Netflix starts streaming over the AV1 codec to reduce data consumption

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Feb 10, 2020.

  1. Hilbert Hagedoorn

    Hilbert Hagedoorn Don Vito Corleone Staff Member

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  2. anticupidon

    anticupidon Ancient Guru

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    Well, this is a push in the right direction.
    And maybe many more will follow. For those how still have lower internet connection plan and lots of devices connected to their main router or netwotk node, surely will help.
    Good news.
     
  3. Caesar

    Caesar Maha Guru

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    That's good use of technology!!
     
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  4. anticupidon

    anticupidon Ancient Guru

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    FYI, there are still huge rural area with low internet coverage and every tweak, QoS, better codec or restriction on ads or telemetry helps. I am still seeing low ADSL connections and streaming of quality media is quite a challenge.
     
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  5. wavetrex

    wavetrex Master Guru

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    The problem is that it's not actually better (at least not in general)
    It degrades the fine detail in video, blurs out grain, reduces color precision... that 30% reduced bitrate doesn't just come from magic.

    Yes, most people won't notice the quality reduction, but it doesn't mean it's not there...

    If you read around here...
    https://forum.doom9.org/forumdisplay.php?f=54

    AV1 is hit and miss... sometimes it's better, other times it's ever worse than the old AVC (H264).

    But the average consumer listens 64kbps streamed music and watches 2mbps streamed video... so I guess for them it's going to be fine... Duh.
     
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  6. Stairmand

    Stairmand Member Guru

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    Would be nice for them to offer varying levels of compression for those that have plenty of bandwidth.

    I'd rather have a much higher quality stream even iff it used 200Mbps or more.
     
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  7. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    You're never going to get them to serve that much bandwidth.
     
  8. insp1re2600

    insp1re2600 Maha Guru

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    true but that $10 a month subscription aint gonna cover 200mbps outflowing all month, or wed all have cheap internet.
     
  9. Stairmand

    Stairmand Member Guru

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    True, but I'd pay a little more for a higher quality stream. I consider their current prices to be pretty reasonable.
     
  10. Salvatrix Mundi

    Salvatrix Mundi New Member

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    4k Blu-Rays top out at 128 Mbps so I'm not sure there's much point going beyond that. You're certainly not going to see any compression artifacts at that rate and even if the visual cortex is capable of processing more, which I'm not sure it is once all the redundancies are accounted for, there isn't actually anything to watch in higher resolution because 4k was the film industry mastering standard for a very long time based on the accuracy of digitized 35mm film.

    No point making higher resolution film scans because you'll just get more noise, and even if you could get any more useful information, all the visual effects would have to be remastered because they were done in 4k in the first place, and I never even heard of a 8k digital video camera until not too long ago, so if you want to watch 8k content someone's going to have to make it first!
     

  11. Caesar

    Caesar Maha Guru

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    May be they are using this feature to make more users subscribe....
    Anyone with low bandwidth (country specific)....will be able to watch high res movies.
    Google said that AV1 in HD requires a “powerful computer,” and that not all content is available.....but i dnt know.....maybe powerful here means......GPU accelerated...?!?!
     
  12. kakiharaFRS

    kakiharaFRS Master Guru

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    for starters 4K doesn't really exist except on youtube, bought a 77" 4K LG oled when I wanted to show it to friends I used youtube channels to do it not movies nor series
    most recent movies are 2K because of rendering times (worst case scenario 1 frame from a 24fps movie can take 30hrs to render ! needless to say they need hundreds or thousands of computer for months to render high amount of VFX movies)
    tv series are made for broadcast so they couldn't care less and/or also suffer from the rendering time problem (remember that night battle in GOT where you could see early divx era compression blocks ?)
    grain is detail, blur is lost detail...and so my sharpness is set almost at max
    the only detailed "good" looking are older movies remastered in 4K, because digital age movies look like a blurry mess

    if you want to see/show real good quality 4K
    Jacob + Katie Schwarz youtube.com/channel/UCYq-iAOSZBvoUxvfzwKIZWA
    Nature Relaxation Films youtube.com/channel/UC4lp9Emg1ci8eo2eDkB-Tag (this one isn't as good as there's lot of drone footage but lots more content uploaded)
    this is what they should show to sell tvs because people can't believe their eyes when they watch this (with high sharpness settings :p not I'm drunk/half blind settings)

    Since we entered the age of HD you actually need to sit closer to TVs for your eyes to be able to see the details ,something a lot of people especially older don't get so here's a link for your friends or family https://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/by-size/size-to-distance-relationship
    to "see" 4K on a 55" you need to sit at 1m or less from the screen heh
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2020
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  13. geogan

    geogan Master Guru

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    So now all the salesmen and marketeers of all sorts of consumer hardware (TVs, AVRs, set-top boxes) are rubbing their hands with glee, as all our current hardware only has accelerated H265 codec support, and to have hardware supported AV1, you now need to buy new machines again from them.
     
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  14. geogan

    geogan Master Guru

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    Well the vast majority of all movies visual effects are mastered at 2K (and still are even for modern blockbusters with mega budgets) ... and even the finished movie masters are still 2K.... because of time & storage costs associated with 4K rendering.

    This is why nearly ALL 4K discs are just 2K upscales. They may have HDR and WCG and higher bitrate... but still only 2K upscales from the only available master done. Makes a mockery of the whole thing I think.
     
  15. NewTRUMP Order

    NewTRUMP Order Master Guru

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    Actually the distance to sit from a 4k tv depends on its screen size.

    • A 40’’ TV– You should sit between 3.5 and 5 feet away from the screen.
    • A 43’’ TV– You should sit between 3.5 and 5.5 feet away from the screen.
    • A 50’’ TV– You should sit between 4 and 6.5 feet away from the screen.
    • A 55’’ TV– You should sit between 4.5 and 7 feet away from the screen.
    • A 60’’ TV– You should sit between 5 and 7.5 feet away from the screen.
    • A 65’’ TV– You should sit between 5.5 and 8 feet away from the screen.
    • A 70’’ TV– You should sit between 6 and 9 feet away from the screen.
    • A 75’’ TV– You should sit between 6.5 and 9.5 feet away from the screen.
    • An 80’’ TV– You should sit between 6.5 and 10 feet away from the screen.
    • An 85’’ TV– You should sit between 7 and 10.5 feet away from the scree
     

  16. asturur

    asturur Master Guru

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    4k oled is still great for great documentaries on netflix and newer series in dolby vision.
    While full hd bluray still play super nice with or without upscaling.

    high bit rate 1080p on the bluray is still nicer to my eyes than anything 4k you can find on youtube.
     
  17. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Another great way they've reduced data consumption is by losing half their library to Disney+
     
  18. XenthorX

    XenthorX Ancient Guru

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    That's a fantastic news, i hope this kind of innovation will help moving away from H.264 with which we've been stuck for way too many years.
     
  19. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

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    hehe true.

    But talking about data consumption, nobody ever says "hey, let's cut out ads and trackers and targeted marketing to save some bandwidth"... but yeah getting what people actually want is the big bad thing, not being offered endless waves of crap they don't care about :D
     
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  20. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Actually I wouldn't be surprised if the ads are cached (maybe not on your system but at your local ISP) so they're shoving endless waves of crap at us AND saving bandwidth.
     

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