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High End Audiophile thread

Discussion in 'Soundcards, Speakers HiFI & File formats' started by ROBSCIX, Jan 2, 2013.

  1. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    Cheers. Makes HD58X more recommendable to people who new to higher end audio.
     
  2. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    Yes, however when it comes down to which is technically better or superior I feel there's no easy answer. Majority will probably prefer HD 58X tuning more (at least initially) though and it does have some pretty clear differences. HD 6XX has forward vocals which I kinda like. IMO HD 6XX has a bit wider soundstage too. Overall HD 6XX is a bit more refined. HD58X has more prominent sub bass while HD 6XX has more prominent mid bass.

    In any case though, I like both a lot. At the moment I'm using the HD 6XX now that my ears are starting to open up and I really do like them too (actually I like them more.....). Can't loose when you have both. :D
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2018
  3. Archvile82

    Archvile82 Active Member

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    Hi,

    I am using a creative SBX AE5, it sounds pretty good for what it is but I'm picking up slight noise when I have the volume high.

    Would using a Jack to duel XLR lead remedy this ? My amp supports balanced connections.

    Thanks
     
  4. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    If moving the wire to very different angles from the case doesnt change the nature of the noise then I doubt it.
     

  5. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    Creative may have opened up high end audio to everyone with the new BlasterX G6.
    https://us.creative.com/p/amplifiers/sound-blasterx-g6
    Its a USB 7.1 DAC, 32bit 384KHz with a dynamic range of 130dB.
    This isnt the same as s/n ratio which is probably up to 10dB less but its still very high for a 7.1 PC sound card, especially at only $150 !
    Edit:
    The s/n works out to 114dB (from the thd+n figure given). Not as high as I hoped but still very good for the price of this 7.1 DAC.

    Output impedance of 1 ohm, can drive up to 600ohm headphones with a separate amplifier for each channel.
    https://us.creative.com/p/amplifiers/sound-blasterx-g6
    It can even be used with consoles.

    While tiny enough to be portable it must be fed power via USB. This opens it up to using batteries as a power source for a cleaner sound.
    It only has 3.5mm minijack inputs and outputs, but for the size and price is acceptable.
    I'm eager to find how well it matches up to the best DACs pre 5 years ago.


    Full specs:
    (note they mixed the headphone output specs on the end of the ADC section)

    Specifications

    Weight
    144 g

    Interface/Power
    USB 2.0, USB Bus Powered

    DAC
    Dynamic Range: 130dB (A-weighted), THD+N: ~0.0002%,
    Sampling Rate (DSP Playback): PCM 16/24/32-bit / 44.1, 48.0, 88.2, 96.0kHz,
    Sampling Rate (Direct Mode Playback): PCM 16/24/32-bit / 44.1, 48.0, 88.2, 96.0, 176.4, 192.0, 352.8, 384.0 kHz,
    DoP 24-bit / 176.4 , 352.4 kHz

    ADC
    Dynamic Range: 114dB (A-weighted), THD+N: 0.0006%,
    Sampling Rate (Mic-in): 16/24/32-bit / 44.1, 48.0, 88.2, 96.0, 176.4, 192.0 kHz,
    Sampling Rate (Line-in, Optical-In): 16/24/32-bit / 44.1, 48.0, 88.2, 96.0, 176.4, 192.0 kHz,
    Output Impedance: 1 Ω, Supported Headphone Impedance: 16 - 600 Ω, High Gain: 150 - 600 Ω (+14dB), Low Gain: 16 - 149 Ω (+0dB)

    Audio Technology
    SB-Axx1™

    Connectivity Options (Main)
    1 x ⅛″ Line In/mini TOSLINK In Combo Jack, 1 x ⅛″ Line Out/mini TOSLINK Out Combo Jack, 1 x ⅛″ Headphone/Headset Jack, 1 x ⅛″ Ext. Mic In Jack, 1 x microUSB port for PC/Mac

    Audio Technologies
    Scout Mode

    Supported Operating Systems
    Windows® 7, Windows® 8, Windows Vista®, Windows® 8.1, Windows® 10, Mac OS X v10.8 and above

    Included Accessories
    microUSB cable, Mini TOSLINK Cable

    Dimensions
    111 x 70 x 24 mm

    ASIO
    Playback & Recording

    Recommended Usage
    Gaming
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2018
  6. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    It uses the same custom amp than AE-5 so it should be good.

    When using discreet amp and line out or AE-5's amp?
     
  7. Archvile82

    Archvile82 Active Member

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    When using discrete amp and line out I can hear pc interference when the volume is high, it's not enough to really affect the music but it's annoying it's there. Doesn't happen on my other devices.

    I haven't tried moving the cables to be honest, I'll have a look when my PC is back up and running. Currently down as I'm waiting for some parts.
     
  8. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    Ground issues can be a pain and in those cases external USB card might not even solve anything (unless you filter the USB power). Mine's just silent though. What amp are you using?

    AE-5:s amp is isolated differently from line-out. Chances are that it will not have those noises. It doesn't even touch the metal bracket.
     
  9. vf

    vf Ancient Guru

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    What is the definition of high volume? Loud that it hurts when you hear the interference through regular play or max when nothing plays?
     
  10. Archvile82

    Archvile82 Active Member

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    Sorry for the late reply, been busy with work but your replies are really appreciated.

    My amp is a marantz pm-11s3. I'll be more specific about the noise. I heard it when testing my headphones, I use the sound blaster headphone unit that came with my old zxr plugged into the headphone socket on the amp, when i have the volume at half way on the headphone unit I would hear the pc noise ( hard disk electrical noise or when you move the mouse pitch goes higher ). Now the music does drown out the noise but I feel it's affecting the quality somewhat. I think it's an earthing issue somewhere.

    I got a chance to buy the marantz sa 11s3, this has a built in dac and was thinking of using that on my pc as I'd imagine it would be much better than the creative card and at the same time may resolve the noise as it's external usb device.

    What's your thoughts on this ?
     

  11. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    You have ground loop issues or something. Getting and usb dac wouldn't necessarily solve those since the interference might come through unless the external one doesn't take power from the PC or if you do not use some kind of power filter. Though in case of that particular super expensive Marantz thingy that shouldn't not happen.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2018
  12. Archvile82

    Archvile82 Active Member

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    The dac I'm thinking of getting would have an external power source but I'm not sure on that now as I'm not sure about windows 10 comparability.

    Once my new gfx card arrives im going to re wire the case as I was initially in rush when I built it as I wanted to make sure it worked. Ill also invest in a new line cable too as the I'm using doesn't look that great on closer inspection.

    I'll let you know how it pans out
     
  13. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    One option would be to use the headphone out with low gain. It's handled a bit differently than the line out (it doesn't tough the back bracket for example). If that fixes it then it might confirm some kind of case grounding issues.
     
  14. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    About what I said before. I did learn one thing: I should keep my mouth shut about any audio related stuff when having a flu. Obviously it affects hearing (constant popping when swallowing, pressure etc.). :confused: I hate giving potentially confusing or inaccurate information.

    The thing is. I'd personally pick HD 6XX over HD 58X even if there was a 150 € price difference.

    The HD 6XX has better imaging, positioning, separation, depth and soundstage. It's just more refined. On HD 6XX the vocals seem to spread wider and the don't have unnatural hardness to them. It's more detailed across the board. HD 58X's tuning makes it sound like it has clarity and sharpness but it's somewhat artificial sounding (compared to HD 6XX) and it doesn't mean that it's more resolving (it is not). HD 6XX is so close to the ideal that I often feel like turning my head just to check where the sound came. Also the HD 6XX can produce subtle detail that just gets lost on HD 58X. And about grain, HD 6XX definitely has less (really smooth texture).

    With HD 58X it always feels like I'm listening a headphone. HD 6XX is never fatiguing which help with the immersion, HD 58X can be a bit or it's on the edge (which is not ideal to my ear and not natural). The tuning is definitely closer to reality on HD 6XX at least to my ear - it's so close that it manages to fool me. HD 6XX is the first headphone where I can really sense the depth and space. It's quite magical. And the smooth mids and awesome vocals... Vocals are HD 58X's weak point. It handles drums very nicely though. HD 58X has more sub bass in quantity but the difference is not large. HD 58X has more V shaped tuning.

    If I compare HD 6XX to HD 595, the HD 6XX annihilates it in every possible way imaginable to my ears (soundstage including). These just totally ruined the HD 595 for me. :p Honestly, the difference in quality is absolutely massive. HD 595 has one advantage over HD 58X: vocals and how vocals fill space. In terms of driver performance HD 58X is easily ahead.

    (Depending on what source/amp you use YMMV, HD 58X is not picky so you can take it to trip and it will sound fine straight from the phone).
     
    sverek and Mufflore like this.
  15. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    ty for providing detailed feedback.

    Hope you feel better my dude. Flu sucks.
     

  16. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    It wasn't the worst flue I've had but lasted over two weeks in some form. Started with sore throat, then came the fever and then the faucets opened so to speak. Went back to work too early... had to take one day off in the middle of the week. I honestly was a mess when I was there. Had quite a bit of fever too - I thought it was over... It wasn't. It's highly unlikely that I get another one this year, which is nice. :cool:

    Zeos did HD 58X review:



    It would be nice to do some AB testing with HD 660 S. I'd expect HD 660 S to have advantage in other areas even though the tuning is quite similar (HD 58X bass hits hardest and deepest out of any HD 6xx series though). I doubt that it's worth the 350 €/$350 price difference though (I mean, really, you can buy three HD 58X for the price of one HD 660 S)... Comparing HD 650 and HD 58X (or HD 660 S) directly is harder since the tuning is noticeably different so personal preferences will matter more.

    Doesn't matter which you get, HD 58X and HD 6XX buyers will definitely be happy.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2018
  17. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    Take Zeos reviews with mountain pile of salt. His reviews lately are very emotional and I think he just says whatever he feels like on that day.
    However I do find his reviews interesting, he brings some interesting points and says what other reviewers might not thought of, and he seems honest about it.

    Beside that, HD58X are amazing in a fact they can stand their ground against HD600 series. I just hope it was more available. Would love to have it.
    Might consider HD58X or HD600 after I get proper standalone DAC/AMP. Eyeballing topping a30/d30 right now.
     
  18. Mufflore

    Mufflore Ancient Guru

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    The guy I bought my 650 from was selling them because he bought the 660s.
    He explained this and wasnt pleased how little difference there is when the cost is so high.
    Yeah, probably wise to check them out before purchase.
    fyi
     
  19. Anarion

    Anarion Ancient Guru

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    If you like bass, I'd probably stay away from the HD 600. HD 58X will hit A LOT harder and deeper while HD 650 is somewhere in between. I'm not a basshead but I wouldn't want less bass than what these two can offer.

    HD 58X is way ahead of any HD 5xx series in terms of performance. It's rather... interesting situation.

    Personally I'd consider Sound BlasterX G6 over Topping A30/D30 combo. Topping A30 has rather high output impedance and on paper the G6's DAC is superior.
     
  20. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    I am not sure how much of actual value that Sound Blaster gaming toy. Too much useless features, and I already got sound card.

    I just need quality decoder and amplifier.
     

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