Discussion in 'Videocards - AMD Radeon' started by WhiteLightning, Sep 28, 2018.
^^ "Skalping AMD Fans"
Now think about gaining market share (and mind share) if it goes for 349€ instead of 449€
We talking about Mid-Range (should be up to 299€ IMhO) then and only then they will gain market share.
My next GPU '2020' will be with Ray-Tracing (no matter the vendor )
The price is a fail (ish) if the card is really a "7" and 8 and/or 9 is on the way... I wont bet on it, but i hope once nvidia releases the "super" cards, AMD will cut prices again under 400 (ideal under 350 for the X).
Maybe the 450 are just a bait lul
Watch AdoredTV -> He make some prognosis about costs etc.
Watch AdoredTV if you like being mislead.
It's Leaks YT, don't You have Bag of salt?
To be honest. It hardly matters if person deals with rumors. Especially if one speculates on cost of components used in product as there you can make as good guess too after an hour on google.
While AMD has space to reduce prices of 5700 (XT), they should not do it unless needed. Their much smaller market share requires higher margins to recoup price of tape-out and development.
That's one of reasons why AMD does not make 5 different Navi chips like you can see in green camp.
It's still overpriced.... (nV Gauged prices to the roof and ATI jumped in into it without a blink' - that's not cool for the Fan Base)
After hair thin margins in last 6 months with Polaris, AMD's division needs it.
5700 (XT) costs like $240 to make. Potentially commanding profit of $210/135 of entire production/supply chain. What do you think is investment into Navi and then tape-out?
What does it cost to develop something over last 4 years?
Total cost to deliver 1st Navi may be $1.5 ~ 2.5B or twice as high.
Yes, there are going to be many more based on RDNA. But take just this and how many GPUs AMD needs to sell to recoup this.
No reason to like it, but it is simple to understand.
Hmm, maby You're right.
But according to some other calculations cost to sell is (no margins at all) ~135-150 USD
IMO the are preparing for Price war against nV
We don't know for sure, but $449 for Mid range is waay too much.
And initial sales will be low as hell, because of it.
For $349 this can sell like hotcakes.. Just sain'
You can save my opinion for End of summer -> Massive promos for Navi will come
and sales go forward (let us hope it will not be too late, ---> 2070/2060 w/RTX and Vega64/56)
IMhO it's still BIG Mistake by RTG, and it will slap them hard.
We need more DX12 capable H/W in the hands of MAJORITY (read: up to 300€)
AMD uses 14Gbps chips, 2k of them will result in $11 per 1GB. Even with additional 40% discount on very high quantity will make it more expensive than estimation above.
More realistically 8GB will be like $60~70.
Similar underestimating of cost is elsewhere, ignoring SMDs like VRMs. And thinking that 251mm^2 on 7nm will be under $50 while it will be more like $90~100.
Yup, maby it is closer.
Who knows, wait until end of summer then
Im more into Arcurus HBM3 or RTX 3080 now....
They may need that pricing... but they also need to SELL those cards at that price point. I dont think they will gain any market share if nvidia a his "super" line up come close to 5700 (xt) price.
Maybe they get more net income selling less at higher price but you need to add some brand awareness in the user base to that mix, without market share or reviewers pushing sales on 5700 AMD wont be better 6 months from now.
I would say that it will be better 6 months from now ...initial drivers for new architecture.
(Me) and You both kinda right.
We shall see the reviews first...
FWIW, and something I alluded to in a previous price discussion, I don't think AMD care much about market share at this point.
Unfortunately they don't have the same level of goodwill in the GPU space as they have in the CPU space, re: people buying worse Nvidia products at higher prices, so they choose to focus on actually making a profit.
Personally I'm quite disappointed for no other reason than Navi doing nothing to move the needle on midrange graphics, which is what I care about, but I can't blame AMD for not seriously undercutting Nvidia as their first move. They've been doing that for a while, are doing that with Polaris and Vega right now, but people still aren't biting. They may well stand to make more money from pricing Navi like this than they would at lower prices.
Plus, and this may be important, they're essentially putting the ball in Nvidia's court and leaving themselves open to further adjusting the prices down the line. They can easily wait for Nvidia's "super" cards to be released and then come back and adjust pricing, if need be, this fall or whatever.
Yeah, it sucks for us who wanted to see some movement in the $150-$250 range but with the positioning of these cards and how AMD has been ignored even when they have better and cheaper products I can't say I blame them for not going out of their way to push prices. On the $150-$250 front there are some rumors about smaller Navi (Navi14 IIRC) being on its way too.
Yes, but costomers will have stagnating GPUs
This Navi is at ~Vega56--> 2070 in Performance.
So lower Navi will be like RX580/590 so not a substantial upgrade for the majority.
LOL -> Better is to have Xbox 1 on sale w/3 games at ~399€
But after all, the situation on the PC side of the story is fine now.
ATI/AMD & nV is pushing DX12/VLK to devs. so we can expect good performance & IQ on resonable FPS for any ATI/NV GPU (GCN 1.0 & Maxwell included)
Consumers have no one to blame but themselves. As you mention, consumers ignore AMD when they have a better product. Most consumers only want AMD to lower prices so they can buy an nVidia card cheaper. They never were going to buy the AMD card so there's no real reason for AMD to lower prices.
amd doesn't have a better product though.
their drivers are inferior in 2 major still used api's (d3d11 and opengl) and their power draw still isn't where it should be.
It may sound weird to you, but we still dont know what amd has with navi, not untill 3rd party reviews.
Anyway is good to see you are holding the nvidia fort. You should stay on nvidia threads so you could live in peace of mind. If by any chance navi has something interesting you could get hurt.