Intel Kaby Lake and AMD Zen processors to only support Windows 10 and Unix

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Sep 2, 2016.

  1. Kaarme

    Kaarme Ancient Guru

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    Yeah, millions of people running their old machines. This will only affect machines built using parts that aren't even released yet. Thus it will anyway most of the time mean a fresh install of the OS, whether it's a normal install or a corporate imaging.

    I could see the stance changing if this turned out to be a problem for big business and governmental users. From there it would then leak everywhere.
     
  2. wantobe

    wantobe Member Guru

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    I am a basic computer user, this gadget helps me with a lot of work and also I love playing games with it etc. After using Windows 10 I reistalled W7 again, I am spending few more seconds looking at the screen while it boots but then again I am saving so much more by being able to choose updates and when they will be installed. Windows 10 in my opinion was made to make money instead of provide people with a next gen OS while making money. A lot of features some good some bad -again depending on the point of view, which is perfectly fine, but its not fine when I do not have a feeling that I am in control of the machine. Features, settings can be reset to the default position after an update... I refuse to re-check settings now and then, it is not how I understand using Personal Computer, and those habits/convenience was engraved by using Win XP and W7.
    I was so disappointed with W10 that I said that is it I can't be using this malware-like OS, I even tried putting Linux and I thought for some games virtual machine with W7 should do the job, but I am missing some basic knowledge and I was struggling with simple tasks like installing drivers, nothing worked for me, so I am back on W7, both PC for games and work PC.
    One of the most important features for me is the back up, which is exactly the same on W10 as it is on W7.

    p.s. A great adventure was when I formated disks with Linux and then after very frustating several hours of struggle I found out that well, after a format user must build the partition again in a very detailed and specific way (yes, for me it is very complicated), so it taught me something new, with W10 so far I came across only facepalms and disappointments, and no DX12 yet anyway... Return of the star menu, omg what a joke MS, on W8 I had to purchase 3rd party Application to have that start button, so much BS


    :cheers:
     
  3. Mica

    Mica Member

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    "Just"?

    Look, when Windows 7 was released you only had GTX2xx/HD4xxx series, the best iPhone was the iPhone 3GS, Android was barely noticeable, the first Core i5 wasn't even released (one month later, and just one model)...man, that s*** was a long time ago :)

    An OS should not be more than 4/5 years old, and we had to use Windows XP and Windows 7 for a bit more time because Microsoft failed to release better versions and Linux had poor gaming support.

    Myself, nowadays I just use Ubuntu but if i was using Windows, certainly was Windows 10 with Anniversary Update. I see no reasons to use Windows 7.
     
  4. JonasBeckman

    JonasBeckman Ancient Guru

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    Yeah I wasn't a fan of Windows 10 initially but I've gotten somewhat accustomed to it and the weird ways it works plus MS changing things extensively between various major revisions of the OS. :D

    One thing that slightly annoys me is that you can't opt out of or even lower the telemetry stuff any more when on any of the insider branches including the release preview one, earlier it could be toned down a bit even if you could not turn it off entirely but now it's locked to full though thankfully the scans and such this then leads to as it does the data collection stuff and logging is done pretty infrequently but if you notice the User Experience Improvement related processes (Also forced on if on a insider branch.) or just rundll32 going on in the background and taking up HDD usage that's what it's doing though it should only take a few minutes.
    (And even as a normal user then as of the "RS1" / "build 1607" update and newer you can't disable it fully anymore - It did require group policy editing only found in the Pro edition though. - outside of the newly released server 2016 editions and possibly the corporate oriented enterprise variant of Win10, some other policies also saw a few restrictions like that.)

    As for CPU support I do not see how they would make them completely incompatible although support for newer processor extensions might not be 100% on older OS's and it might require the CPU/chipset software for a correct device name.
    (It's primarily just a collection of .inf files for component names and no actual .sys driver files - That's what the RST thing is for when using RAID. - so it's not entirely required but can be handy to have if the OS is a bit out of date and doesn't have them natively.)
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2016

  5. BlueRay

    BlueRay Master Guru

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    Was about time. Old OS are being dropped from support and that's normal. If people want to stay in Windows XP and 7 it's their problem. This happens with every Windows version and ppl seem to forget just because they refuse to change OS. Move on people with 2016 and 2017 is near.
     
  6. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    Really. It's not like MS is going to support any of the new features future processors will bring on old soon to be left to dust operating systems. It's wasted money it won't bring them new customers. Next step companies will move up to w10 or linux or whatever. They won't be using w7 forever.

    So the processors might work somewhat on older windows but not to their full potential. And of course there won't be proper drivers for anything that comes for the new platforms then.
     
  7. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    I guess it comes down to the manufacturer of said external soundcard? If its a niche item of course MS won't provide any tangible support for that. It's not like old soundcards are that supported unless the manufacturers have provided drivers.
     
  8. EdKiefer

    EdKiefer Ancient Guru

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    I don't think this is new, even for Skylake it has new speed step code that is done on chip now and in window 10 there are power plans to support this handoff.
    I doubt win7 could just be patched by 3rd party, but it should work I imagine ,you just lose the new feature.
     
  9. vbetts

    vbetts Don Vincenzo Staff Member

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    Instruction sets, and what basic identifiers Intel supports Microsoft and the Linux Foundation with. It's all kernel level stuff too in the OS, but if Intel and AMD tell the 2 that they will only support one set of operating systems, they'll comply easily.

    Look at OSx86. You cannot run a vanilla kernel on an AMD machine, you need an AMD compatible kernel.
     
  10. jbmcmillan

    jbmcmillan Ancient Guru

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    I think you can blame that on whoever made it not windows 10. :)
     

  11. Xendance

    Xendance Ancient Guru

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    Maybe they are removing some legacy instruction sets/extensions that are required only by older windows versions? Just guessing.
     
  12. d_mouse

    d_mouse Maha Guru

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    What does MS not supporting new CPU's on old Windows OS's have to do with steam OS?
     
  13. AndyMutz

    AndyMutz Master Guru

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    that just shows how much MS values its customers.. after all, windows 8.1 is still in mainstream support until january 2018.

    -andy-
     
  14. Reqruiz

    Reqruiz Active Member

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    I see one big reason - many of old games doesn't work under Windows 10. Why should I abandon this games because Microsoft can't handle backward compatibility? :3eyes:

    Even if I move on to Windows 10 for DX12 games I would leave partition with Win7 installed.
     
  15. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    Which of the all old games do not work. Btw you could always have a virtual machine for the said old games also. I know some of the cd games simply refuse to work. I had some that thought windows 10 is simply too old because they were programmed with specific windows in mind.
     

  16. deusex

    deusex Master Guru

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    It looks to me like MS is trying to copy Apple in business practices which isn't really a good thing. supposedly Google is working on a new operating system . really hope it is true .
     
  17. mmicrosysm2

    mmicrosysm2 Member Guru

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    They still will support Linux so M$ can eat crow!
     
  18. Redemption80

    Redemption80 Ancient Guru

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    How did you come to that conclusion when it works on non MS operating systems.
     
  19. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Uh... why, exactly? If you're on a PC still using Windows 7 that isn't using a CPU older than Core2, what's stopping you from upgrading that PC to Windows 10, grabbing the serial key, and then installing Windows 10 directly on a new PC? Sure, it's an inconvenience. But if you intend to run Windows 10 on a brand new PC but you're starting off upgrading from Windows 7, you're already off to a messy start.



    Also just to point out, Linux != Unix. Linux is Unix-like. That being said, to my knowledge, there is currently Linux support for Kaby Lake and Zen, but I'm not sure what the current state is for OSes like the BSDs or AIX. To my knowledge, FreeBSD is currently working on supporting Kaby Lake and I haven't found any evidence that it supports Zen at all.

    As stated by other people in this forum, I'm sure these processors will still work on older OSes, but in terms of official support by participating companies, that can only be said by Windows 10 and Linux (and probably Mac).
     
  20. PrMinisterGR

    PrMinisterGR Ancient Guru

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    Just in case a lot of people didn't get it, Microsoft and the Linux kernel maintainers have decided that they will not backport support for Kaby Lake and Zen to previous kernels.

    That's it, and it's the correct decision technically. AMD and Intel have no real say in this. SteamOS uses the Linux kernel, so the same rules apply. Basically, whatever OS you're using, you have to make sure you have the latest version for it to properly support the latest hardware. Despite popular belief, CPUs require drivers to perform and function properly. These drivers need to be written and maintained and since Microsoft has moved into a rolling release model (like the Linux kernel has since the beginning), there is no backporting.
     

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