 1080 or 1070 or 980Ti.

    It's not like RTX is a big win for nVidia.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2019
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  18. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    If you look at nothing but what you just said then yeah, I would completely agree. But there's a lot more outside this scope. Again, if what he said is so obvious, why did he feel the need to say anything about it? He could just simply dismiss it or say "it's not of any concern". Ridiculing it isn't necessary and it isn't professional. He's already ahead, so why go on the attack?

    You can also look at this from another perspective:
    Radeon 7 might not be all that special or interesting, but, despite being underwhelming (and frankly confusing), it's already competing with Nvidia's 2nd best consumer-level GPU (of this generation). Radeon 7 is basically just a mediocre placeholder that nobody was expecting to come out and yet, it's already competitive. Huang isn't an idiot. He knows these are basically binned parts that AMD needs to get rid of. If AMD's old (remember, he's right - this isn't anything new) rejects are competing with the 2080, that's a reason to be worried of what's to come.

    In other words, Huang isn't worried about the Radeon 7 and nor should he be. What he's worried about are the underlying implications. At the very least, he's salty that people aren't as hyped-up about raytracing as he had hoped.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  19. stereoman

    stereoman Master Guru

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    There's this old saying two wrongs don't make a right, he's clearly disrespectful and totally unprofessional but hey defend away!!!
     
  20. MonstroMart

    MonstroMart Master Guru

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    He sounds like Ballmer when he trashed the iPhone. Back then Microsoft had nothing to worry about either on pretty much all front. Today while Microsoft is still doing very good their position is definitely not as enviable as it used to be (Bing failed, WP failed, Edge failed, MSN failed, Groove failed, Zune failed, ...).

    Of course Radeon VII is not the iPhone. I mean it's the complete opposite. I don't think this card will do anything for AMD. It's not any better or any cheaper than what nVidia has on the market right now and people don't trust AMD for the most part (and they're not wrong Vega was a failure).

    But i think nVidia should not be too overly confident. You never know what can hit you. Is Intel still working on a dedicated GPU? If they are serious about it and decide to break even with the first generation to penetrate the market it could go wrong very quickly for nVidia. It's not like RTX is good. It's as underwhelming as the Radeon VII.
     
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