New Upcoming ATI/AMD GPU's Thread: Leaks, Hopes & Aftermarket GPU's

Discussion in 'Videocards - AMD Radeon' started by OnnA, Jul 9, 2016.

  1. shoja

    shoja Ancient Guru

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    Woooooooooooooooooooo looks like I am going team Red! Feb is the month I have been planning my upgrade around (Preparing for games like Anthem, Division 2, and so on). Thank you for sharing this!
     
  2. Flanker35M

    Flanker35M Active Member

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    Well, the show was interesting. New Ryzen definitely worth looking into and no need to get a new mobo unless something really ground breaking comes along. The Radeon 7 looks like a keeper, even some seem to moan about the price. Maybe time to sell my PowerColor Radeon RX Vega 64 RedDevil ;)
     
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  3. Exodite

    Exodite Ancient Guru

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    As I understand it they doubled the number of ROPs (to 128) and more than doubled memory bandwidth (to 1TB/s).

    Given how much performance we're able to squeeze out of Vega with memory overclocking that may well have been enough to get past the limitations of the current generation.
     
  4. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    Ah that would help, the ROP's were considered part of why the cards were somewhat front-loaded as I recall where the cores had problems being fed fast enough so utilization and efficiency and thus overall performance could be problematic particularly with draw stream binning rasterization, rapid packed math, primitive discard and I'm probably missing something ended up not making as much of a difference as expected or outright not functioning at all and AMD didn't do much with these features.

    Bandwidth is another key area although Vega10 (56 and 64) while they saw gains from increasing memory speed it wasn't that high comparably. (Though it still increased performance more than overclocking the core itself did.)
    Combine the faster speed with higher bandwidth and perhaps a revised HBM2 chip maybe using less voltage or similar voltage but at higher speeds and that would definitively help.

    Both of those and a higher clock speed and other tweaks and yeah it could push to 20-ish percent I could see that uncorking some of these bottle-neck problems the Vega design had on launch. :)

    EDIT: Yeah 64 and 4 from the initial GCN design and that's been in place until now then hasn't it where the ROP's are doubled.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graphics_Core_Next

    I have some reading to do but there's been some tweaks but some of the key designs have also remained. :)
    (There's a number of adjustments between GCN generations and then the GPU's also have gotten some tweaks like the improved tessellation performance found in Polaris and newer for one example.)

    EDIT: I have some more reading to do and refreshing on the Vega limitations because I feel I'm fumbling it a bit. Been a year or thereabout so yeah I'm forgetting a lot of the finer details.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2019
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  5. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    Clock is important too. Take card with 64 ROPs + 256 TMUs. And 2nd card running 32 ROPs + 128TMUs.
    But 2nd card has double clock. Now, ROPs and TMUs perform same. But 2GHz card is faster because all those unlisted parts if infrastructure are performing twice as fast.

    Polaris RX-580 with 32ROPs and 144TMUs catches to Fury X at around 1500MHz if it has sufficient memory bandwidth. (in games)
    Yet Fury X has 1050MHz. That clock ratio would be giving effectively 46ROPs + 205TMUs to RX-580, which is way below 64ROPs + 256 TMUs of Fury X.
     
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  6. Elder III

    Elder III Ancient Guru

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    I'm happy with the performance boost; that would fit my 4K needs quite nicely right now. I really wonder if they will also offer a version with "just" 8GB HBM2 for $599....? 16 GB is mighty nice, but I think they would sell very well if they offered a version with half the VRAM for less money.
     
  7. jaggerwild

    jaggerwild Master Guru

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  8. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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    4xHBM2 & Vega 7nm (not only shrink but reDone)
    Leaks where true :p
    1080Ti & 2080 ballpark is also good, we need to know the size of the chip now.
    From what it seems it is not a much larger than Vega 14nm.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  9. Maddness

    Maddness Ancient Guru

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    @ $500 i would have been all over this. Not at $700 though. That's $1500- $1600 in my country. Still waiting on Navi
     
  10. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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    AMD has Ray Tracing GPUs in Development
    AMD revealed their Radeon VII graphics card during their CES Keynote (more info here), a reveal which has left many with more questions than answers. What are AMD's plans for real-time ray tracing and how long will it be until Radeon offers an alternative Nvidia's RTX graphics technology?

    Both Tom's Hardware and PC World have managed to get interviews with AMD's CEO, Lisa Su, with both outlets confirming that AMD has ray tracing technology on development, with Lisa Su reaffirming that they are on ray tracing "both on the hardware side and the software side".

    Lisa Su stated to PC World that "consumer doesn’t see a lot of benefit today because the other parts of the ecosystem are not ready" with regards to ray tracing,
    saying that AMD is "deep in development" of their own ray tracing technology and that this development "is concurrent between hardware and software."

    To Tom's Hardware Lisa Su said that they would "hear more about our (AMD's) plans as we go through the year", suggesting that ray tracing hardware may be revealed by AMD a lot sooner than expected.
    It will be a long time before ray tracing becomes commonplace thing games, likely requiring hardware support within a games console before such features receive wide adoption from developers.
    This gives AMD an advantage, as they are likely to build the hardware within both the next-generation Xbox One and PlayStation consoles, which could delay the need for widespread ray tracing support for another hardware generation.
     
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  11. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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    Overall gaming performance is 29% higher according to AMD with the Radeon VII having been tested in 25 titles in order to reach that conclusion.
    Eight of them were DX12 and two of them Vulkan meaning they used a decent spread of games across multiple APIs.
    In regards to the games tested they used: Assassin's Creed Odyssey, Battlefield 1, Battlefield V, Destiny 2, Doom, F1 2018, Fallout 76, Far Cry 5, Forza Horizon 4, Grand Theft Auto V, Strange Brigade, The Witcher 3, and Monster Hunter World just to name a few.

    Add that to the information shown in AMD's graphs and it appears it really can beat or at least trade blows with NVIDIA's GeForce RTX 2080.
    However, before jumping to any conclusions we will verify that soon enough once we have a sample in for review.
    In regards to pricing and availability it was already revealed earlier that AMD's Radeon VII will release at $699 on February 7th and will come bundled with a few games including:
    Devil May Cry 5, Resident Evil 2 and The Division 2 for a limited time.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  12. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    Would fit better for gaming use since long-term 16 GB while nice is a few years from being required at which point there will be newer hardware keeping up with demands in whatever titles will be around at that time.
    Not sure how much it would reduce pricing with that reduction though, HBM2 seems incredibly expensive for mainstream GPU usage still though 8 GB would be cheaper than the 16 GB configuration although with how these are stacked and wired up reducing that would also affect total bandwidth wouldn't it?

    But if AMD could make a 550$ GPU model it would be priced even more competitively although 600$ might be more realistic if the current configuration of HBM2 is priced at near 300$ plus interposer and other tech and it's complications and they do need to have some profit margin though I foresee retail prices varying a bit once again, Vega 56 and 64 are finally coming down to near the official pricing level so I expect these to end up around 800$ - 900$ comparably or worse even if mining is now much less of a thing for here in Sweden and it's hardware prices.

    Will be interesting to read up on their performance and what the third party models will be, maybe they could make a Nano variant too down the line for both smaller form factor cases and more third party alternatives though some like Sapphire tend to have these super-size cooling solutions for air cooled models that kinda negate the smaller PCB design. :p
    (Makes a good impact on temps though ha ha.)

    And of course what the actual street price will be once they retail whatever AMD and their board partners say and then what it will end up actually being. :D
    (It's already pretty hard to compete with the 2080 at the 700$ price point and if NVIDIA counters with lower prices on the 2060 or 2070 that's going to hamper things too although workstation and similar might still like these cards for what they offer.)


    And agreed with Fox2232 clock speeds will make a difference if AMD resolves some of the current limits the Vega cards run into, didn't think about it but well it makes sense it will really improve scaling which the current Vega GPU's already show signs of (Memory in particular.) but it's a bit hampered so it takes a pretty hefty overclock for the results you can get but with some tweaks yeah it could be different with VII/7 here. We shall see once it launches but that's going to be interesting to hear more about too.

    EDIT: Don't have the forum link at hand now and it's from a test in 2017 too so newer drivers might have affected how it scales too but from the test then Vega GPU's were peaking around 1500 Mhz and then sees diminishing returns though depending on the GPU and overall binning particularly the higher-end water cooled models could still reach around 1700 - 1750 Mhz and about 1100 to 1150 Mhz on HBM2 seeing a 10 - 12% gain.
    (3 - 4% from GPU and rest from memory but it's a pretty hefty overclock for those returns at around 30% for memory alone but if this has some tweaks then with VII well yeah it might be different this time.)

    Less issues with thermal throttle perhaps but if AMD is going for 1800 Mhz and who knows what it will end at for boost and such then voltage could remain similar, would mean undervolting might have even more headroom though for a small performance drop but well it will be known once the cards are out. :)
    (Presentation seemed to hint at a similar level for power draw if I understood it right.)

    Cut voltage a bit, improve thermals and stabilize the boost and it should be a good performing card.
    But that does still leave pricing and what NVIDIA has at a similar price and performance between the two as a deciding factor I suppose.
    (And not everyone would want to pop open Wattman and fiddle with these settings either.)
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  13. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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    Vega 7nm Vs Vega 64
    4K max settings

    [​IMG]
     
  14. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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  15. kondziowy

    kondziowy Member Guru

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    lol Fallout 76... I wonder that part of the gpu was upgraded to get this weird result.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019

  16. DethZero

    DethZero Active Member

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    There is also a whole situation about driver maturity which will come to play. Think we can expect another 5 - 15% gains over the card's lifespan?
     
  17. Maddness

    Maddness Ancient Guru

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    I wouldn't think so. Vega has been out long enough already. AMD have probably already got most of those gains with the 56 and 64.
     
  18. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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  19. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    Tbh AMD hasn't been giving big boosts in terms of drivers since Fury. Some here and there for some games for sure. But cmon the arch is pretty much the same as the one from 2013 on 290 gpus. Just updates here and there to make it better. But what can they do with the money they had. We will see in future what they can do but not now.
     
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  20. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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    Radeon VII for the fanbase ;)

     

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