Discussion in 'Videocards - AMD Radeon' started by WhiteLightning, Sep 28, 2018.
Next Gen Xbox - 24 Tera Flops, dedicated Ray Tracing hardware - all our PCs will be obsolete
Microsoft Conference Sunday, June 9th 1:00 PM 4:00 PM 9:00 PM 10:00 PM
41.21m Cyberpunk 2077 & Keanu Reeves
Gears of War 5 (Gameplay):
Bethesda Conference Sunday, June 9th 5:30 PM 8:30 PM 1:30 AM (Monday) 2:30 AM (Monday)
Next-gen Xbox Scarlett Announced at E3 2019; Features Custom AMD Zen 2 and Navi Processor With 8K Visuals
Microsoft has finally announced its next-generation Xbox console during its 2019 E3 press conference.
Codenamed Project Scarlett, Microsoft intends to launch the new console in holiday 2020 and is said to offer around 4 times the power of the Xbox One X.
“The console should be optimized for one thing and one thing only,” Microsoft’s head of Xbox, Phil Spencer said. “Gaming.”
Project Scarlett with sport a custom AMD “Zen 2 and Navi processor and will be able to support framerates up to 120 frames per second and 8K visuals.
In addition, Spencer mentioned that the console will support next-gen Ray Tracing technology and it will pack a new generation SSD that is said to greatly increase loading times by 40x times over the current generation consoles.
Microsoft’s new console will also use the SSD as virtual memory. We’ve included the Xbox Scarlett reveal trailer down below:Introducing Project Scarlett.
Unmatched power and speed ushers in a new level of game play performance and the future of gaming.
With four generations of content that looks and feels unlike anything before. Launching with Halo Infinite Holiday 2020
Some new Leaks
Prices will be lower IMO
499€->649€ price bracket will be reserved for Arcturus HBM3.
I wonder if crossfire will be supported.
Those "Navi 12" leaks make little sense on lowest part. Would be 1st time AMD cut off 40% of actual GPU. That's such a waste unless both defect rate and ability to recover GPU was rather high.
But against that stands "Navi 10" which seems to have very good yields. As it cuts only 14% in worst case.
Then there is "Navi 20" which has double ROPs of Radeon VII, but same number of TMU/SP/... +50% wider IMC than "Navi 10/12". And they think that it is going to be up to 30% bigger than Radeon VII.
What is conclusion? Three variants of "Navi 10" are believable.
Lowest Variant of "Navi 12" is not believable. (RX-580 is cheaper to make, and defect rate on 7nm is unlikely so high.)
"Navi 20" variant is not believable at all since memory itself will cost 50% more than ones for "Navi 10", And GPU itself is considered to cost 20~50% due to lower yields for bigger GPU.
Then there is their speculation on performance. If top variant of "Navi 10" was as they wrote. It would outmatch Radeon VII in gaming due to 112 vs. 64ROPs and improved frontend without need to have RDNA CUs.
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Only thing which may go for this speculation is that They state "Navi 10/12" is not having DX-R acceleration HW. (Which I would read as CU configured in GCN compatibility more instead of improving FP16 at cost of other compute. But then again "Navi 20" is not really bigger enough than "Navi 10", therefore "Navi 10" could have already been reconfigured.)
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What interests me most is Number of SPs per TMU. Patents show clearly that it no longer needs be 16SPs per TMU as with GCN. And unless that "Navi 20" changes this ratio, it is again in GCN compatibility more, therefore DX-R optimization would seem rather weird.
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My expectation was that "Navi 12" would be in GCN compatibility mode as there's only that much silicon space one can use to trade off for improved DX-R. And that "Navi 10" would already have reconfigured CUs.
(I personally want GPU which is not in GCN compatible mode to reap full benefit of new architecture and for GPU to last longer. If neither of "Navi10/12" is, then I may just get "Navi 12" as long as performance improvement over my RX-580 is reasonable as mine runs at 145W top.)
I wonder for how long I have to wait. Well, tomorrow, I'll know what I need/want to know.
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It is nice to know that I do not know actual configurations. And it is nice to know that those speculators are in same boat
PC Gaming Show Monday, June 10th 10:00 AM 1:00 PM 6:00 PM 7:00 PM
Ubisoft Conference Monday, June 10th 1:00 PM 4:00 PM 9:00 PM 10:00 PM
AMD Next Horizon Gaming Monday, June 10th 3:00 PM 6:00 PM 11:00 PM 0:00 Midnight
Square Enix Conference Monday, June 10th 6:00 PM 9:00 PM 2:00 AM (Tuesday) 3:00 (Tuesday)
Found here: https://twitter.com/SpartanGeekTV/status/1138091993459056640
Hmm AMD caught up to the performance level of NVIDIA in Assassin's Creed Odyssey, guess they have a pretty hefty CPU in the test rig but even so the driver situation for D3D11 showed that game as one of the worst performing titles between AMD and NVIDIA so that's curious to see.
Wildlands too even if the situation wasn't as problematic in that game.
Those caught my eye too. As well as Civ6 which they are claiming parity (as there is rarely any difference in game play between 1%).
I have to wonder if there is something in the drivers that is helping the 5700?
And, 115% in Exodus at 1440p?
If all this is true it's looking pretty salty to me. And Nv is answering with their "super" series of cards which seems to confirm these improvements IMO.
And don't forget OC headroom, if massive Radeon VII could be OC to ~2100~2200 then this card can get around +20% with good cooling.
Let's hope for good pricing, don't care if only Blower comes first- Got new Accelero Extreme III in box ready for action .
In BF5 and Metro Exodus that is around 2080 level performance. Interesting if this is true.
Not that long until the stream now...
Not in the market for a new card personally but it sucks to have to wait for the 3rd party models, I wouldn't recommend a stock blower from AMD to my worst enemy.
Yeah I'm no expert but from a few weeks of reading up on the driver situation and features like driver command lists and multi-threading, NVAPI and deferred contexts and render threads and much more even if this isn't a entirely CPU limited 1920x1080 or lower run for 2560x1440 or even 3840x2160 the D3D11 titles especially Anvil Next should be fairly rough on AMD compared to NVIDIA.
Tests from earlier this year although this was for 1920x1080 put Assassin's Creed Odyssey at a 40% performance deficiency with a AMD Vega 64 against a Pascal 1080 I think it was with most other tests hitting a 5 to 15 % performance lead or penalty and then Anvil Next and the use of eight additional threads resulting in a very different CPU situation with NVIDIA and NVAPI against AMD and a different overall performance figure as long as the NVIDIA GPU system has a CPU that can carry this workload. (Hexa works but Octa ensures it's smooth.)
NVIDIA spent around two years I think possibly more adding in and updating the D3D11 driver code for better multi-threading and support for D3D11.1 feature driver command lists in addition to what NVAPI allows for which AMD in 2016 discouraged DCL for 11.1 (GPU Caps Viewer should still show it as unsupported as a optional 11.1 component or feature.) and driver wise I've heard AMD is at most dual core plus how threading and the command cues and lists are all executed and dealt with although performance isn't a total loss against NVIDIA even so but with focus on Vulkan and D3D12 even if adaption hasn't been that quick or smooth likely hasn't seen any major driver changes for D3D11 and it's code though who knows.
VLK and D3D12 has some of this as mandatory features whereas 11 has that and other as optional plus solutions like NVAPI doing it's thing in various ways (Not too sure about all of it or well not sure on most of it really how it works.) but we'll see next month as actual reviews do come in and some of these games here should still end up in the benchmarks we're going to get from Ryzen 3000 on Zen2 and NAVI and it's changes on the GPU side too.
Or that's what I'm thinking at least, will be interesting to see how it does and well maybe another four or six months and how later drivers could make a difference too as well as usual really I guess though maturity and level of difference this makes can vary as can whatever AMD is changing either listed or unlisted or changes to the GPU functionality via the driver and changes therein.
It will be very interesting to see what they did with RDNA portion of the 5700.
Event Video here:
1xPCIe 6 + 1x PCIe 8
VLIW2 / Super SIMD design confirmed.
5700XT 449€ (will be 399€ soon)
5700 379€ (will be 299€ soon)
Not a good pricing IMhO.
7nm is not cheap it seems.. or there was indeed problems with Navi in Fabs ?
To summarize Navi is good but bang'fo'buck Vega56/64 is still better (OC/UV in mind)
367€ for this puppy -> https://www.mindfactory.de/product_...Aktiv-PCIe-3-0-x16--Full-Retail-_1235216.html
Best 267€ GPU ever -> https://www.mindfactory.de/product_...Aktiv-PCIe-3-0-x16--Full-Retail-_1233947.html
Spoiler: Slides and Gaming Benchmarks
AMD announces FidelityFX, Image Sharpening filter and Anti-Lag features
During its E3 2019 Next Horizon Gaming event, AMD revealed some new features that will be coming to its graphics cards. According to the red team, FidelityFX, Image Sharpening and Anti-Lag will be supported by its new GPUs;
the AMD Radeon RX 5700 XT and the AMD Radeon RX 5700.
FidelityFX is meant to be a post-processing effect that will improve the sharpness of various surfaces.
This may sound similar to an Image Sharpening filter, however games will need to natively support this feature otherwise it will not work.
Still, for games that do not support FidelityFX, AMD will add a general Image Sharpening filter that can be enabled for every game.
AMD has also announced Anti-Lag. Anti-Lag basically reduces the input lag, something that will benefit those playing competitive games.
The red team provided a graph in which it claims that the response input latency can be decreased by around 33% in APEX Legends and 35% in Fortnite.
Spoiler: Bench LL Rt
AMD details their Ray Tracing Vision with RDNA
It has been confirmed that both the next-generation Xbox and PlayStation will support hardware accelerated Ray Tracing, which will come as part of custom SOCs which are being developed by AMD.
At E3 2019, AMD has confirmed that their upcoming Navi series of RX 5700 graphics cards will lack support for hardware accelerated ray tracing, dismissing the need for the technology at this time, with DXR enabled games being rare and extremely heavy on graphics performance.
AMD's thoughts on the matter are that they should deliver ray tracing support when both the software and hardware ecosystems are ready,
which is why the feature is set to arrive with the company's "Next Gen RDNA" graphics hardware.
This means that we should expect ray tracing hardware from AMD before the release of Sony/Microsoft's next-generation consoles.
With the launch of next-generation gaming systems, ray tracing compatible hardware will be delivered to the masses, creating a ray tracing ecosystem which spans PC, Xbox and PlayStation, which is more than enough to get developers working on the feature.
Yes, Nvidia will have a head start with their RTX series, but AMD will launch at a time where ray tracing will be a larger selling point and launch with the kind of hardware acceleration that developers will be utilising on consoles.
Nvidia has the head start, but AMD will have a broader raytracing ecosystem.
At this time it is unknown when AMD's first ray tracing enabled graphics cards will release, though they are expected to arrive sometime in 2020, before the launch of the next-generation of consoles.
It's AMD's IP within those consoles, so it stands to reason that AMD will be able to utilise their IP in their silicon before Sony and Microsoft hit the market with their next-generation products.