nVidia 163.11 BETA drivers

Discussion in 'Videocards - NVIDIA GeForce Drivers Section' started by Vinnie, Jul 11, 2007.

  1. Unstable_Hero

    Unstable_Hero Ancient Guru

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    crysis has been in that list since before last Nov, when it was going to be released last year.
     
  2. Ryan Williams

    Ryan Williams Master Guru

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    Yes. I also tried to point this out a couple of pages ago, but there's so much misinformation about HDR going around most people just think it's bloom with bright lighting.

    To quote myself:

    The idea is based on the principle that when your eye focuses on dark areas, it'll adjust the amount of light it takes in to bring out the detail. Conversely, if you focus on a bright area it'll do the opposite. Consequently, you get an image with far more levels of tone than an ordinary picture would.

    This basically originated in photography where photographs would be taken multiple times with different exposure levels and then merged together through clever editing. Developers have tried to apply it to games in various ways to achieve the same effect (albeit badly in some cases).

    I'm still going with the motion that this is simply an option that allows HDR in games that support it. It doesn't make the HDR better (as it is inherently a high dynamic range, there's not much more you can do with it). It doesn't force it in games (it's not a generic effect you can slap on anything like anti-aliasing).

    I was hoping the screenshots I took the time to put together last night would prove that enabling the option makes no visible effect non-HDR games. Now all we need is for someone to do the same for a HDR-enabled game (I will tonight in Day of Defeat: Source if nobody else does).
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2007
  3. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    its not very pronounced and as said you need a light source and in some areas its more noticeable than others. I tried it with TRA and i could tell it was there it just wasn't easy to pick up on. So i used 3dmark06.
    first is OFF. Second is ON
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  4. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    This is incorrect.
    HDR is on in COJ whether or not i use the option.
    You can clearly see the difference in the pictures there.
     

  5. Ryan Williams

    Ryan Williams Master Guru

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    Are you sure that's not just placebo? I just dragged both of those images into separate tabs and then flicked between them and there's really no difference between them at all other than the normal lighting effects being slightly different due to the shots being taken of different frames. I wouldn't say the second one looks any better, and if you read my description of HDR above there's no real reason they should.

    It's best to always compare by putting images into separate tabs and then flicking between them by the way, so you can instantly see exactly what's changed without scrolling around or anything. It makes it much harder to be fooled by what your mind wants or is expecting to see.
     
  6. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    like i said its not very pronounced.
    its much more noticeable in game though while its playing.
    I was actually going to make an avi of the pics so it was easier to tell but it took too much effort :p *e but the COJ pic is obvious.
     
  7. Ryan Williams

    Ryan Williams Master Guru

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    I'd be interested to see two screenshots of you just looking at something static in CoJ, then.

    By the way, just in case anyone would like to learn more about HDR, here is an article that describes it in quite some detail. It might help you understand why HDR-enabled games look like they do.
     
  8. RejZoR

    RejZoR Ancient Guru

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    Bottom line, this feature doesn't add HDR into non HDR games (logical).
     
  9. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    i don't have the full COJ installed or anything. No room for it either at the moment.
    However when looking at how HDR effects work you want to look at how the light interacts with the camera and the environment.

    Also i noticed in that article you posted (i've read it a few times before)
    So for example bf2142 which is dominantly bright wont make any use of it. Doom3 may not make any use of it either. I could not see any difference with it on or off in DoD either. Or just very little difference when looking at the sun and zooming it. There was only slight difference in Tomb Raider Anniversary and you could only tell by how the light looked on laura herself.
    one thing to note in Splinter Cell CT when i turned it off i could no longer enable HDR however in DoD HDR was there even if it was off. I'm thinking they are still tweaking it. Oh and i can't run the 3dmark06 sm3.0 benches with it turned off either.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2007
  10. jasonbourne

    jasonbourne Active Member

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    very stable drivers , i havent had that stupid driver stoped responding for months , lost planet is running like a dream
     

  11. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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  12. Ryan Williams

    Ryan Williams Master Guru

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    I don't think DoD:S (or the Source engine in general) uses HDR in the typical DirectX shader sense, and instead uses its own thing that requires a bit of work on the level designer's part. I don't remember the specifics, but it's not the same kind of HDR you might see in most other games.

    Battlefield 2142 definitely won't use it as it has no HDR whatsoever; I was just posting the shot to absolutely confirm to people it was making no difference. If it were somehow forcing HDR in BF2142, there'd be parts that would appear much different, albeit not as much so as in a game with a more varied light/dark range.

    I still think it's just an option or compatibility toggle of some kind, and doesn't do any kind of enhancement at all. No screenshot including the two above really change my mind on this, so unless someone can provide these supposed CoJ images that show a big difference I'm going with the conclusion it makes no difference.
     
  13. Ryan Williams

    Ryan Williams Master Guru

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    Oh but yes, I think it's worth pointing out these are solid drivers nonetheless. Both my frame rate and image quality seems to have been bumped up across the board, and I've no weird problems like I had with 158.45 and 162.15.

    Definitely worth a go for anyone considering it.
     
  14. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    Look at how the light emits off the water spray. When you fly past the bird in both scenes you can see the tone mapping effect if the "HDR" option is on or off.


     
  15. Ryan Williams

    Ryan Williams Master Guru

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    But could it not just be that setting the option to off is completely disabling the HDR, thus overriding the game's own toggle?
     

  16. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    Then the tone mapping should be disabled as well. But it wasn't. Does the exact same for WiC beta as well.
     
  17. ChaosPhoenix

    ChaosPhoenix Member Guru

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    I've had no problems with the world in conflict beta and my old drivers. But then vinnie said fan control is actually working.. I've to try thhhat!
     
  18. Ryan Williams

    Ryan Williams Master Guru

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    It could be that CoJ does more than literally just enable HDR when HDR is enabled in the game, like DoD:s. Thus, if HDR were overridden to 'off' in the control panel whatever else CoJ does would still come through.

    I'm really not convinced unless a proper screenshot comparison can be made. What we really need is that frame taken four times: HDR completely disabled both in game and control panel, HDR enabled both in game and control panel, HDR enabled in game but not the control panel, and HDR disabled in game but enabled in the control panel.

    Kind of a drag but otherwise we're just making conclusions on insufficient data.
     
  19. John Dolan

    John Dolan Ancient Guru

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    If you look in programe settings theres a profile for crysis just thought id mention it.These drivers work very good and im happy i can now play coh in dx10 without the gfx flicker with sli.But i have had gfx not responding thing happen twice already.
     
  20. fr33k

    fr33k Ancient Guru

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    well i don't think you can disable HDR in the CoJ bench. There's no option that i can see.
    Another thing it might do rather that increase quality for older games just increase performance with light intense area's.
    I did notice a few spots in 3dmark bench where it would suddenly got great fps in an area with lots of lighting effects showing.


    *edit well i'm too tired to care any more lol. I'm just playing devils advocate anyway.
    It would be nice if it did.
    So i'm off for the night.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2007

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