LCD 22-25in gaming monitor with 120hz refresh

Discussion in 'General Hardware' started by maxrep12, Mar 9, 2009.

  1. gamerk2

    gamerk2 Ancient Guru

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    The main advantage of a 120Hz moniter would be a far higher cap with Vsync on, and smoother gameplay with >60 frames. (Again, if you get 100FPS, your moniter only displays 60; the rest is a placebo effect).
     
  2. wEhE

    wEhE New Member

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    I got my samsung 2233rz today and its awesome! gaming is uber smooth compared to my old samsung 24" lcd. The screen also has 0 input lag, tested this with an crt with 0 lag both running 120hz. I must say I miss the size of the 24" but it is totally worth it If you play games like counter strike or other fps games this is a must!

    http://myfreefilehosting.com/f/47b85f2946_3.62MB
     
  3. falkeri

    falkeri New Member

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    Yes I'm necro'ing a thread from a month ago, blame google.

    I, like others found this thread when searching for information on 120hz LCDs. But after reading the first page I was reeling with the amount of stupidity I saw and couldn't help but continue.

    I also find it ludicrous that you all let deltatux write what I quoted above without laughing him off of the forums.

    He actually said too many frames cause seizures, and then cited STROBE LIGHTS as an example. :bang: :rofl: Stobe lights operate at like what 10-20hz? I don't even know what else to say.

    I'm guessing you don't notice over 60 because your monitor can't refresh faster than 60?

    I used to game on a CRT, locked my FPS at 100 (without I'd cruise around 250 in most of the FPS games I played) and I loved it.

    A year or two ago friends convinced me to go buy a "gaming" lcd with 5ms response time, said all the issues of the LCDs had been resolved and your eye can't see more than 60 frames anyway. Also...I was moving a lot and my 20 inch CRT was a huge pain in the ass and was actually bowing my desk.

    So I went out and bought the LCD and while the image has more contrast and brightness than my old CRT, when I turn quickly in games I get completely disoriented because the image can't update fast enough to make my eyes believe it. So now every time I quickly turn around in a game my eyes have learned to unfocus themselves so I don't try to focus on some garbage image.

    All of you parrots repeating that the eye can't see over 60hz are laughable. You (read: ElementalDragon. LOL you are 24 years old?! NO WAY THAT'S AMAZING) criticize the military test with some kind of backwards logic and keep spitting out your flip book example. Here's a clue: flipbooks work at low hz because what they display is moving slowly. Try making a flipbook of something moving fast, it'll work really well. Fact is, the eye can notice differences in an image over 200hz.

    One more thing:

    Best response in this entire thread.
     
  4. RandyB

    RandyB Banned

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    I'm pretty fast, but my eyes are poor. It takes a lot of focus...but hey! About to turn 59 and still playing UT3 is treś cool. ;)
     

  5. deltatux

    deltatux Ancient Guru

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    It could be true that my monitor can only 60 Hz. However, I used to game on the CRT like everyone who's been gaming before the turn of the millenium and still to this day, I cannot distinguish between any framerate faster than 60 - 70 fps. When I turn in game, the animation is as smooth as it was when I played my games on my trusty old CRT that I had to ditch because it was way too bulky and drew a lot of electricity (it multiplies when my house has a lot of machines).

    If LCDs are that terrible, then why do so many people start flocking to LCDs and monitor manufacturers have either halted or severely reduce the production of CRTs? It's because they've fallen out of favour. Only people who are nitpicky like you and ricardo have issues with LCDs.

    deltatux
     
  6. MM10X

    MM10X Ancient Guru

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    QFT!



    ^some people can notice the input lag difference from 60fps to 70+FPS.


    when im in CSS with vsync on, the frame rates go to 60FPS and the input on my 2ms response mouse lags noticeably! sometimes by even 0.2 seconds of lag! that is horrible for multiplayer, but when i turn vsync off it flies up to 150~300FPS and i have no problems with input.

    so, if you have a monitor that can hit 120Hz you reduce input lag, and get more smooth gameplay. if i have to turn around fast in a video game my eyes actually disorrentate because of the low refresh and it takes about .5 seconds for my eyes to ajust, which might seem like nothing but it actually kills.

    dunno if its just me, i only skimmed the topic BTW this debate is annoying. will people STOP coming up with reasons why people do not need this, and answer the actual questions?
     
  7. reno_skychaser

    reno_skychaser Ancient Guru

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    What we don't need:

    Monitors over 60hz
    "Gaming" anything
    Carbonated beverages
    Cars capable of more than 80 miles-per-hour
    And computer games

    Saying we "don't need" something is wonderfully irrelevant in a forum like this :grin:
     
  8. momomo67890

    momomo67890 Ancient Guru

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    hihi to add something i have the samsung one and i can confirm it works .... 120 hz with no input lag compared to a crt also i will add there's 60 75 85 100hz @ native res on this screen and i can tell a diff up to 120 <3
     
  9. |WOY|Shotty1993

    |WOY|Shotty1993 Banned

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    well u cn really get the 120mhz screen tha goes in the nvidia bundle for 3D. i believe the model is
    Samsung® SyncMaster 2233RZ
     
  10. reno_skychaser

    reno_skychaser Ancient Guru

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    True, but that comes with the stereo glasses, and the whole package is at about a $200 premium over a typical 22 inch.
     

  11. |WOY|Shotty1993

    |WOY|Shotty1993 Banned

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    hmm u are wrong there as u cn buy them seperate at least in UK u cn dno about usa or anything. :)
     
  12. ElementalDragon

    ElementalDragon Ancient Guru

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    falkeri: First off.... i don't really appreciate the idea of someone who's so far a 1-post-wonder quoting an old comment made towards me that's pointless. How about you meet me in a Half-Life 2 Deathmatch round and i'll beat the f*ck out of you with just the stunstick?

    Second.... LEARN HOW EYES WORK! The whole POINT for me talking about the flipbook example was because it explains why the whole idea of flipbook animation is possible, and why anyone bringing up the test performed by the military with pilots identifying a plane that was flashed on a once dark screen for an extremely short amount of time is idiotic. The only reason that was possible was because of the fact that between the time that it takes for the rods (which detect LIGHT), and cones (which are used to see wavelengths of light (i.e. colors)), there is still a bit of an afterimage that is visible. It's not "backwards logic"..... it's human anatomy.

    Like i pointed out earlier.... if it actually WAS posible to see 200hz.... then i'm pretty sure we'd be able to see a lot more detail on objects when moving at higher speeds. You can't even read what's on a wall next to you as you drive past it unless you follow it with your eyes. otherwise it's just a blur. In a sense, you could almost say that the human eye see's what it does in roughly the same way a monitor projects the image onto the screen.

    If you were playing a game on a display that you didn't know... and didn't know what framerate the game was running at, or how many hertz the monitor was refreshing at,you probably wouldn't know whether it was a 60hz display or a 120hz display.... and if the game was running at a rather smooth, non-jumpy framerate, you probably wouldn't know whether it was running at 60fps or 120fps. Smoothness isn't really visible by anybody's ability to determine a framerate. It's determined by the gap between the minimum and maximum/average framerate, and how many times it bounces down to the minimum. Again, to bring up Crysis, it ran at quite a bit under 50fps for most people, but it still appeared smooth..... because it's framerate didn't fluctuate all that much.
     
  13. MM10X

    MM10X Ancient Guru

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    120Mhz?!?!? woah lol thats 120,000,000hz(right?). :p
    i hope that is a typo.


    ^true but the reasoning for it is not completely for our eyes, its for reducing input lag without having to live with screen taring!!
     
  14. LinkDrive

    LinkDrive Ancient Guru

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    The next monitor I'm gonna buy will be a SED, that way I know I'm getting true 120Hz and not just 60x2Hz
     
  15. falkeri

    falkeri New Member

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    If I had ever even installed that game, much less actually played it, I might have taken you up on that offer. The fact that you can't appreciate niche products for gamers that have identified certain needs, and the fact that you apparently don't pay enough attention to tell the difference between 60 and 120hz lead me to believe you really can't be that good.

    About the eye thing: Congrats on watching an hour long documentary on the human eye. I'm sure you must be the all knowing Messiah Of The Eye now and aren't just producing the most basic facts possibly produced about said organ and incorrectly using them to justify your false and outdated conclusion. Your diploma should be in the mail in 4-6 weeks, Dr.

    Noone is saying they can see every detail and comprehend every detail of an image flashed for .02 of a second, but the point is the eye can see SOMETHING. It can tell the difference between 60hz and 120hz. Noone is saying they can see every frame and remember what was on it, just that the eye notices that it was there, that it makes the image smoother. And that is what the military's test demonstrates.
     

  16. ElementalDragon

    ElementalDragon Ancient Guru

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    and who ever said i play to be "good"? And even if i did, i wouldn't spend ungodly amounts of money on Razer "Gaming" mice, or a "Gaming" monitor or "Gaming" keyboard. If you ask me there's no point.... they're just milking gamers for some extra cash because they might have decided to slap a Fatal1ty logo on a piece of hardware and charge another $30 for it. I play to have fun.... which is why i don't give a sh*t how much i get killed or how many times i kill everyone else. I play in a way that keeps me entertained. It's one reason i never use the RPG. I also don't camp or snipe, or hide like a b*tch if someone sees me and starts shooting at me. The stunstick is more fun to use than anything. nothing is more exciting than getting up close and personal and beating the snot out of someone, and hearing their reaction. And seeing as you seem a bit lazy/scared to take up my offer, i don't see why i even typed all that out to explain it to you, and saying i can't be that good is quite uncalled for.

    And did you READ the details of that military test? apparently not, because they quite clearly say that not only were the pilots able to determine that it was a plane that flashed on the screen, but they were able to also say what model plane it was. i.e. afterimage, not smoothness.
     
  17. LinkDrive

    LinkDrive Ancient Guru

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    It seems to me that people here are trying to apply a blanket statement and pass it as fact even though it's not always applicable.

    Different games behave differently depending on the installed hardware and rendering methods provided. With that said, some games look and feel better than others at lower FPS and refresh rates. This is not a human limitation, it's a hardware and software limitation.

    Can I, personally, see the difference between 30-60fps, 60-100fps, and 60-100Hz? In games such as s4 League, Guild Wars, Lineage 2, Unreal Tournament 3, yes I can. Though I can't detect the differences between said rates in games like Oblivion, Crysis, and Track Mania.

    There might as well be a discussion board about which brand of video card or processor is better, because in the end what's fact and fiction will only apply to what the user is running as well as the user's needs and preferences.
     
  18. SeCALPHA1

    SeCALPHA1 Active Member

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    Nothing of anything in this thread really matters if you don't have the video card to even run a modern PC game with superb "gaming/gamer" graphics settings not that of a childs crayon painting on a brick wall on a screen anything bigger than a 17", let alone a widescreen. So everyone who's anyone with sand in their vajg need to stfu and chill out.

    The only thing that is noticeable at higher frames is the smoothness of the flow of whatever is being rendered real time. The fade/blur effect is more prevalent at lower frames because of tearing or the more common "flip book" effect.

    Higher frames mean smoother transition of the apparent fluent movement of an object or character. Forget about seeing more detail. Detail will be what it is no matter what based on how the game was physically developed to have whatever detail therein. Ever.

    People just need to get off each others back and answer the damn man: No, there aren't. Even so, are you going to bother paying for that? And if so, good luck with the bill and have fun, really.

    23" 1920/1080p 2ms 60Hz is PERFECT for gaming. Just get a good video card for higher framerate gameplay IE - faster rendering time, and you're good to go.

    Case F*CKING closed.


    [EDIT]
    Levans, you totally beat me to it, lol :banana:
     
  19. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    I can notice a small difference when I use my LCD at 75Hz compared to 60Hz - I use 75Hz for that reason and I'm glad that my TFT supports it. I would say that everything above 76 fps is as smooth as it can get for games. Video is a different story and 25 fps is fine because camera motion blur makes it look like it's smooth (but of course higher is better and it is noticeable). 25 fps for games would be jerky, some people don't get this that you can't directly compare video fps and non-blurred fps. There's also the fact that even with proper motion blur with constant 25 fps games wouldn't feel that smooth since there would be slight inaccurate/laggy/jerky feeling in controls.
     
  20. falkeri

    falkeri New Member

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    Did you read what I wrote? You basically just made all of my arguments stronger.

    You don't play to be competitive you play to have fun, that's fine. But it bolsters my original idea that you either really aren't that good or just don't care enough to pay attention so you don't notice the difference between 60 and 120hz.

    And what exactly are you trying to accomplish with that sentence about the test? I'm saying the fact that they saw something means the eye can detect something that happens for .02 seconds. Then you go and tell me that not only can they detect something they actually can see some details as well...ok? Thanks? I don't get it.

    Also, SeCALPHA1: If you had read the thread the answer is yes, there are.
     

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