MSI adds ZEN3 support to Series 400 Chipsets, even with 16 MB BIOS

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, May 28, 2020.

  1. Fender178

    Fender178 Ancient Guru

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    You're 100% wrong about me be led astray. I don't feel insulted but I gave you a chance to prove that your information was accurate without giving out confidential information but nope you failed to even do that. Other than that I am done talking to you.
     
  2. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    During boot, all x86 processors on a legacy bios operate in realmode, aka 16bit. In this mode 16MB is as much memory they can read for ROM and RAM.

    This isn't an issue in UEFI defaults which never operates in real mode unless the user opts in to turning on CSM, the UEFI interface is either natively 32 or 64bit (most 32bit)

    The "engineer" in Steves claim, stated that Pre Matisse hardware was incapable of reading 32MB roms, there was no mention of firmware.
     
  3. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Right, but it is an issue if you're running legacy mode, which some people do. I assume this is the point that is trying to be conveyed.
    Note I didn't actually read/watch the interview (I tried to find it but I don't know what the article/video is called; again, I'm not a subscriber). Despite that, I don't feel the need to question his credibility. If he doesn't have proof of something, he quotes the source he got it from. He's not an idiot - he knows that being held accountable for someone else's claims is an easy way to hurt one's reputation. So, assuming that what this engineer (legit or otherwise) claimed, it isn't Steve's credibility on the line. He gains nothing by telling people the wrong information.
     
  4. wavetrex

    wavetrex Maha Guru

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    16 bit can access 65536 bytes (64KB)
    By using the extra 4 "Segmented Memory" bits, that only increases it to 1 MB, which is what early 8086/286 could maximum access using Real Mode, before the invention of "extended memory" (that used tricks)
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_mode

    UEFI in contrast runs in Protected Mode, it's a self-contained operating system with drivers for display, keyboard&mouse, network, USB and many more... and runs either in 32-bit or 64-bit.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_Extensible_Firmware_Interface#Processor_compatibility

    There is no such thing as limit on UEFI size, even the 32-bit version can be as large as 2 gigabytes, while 64-bit version is unlimited (but there is a limitation that it can only boot 64-bit OS), as the CPU cannot switch from 64-bit back to legacy 32-bit mode without a restart.

    @Astyanax you just talk out of your ass and have no clue what you're talking about. And if that idiot Steve said that, he also pulled it out of his ass...
     

  5. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    X0286 realmode compatible supports 16MB as it has a 24bit memory address and Extended Memory
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
  6. wavetrex

    wavetrex Maha Guru

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    *facepalm*

    Read the link from Wiki, if you're too lazy to look for more technical information.
     
  7. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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  8. wavetrex

    wavetrex Maha Guru

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    Unreal.
    Sorry, I can't deal with 8-bit brains today... goodbye.
     
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  9. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    That's ok, you'll find where you left the other 56bits and put it back in your skull eventually.


    [​IMG]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extended_memory

    Fun fact, most AMI/Award/Phoenix bios's between the K5 era and the introduction of EFI used DPMI modules to boot in "Virtualized Real Mode" allowing extended memory addressing in order to support more option and larger bios roms.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
  10. Alessio1989

    Alessio1989 Ancient Guru

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    What you call "Legacy mode" today is just UEFI with CSM enabled. CSM is meant to allow devices not compatible with UEFI security standards (eg: some devices with non-UEFI compatible op-ROM) to boot with the system. Outside some UEFI security gimmicks (like Secure Boot), the functionalities are almost the same (plus you can boot on non-EFI partitions too) and you are still in UEFI. So no issues using useless 286 real mode. CSM may also used to emulate the old legacy non-UEFI BIOS (aka "UEFI class-0") for non-UEFI capable OS, but that doesn't mean you are on a legacy BIOS with its constraints.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020

  11. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    I'm pretty sure CSM also uses DPMI for extended memory capabilities, but opening up UEFI firmwares isn't as easy as legacy bios, theres signed and encrypted code to content with.
     

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