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Intel CEO confirms 7nm CPUs in 2021

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Jul 18, 2019.

  1. Andrew LB

    Andrew LB Maha Guru

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    It's posts like this that make me wonder about the mental stability of AMD fanboys. A bunch of inaccurate BS followed by loads of wishful thinking.

    First... Intel still leads the market. By a HUGE margin. Desktop market share is 77% regardless of the fake news stories who cherry pick data from AMD centric European retailers. What is even more hilarious is the fake news that was being repeated everywhere that AMD had crushed Intel in Data Center sales, tripling their market share.... which turned out to only be 3%. But like obedient sea lions, all the fanboys sat up and clapped in unison.

    So take a look here and don't get too upset once it sinks in that everything you just said is horsesh*t. It must be quite embaressing.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/735904/worldwide-x86-intel-amd-market-share/
     
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  2. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    Translator’s note:
    “Fake news” means “I don’t agree with you, stfu”
     
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  3. kings

    kings Active Member

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    And what's the problem with that? Intel's 7nm will compete just fine against TSMC's 5nm. The number they call the node is just a formality nowadays, what matters is the real density of each one.

    For us, it´s good that no company distances itself significantly from the other, otherwise we return to the same of the last 10 years.
     
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  4. yeeeeman

    yeeeeman Member

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    Ryzen 3900X also works with B350s you know, and that is a sub 100$ MB, if you really wanna spend little money on it.
     

  5. DmitryKo

    DmitryKo Master Guru

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    It's far from being such doom and gloom.

    Intel should have handled it better from the public relations point of view, by admitting the obvious and not sticking to their 'we are fully on track' mantra for so long. They've simply lost all confidence of enthusiast DIY customers as a result, and that's important for having good reviews.

    But that 10 nm failure alone is not enough to de-throne Intel, at least not immediately. OEM and notebook market is much larger than retail DIY, and volume availabilty and customized SKUs matter much as price/performance.

    It would require a long run of consistent product releases, or a complete execution disaster from Intel - like the infamous Intel Pentium 4 Wlliamette/Prescott/Tejas debacle - for AMD to start gaining significant market share in the OEM and server markets.

    Last time AMD did it was K8/K10 Phenom processors in 2005-2007. And yet Intel was able to quickly turn around with Pentium-M derivative Core 2 Duo/Quad and Core i5/i7 processors, which AMD could not really keep up with until Zen2.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2019
  6. H83

    H83 Ancient Guru

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    So this means Intel has nothing new to release until then??? If so, AMD is going to gain a lot of sales and market share.
     
  7. D3M1G0D

    D3M1G0D Ancient Guru

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    Ah, the tried-and-failed "this is just one retailer who heavily favors AMD" angle. As pointed out numerous times in the past, if Mindfactory is biased towards AMD then Amazon.com is as well - the top three best-selling CPUs are AMD, and AMD comprises 7 out of the top 10. How many other retailers are "biased towards AMD"? :p
     
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  8. karma777police

    karma777police Active Member

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    AMD 7nm is not that great and it is good as Intel's 10 nm. 10nm will fully ramp up next year and they are already eachieving 4.1Ghz clock speed with it. Desktop part will still hit 5.0+ GHz. Also Desktop based on 10nm will have newer architecture and better IPC. Slightly better IPC puts Zen 2 behind in performance in non gaming scenarios. Zen 2 is already slower in gaming than the current Intel counterparts. I would not worry about Intel at all. Their 7nm will be chiplet based CPU and gluing two CPU together is something Intel started way before AMD came up with it as an idea. Anyone remembers Q6600 and Q6700, first quad core CPU? At the same time AMD is not going to act still but Intel is much more aggressive with performance improvements than AMD when they step on gas pedal. They will just have to learn how to compete again...10 years of nothing from AMD put Intel into sleep mode.
     
  9. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

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    I believe it when I see it. Oh and yes, LUL.
     
  10. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Tried-and-failed is a double-edged sword here, because like or not, Andrew LB is right about one thing: Intel is still dominating, and will continue to do so for a while. Retailers where you buy CPUs directly are a very small part of the CPU market. So small, that they were the first market Intel abandoned when they had that shortage. When you account for OEMs, Intel is still doing very well. Most people buy from OEMs, rather than build their own PCs. Also for the time being, it seems Intel is still getting more sales in servers. However, I think that's bound to change in the near future.
    Granted, laptops are somewhat of an exception. I think Intel still sells more mobile CPUs than AMD, but, AMD is catching up REALLY fast.
     

  11. D3M1G0D

    D3M1G0D Ancient Guru

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    I've stated before how DIY is a very small part of the market and that Intel dominates everywhere else. The issue I have with @Andrew LB is that he (repeatedly) makes the baseless assertion that retailers like Mindfactory.de are biased towards AMD, suggesting that it's a one-off and non-representative of other retailers. This is flat-out wrong, as data from Amazon.com (one of the largest American e-tailers) show. He either needs to back up this claim with hard evidence or admit that he is wrong.
     
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  12. waltc3

    waltc3 Master Guru

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    Ironically, when AMD sold its FABs to Global, I thought it was a bad move. I was wrong, as hindsight proves! Intel seems behind in not just process but also architecture--they are going to have to do what AMD did years ago--design new and competitive architectures with few or no vulnerabilities and get their production nodes in order. In the past when AMD leaped out ahead technically as with the K7/A64, Intel had to go back to the drawing board and when it did it came out swinging and surpassed AMD with AMD's own x86-64 approach (Intel wanted Itanium--ugh...). But this AMD has no intention of hanging out a shingle and milking as did the old AMD post A64--it appears they are going to relentlessly keep the R&D pedal to the metal--all the way through Zen 5, atm. That's most definitely a kind of competition Intel has never seen before. Should be interesting to watch, though! If AMD wants to displace Intel as top dog there is no other route available to them, imo! You know, how many years has it been since we've seen really cool stuff happening on the cpu front? Too long, eh?
     
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  13. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Fair enough.
     
  14. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    For 2020, maybe. For 2021, not so much.
    While intel knows how to make big monolithic dies, and may even know how to make good design for chiplets by those dates... It will be the total area => cost of those cards vs. achievable performance in certain power draw.
    And even if intel went for 300W card, those chip(let)s would need to be big, because 7nm did already run away in terms of power efficiency vs. clock.

    Their GPU design would have to be super good to compete with nVidia and AMD.
    While nVidia sits on 16(12)nm and manages to get similar performance per watt as AMD does on 7nm. AMD will improve due to many design changes in pipeline for next few years on their new uArch.
    nVidia will simply jump to EUV 7nm, get 2.0~2.4GHz out of the box as free performance upgrade at same transistor count just because there will be extra power draw budget to spend.

    Intel will have to compete against above with their 14nm++++(+). Yes, there is good chance that this limitation will force their engineers to think out of the box even more than AMD and nVidia do for their upcoming changes to GPUs. But that remains to be seen.
    It should be said that shop itself can only be biased to wards one brand by either not listing products from competition or refusing them to ship and persuading people to get that favored brand.
    (That's surely not the case here, we would have seen that on forums as people would complain about unfair practices.)

    And then 2nd point of view would be that AMD's loyal customers in Germany like to shop there.
    Since I have seen their AMD vs. intel prices, I see no reason to shop for AMD specifically there or evade intel on that shop.

    Last point may be advertising. Did they ever advertised themselves as best place to get AMD's CPU? That could surely explain inflated numbers. But I think those numbers are not inflated.

    Given numbers are just one of smaller sunsets of entire market with CPUs.
    Intel's server and notebook dominance actually confirm that data for DIY system builders are true. Otherwise AMD would have no other place to get that market share from.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2019
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  15. D3M1G0D

    D3M1G0D Ancient Guru

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    I see no reason to think Mindfactory.de is leaning towards AMD. The historical sales data makes this clear - when Intel released Coffee Lake, the site showed Intel absolutely dominating AMD (outselling almost two-to-one), which would be quite odd if they had a bias against Intel. Amazon.com also showed the 8700K dominating at this time so there's no reason to think it's a fringe site.

    At any rate, it's annoying how some Intel shills keep trotting this out - as if repeating it over and over again will somehow make it true. Fake news at its finest.
     
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  16. fry178

    fry178 Maha Guru

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    @Andrew LB
    fact is, part of the reason why intel dominates, is the amount of money they spend to keep amd out, and they have been fined multiple times for it.

    without that, numbers would be different.
    not even talking about the cash they put into r&d, which is multiple times what amd spends, and they still cant deliver more than ~10-15% better performance.
    or the fact that any person i know (in any way) that build a rig since 1st ryzen came out,
    switched from Intel to amd.
    no matter the Res (fhd/qhd) and/or refresh rate (60/120/144).

    reminds me of the mid 70s when american cars had a 7l V8 to get roughly 150hp, when a golf gti had that a 1.6l 4cyl to get similar performance..
     
    Last edited: Jul 21, 2019
  17. DmitryKo

    DmitryKo Master Guru

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    I don't understand this logic at all.

    The default sorting mode is Availability (Verfügbarkeit) and both AMD and Intel CPUs are listed on the first page, at least on my monitor; you can also choose Top Clicks (Topklicks), Reviews (Bewertungen), Name and Price by clicking the Sorting (Sortierung) button, and you can directly choose the Manufacturer (Hersteller).

    Customers shopping for retail CPUs typically research their buying decision well beforehand, so they either filter the list for specific sockets, number of cores etc., or look for specific brand and SKUs - and the product filter is also readily available on the Refine Search (Auswahl verfeinern) button at the top right side.

    How exactly such layout makes it hard or impossible to shop for Intel CPUs?

    These statistics are based on some online benchmarks results submitted from 2012 to 2019 - which should reflect the state of the enthusiast market where AMD simply did not exist in that period.

    Their current share of the x86 CPU market is estimated at 13-17% and that's a x1.5 increase year-to-year.
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2019
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  18. fry178

    fry178 Maha Guru

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    @DmitryKo
    hab net gewusst das du deutsch sprichst :eek:
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2019
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  19. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    Ja! wir stürmen Gebiet 51 heute! Schnel, komme rein!
     
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  20. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

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    Hab mich auch grad gwundert o_O
     
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