nsync and 30fps

Discussion in 'Videocards - NVIDIA GeForce' started by xodius80, Nov 7, 2013.

  1. xodius80

    xodius80 Master Guru

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    do we need now card like titans and 780ti? what do you guys think

    i mean if my goal is smoothness in games, and if i supposed have Nsync and a card that can do say 30+fps, isent high end cards not needed anymore for the avarage gamer.

    Im looking at this a just a gaming rig, not photoshop or any other mean of multimedia process other than gaming.

    what's your thought about this?
     
  2. elpsychodiablo

    elpsychodiablo Master Guru

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    For Nsync you dont need Titan, you need a Shotgun
    I´ll wait for Overlord Monitor with G-Sync

    [​IMG]
     
  3. xodius80

    xodius80 Master Guru

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    haha funny, but srlsy, like if a mid range lets say a 660gtx can do 30+ will an upgrade to a 780 be just overkill? ofc with gsync enabled monitor?
     
  4. angmar

    angmar Maha Guru

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    well considering i can't play games like crysis or battlefield 4 at a mere 1080p with constant 60 fps let alone a higher res then I would say yes we do need cards like these which are great upgrades if you haven't upgraded in a good while. However for me I am still able to play all my games basically maxed out with very playable frame rates so I don't mind waiting for the next series of AMD and NVIDIA GPU's. An keep in mind the only reason GPUs seemed like they were getting so powerful is because consoles were using utterly ancient tech and now that we have new consoles we will be getting a new wave of games that will be far more graphically advanced than anything we have previously seen as we pc gamers get at least 90 percent of our triple a titles ported from consoles.
     

  5. elpsychodiablo

    elpsychodiablo Master Guru

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    gsync just mean you have smoother animation on videogames even on low fps and on high fps no tearing and no input lag
    bigger is still better but now everything from 30-60fps makes now fun, too (with gsync)
     
  6. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    Had any of you seen it by your two eyes in action?
    It will not make 30-60 fps good enough, it can only eliminate tearing due to v-syncing every frame given to display as monitor will wait for it to refresh.
    And compared to full-time-Vsync it has bit lower display lag.

    But for input lag, if you go down to 30fps, then entire rendering process from start to end takes 33ms. Once done image may be flushed immediately to screen, but even at that moment data at which image is based on are 33ms old or older.
    Therefore gsync at low fps will still have negative effects of low fps gaming:
    1st: playing slideshow
    2nd: high delay between issued commands from user input and displaying results.

    But there is already available Dynamic-Vsync and Dynamic Framerate Control in RP. And nVidia has similar technologies available.

    There is no value in low fps gaming on gsync. Only high fps gaming gets real advantage, which I'll rather not explain since xodius want to know about low fps gaming.
     
  7. JJayzX

    JJayzX Master Guru

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    Basically at low frames it just tries to make it look smoother, there's nothing else to gain but appearance.
     
  8. Spets

    Spets Ancient Guru

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  9. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    Very nice that nV compared 60Hz math there vs 144Hz gsync. They should have compared 144Hz vsync vs Gsync:
    [​IMG]

    And just to correct one small mistake. New Draw does not start once image is shown on screen with sync, but immediately after previous is complete.
    And don't forget you can have multiple frames in works.
     
  10. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    Technology delays if you play just below display refresh rate (theoretical, variable part of lag only)
    Code:
    Freq. Tech.	Frame Time	Avg.lag		Avg.frame skip lag.
    60Hz  VSync	16.6ms		8.3ms		25ms
    120Hz VSync	8.3ms		4.2ms		12.5ms
    144Hz VSync	6.9ms		3.5ms		10.4ms	
    144Hz GSynz	0ms		0ms		0ms
    Real World Scenarios:
    Code:
    35fps Practical Scenario
    one frame Takes 28.6ms to render + 2ms to burn into TN panel = 30.6ms (static time)
    Freq. Tech.	Avg.lag		Shortest	Longest
    60Hz  VSync	38.9ms		30.6ms		47.2ms
    120Hz VSync	34.8ms		30.6ms		38.9ms
    144Hz VSync	34.1ms		30.6ms		37.5ms
    144Hz GSynz	30.6ms		30.6ms		30.6ms
    Code:
    60fps Scenario
    one frame Takes 16.6ms to render + 2ms to burn into TN panel = 18.6ms (static time)
    Freq. Tech.	Avg.lag		Shortest	Longest
    60Hz  VSync	26.9ms		18.6ms		35.2ms (frame is always ready, lag lenght is static)
    120Hz VSync	22.8ms		18.6ms		26.9ms
    144Hz VSync	22.1ms		18.6ms		25.5ms
    144Hz GSynz	18.6ms		18.6ms		18.6ms
    Code:
    120fps Scenario
    one frame Takes 8.3ms to render + 2ms to burn into TN panel = 10.3ms (static time)
    Freq. Tech.	Avg.lag		Shortest	Longest
    60Hz  VSync	14.5ms		10.3ms		18.6ms (frame is always ready, lag lenght is static)
    120Hz VSync	14.5ms		10.3ms		18.6ms (frame is always ready, lag lenght is static)
    144Hz VSync	13.8ms		10.3ms		17.2ms
    144Hz GSynz	10.3ms		10.3ms		10.3ms

    If you look at screnario for 35fps on 144Hz, Gsync vs VSync improves average input lag by 10.3%.
    If you look at screnario for 120fps on 144Hz, Gsync vs VSync improves average input lag by 25.4%.
    But comparing 144Hz screen lag for Vsync 35fps vs 120fps gives improvement 59.5%.
    And comparing VSync 35fps@144Hz vs GSync 120fps@144Hz gives improvement 69.8%. This shows that fps has much higher impact on input lag than GSync.

    Now for funny part: I used for reason 120fps scenario.
    You see input lag for 60Hz and 120Hz is same. Why?
    Because on 120Hz you get 120 windows in which you fit 120 frames.
    While on 60Hz you have only 60 windows and in each you time distribute 2 frames and only later is shown.
    And at moment this frame is shown it's average age is same as on 120Hz.
    But it affects input lag department only. 120fps shown >> 60fps shown.

    Last thing to look at is: 144Hz screen has frame delay variance between 0-6.9ms regardless fps (so it's same for 35 and 85fps).
    Do you think it is cause for noticeable stutter which is around 70ms+ (long enough to be visible even at 30fps youtube presents to you)?
     

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