Help on buying budget low-end gaming laptop

Discussion in 'Laptops & Notebooks' started by 3DGuy, Mar 17, 2006.

  1. 3DGuy

    3DGuy Master Guru

    Messages:
    370
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    HIS ATI Radeon 9600 XT 128MB 8x TV-
    Hello everyone,

    First of all my main budget is preferabbly $1000+ or below

    I have been having problems choosing to what kind of budget laptop would suit best for a college/partial gamer. I am not targetting for a hardcore gaming machine, I'm just targetting for a laptop that can play recent dx9 games at playable framerates even at lowest settings ( im talking about 640x480 res with uber low settings). All I'd care is that it should be able to play the recent dx9 games like hl2, farcy, splinter cell, etc.

    My first choice was to get the ASUS A6500R which has Celeron M 380 1.6ghz and an ati xpress 200m w/ built-in ati x200, ddr2 memory. It priced at $800 flat (we have different currencies so i just did a rough estimation in US dollars).

    And because I really heard alot of bad things about Celeron (for gaming purposes) and people seem to hate it so much here because I think it really performs poorly on gaming, I tried looking for a budgetted Turion64 laptop from Redfox, it had a Turion64 ( really didnt see how many ghz) with a VIA V8M800 with builtin 64Mb VIA S3 Graphics UniChrome™ Pro IGP - this is the main thing that is still confusing me because I really have little info about the UniChrome graphics whether it can match with the ati x200. Also the redfox laptop had plain DDR PC3200 (no ddr2, not really important though).

    Lastly because of the Celeron-neglection thing in here I'm already insecured about celerons because Im worried that hl2 might not even run or be playable (1fps omg!!). I tried alternatives and stumbled upon the Intel Centrino with chipsets that has the builtin Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 900. I've seen some reviews from websites and they say that it only has software vertex shader which in turn makes a very non-reputable builtin video card for gaming. It scored lower than other builtin video cards.

    From the 3 builtin video cards which is really a good combination?

    Celeron M 380 1.6ghz + ATI X200M
    OR
    Turion64 + VIA UniChrome Pro IGP
    OR
    Intel Centrino 1.7ghz + Intel GMA 900

    I'd like to stress out that I'd only want framerates here (pure performance) and not quality. I'm really having a hard time to choose between the 3.

    So guys which should I really buy? (NOTE that I don't live in the US and I really cant browse much laptops here because stocks are very limited, scarce and expensive than in the US).

    Thanks

    ---
    Also I searched the forums and found a Compaq V5000Z, its exactly like the ASUS A6R but with a hell alot better processor and with almost HALF THE PRICE!!! I'd only wish I could buy it in here but it is nowhere to be found :(
     
  2. nm+

    nm+ Don Cappuccino

    Messages:
    10,405
    Likes Received:
    19
    GPU:
    old
    None of em. They're all shared/Intergrated systems. They will all not run modern games.
    If you can just bump up with a few hundred dollars and you're in. Or if ypu could do used, $1000 could more than buy my notebook with a 1.7 P-M (Dothan) and a 9700 128MB (this was a very common combination), which will make mince meat out of those.
    You want an ati (9600, 9700, or x600 or better) or nvidia (5600, 5700, or 6600 or better) card. Nothing else will do modern games well.
     
  3. Darkasantion

    Darkasantion Master Guru

    Messages:
    982
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    Club 3D HD5870 1035/1325
    I'll have the same budget in Euro's xD
    And because of the fact that I wanted a AMD in it, I just like them more:dave:
    I had even less choice, however after a bit of searching I found this little baby!:)
    Acer Aspire 5024WLMi (Turion 1.8GHz; 512MB; 80GB; 15,4"TFT; WXP Home, X700Mobile 128MB VRAM(Whats VRAM:nerd: ?))

    Greetz Darkasantion
     
  4. PrinceGaz

    PrinceGaz Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    2
    GPU:
    GF8800GTS 640MB @ stock
    If it was a serious question, VRAM simply means video RAM.

    For the original poster, I wouldn't choose any of those laptops as the graphics performance is very weak in all of them due to using integrated solutions. If they were the only three computers in the entire universe to choose from and you wanted to run games, the first one (Celeron M 380 with ATI Xpress 200M chipset) would be the best of a poor selection because ATI have better graphics drivers than Intel or VIA and the performance is probably also better (which is to say it will run three year old games at moderate settings).
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2006

  5. SorienOR

    SorienOR Guest

    Messages:
    6,432
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    BFG 8800GT + Acer 1080p
    The only really decent gaming laptop that can be had on a budget is the Dell Inspiron 6000 with the 128mb X300. Currently they have a sale on where you can get one with a 1.7 Pentium-M, 512mb ram, 40gb hard drive, dvd-burner and the video card for $699 (they are on closeout due to dual-core replacement).

    For around $1100 us you can get the Acer 4400-series with a turion and a X700.
     
  6. 3DGuy

    3DGuy Master Guru

    Messages:
    370
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    HIS ATI Radeon 9600 XT 128MB 8x TV-
    Well $700 for a centrino with x300 laptop is just fantastic, the prob is that the price in here goes like 2x the price than in the US... and I can't find a decent laptop in here, almost all laptops sold in shops are with Intel GMA 900, its like an oasis in finding a laptop with mobility radeon or geforce go, even if I find one, the price is just way too expensive (imagine a laptop with ati mobility radeon x600 + centrino 1.7ghz with a price tag of $2700+ in here)...

    And imagine that you said that there's a $699 laptop with a decent x300.. wow

    So I guess im stuck with that ASUS A6R.

    Thanks for all the info!

    By the way, can you guys give me some benchmarks with laptops that have integrated video cards? I really wanted some benchmarks with ati xpress 200m or with celerons.
     
  7. Mr.Bigtime

    Mr.Bigtime Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    20,791
    Likes Received:
    11
    GPU:
    4090 on Laptop
    mine is 1490 $ in here,Turkey.technological products are much more expensive than other countries os u may find this cheaper there.
    its a FUJITSU SIEMENS AmıLO 1451G with 1.86GHZ 1GB ram and 64MB (not integrated ;) ) x300 ;)
     
  8. PrinceGaz

    PrinceGaz Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    2
    GPU:
    GF8800GTS 640MB @ stock
    There is a big difference between a desktop Celeron and a mobile Celeron M. The desktop Celeron is a Pentium 4 with half the cache which really hurts its performance. The mobile Celeron M is essentially a Pentium M (as used in the Centrino platform) with less cache as well, but the Pentium M is not especially cache sensitive so the Celeron M performs not much worse than a similarly clocked Pentium M. A Celeron M at 1.6GHz will be more than adequate for gaming on a notebook, not far behind a Pentium M/Centrino at 1.7GHz. Having said that, even a rubbish desktop Celeron at 1.6GHz would be more than enough for gaming on a notebook with integrated graphics (I'm not joking either).

    If you really want to know how fast (or rather slow) those integrated graphics solutions are, here goes from slowest to fas..., erm not so slowest :)

    VIA/S3 Unichrome Pro IGP - this is dreadfully slow even compared to the other two. It will manage to score about 800 in 3DMark2001 at default settings, which would have been considered quite good back in 1998 but slow by 2000. It'll be adequate for games like Quake 3 or Half Life (original version) at moderate settings, but will struggle with anything more recent (they'll probably crash).

    Intel 915GM/GMS, 910GML (GMA900) - this is better, it'll manage about 3600 in 3DMark2001, but only about 1000 in 3DMark03. It supports DX9 pixel-shaders in hardware (and vertex-shaders in software so your CPU will be kept extra busy) but it doesn't really matter as it is too slow to play any DX9 games at above slideshow speeds. The DX9 support should be adequate for Vista's Aero interface, at least in theory. If you can remember the old GeForce 3 graphics card, then the GMA900 is about half as fast as that. Or if you can remember the older GeForce 2 and budget 2MX, the GMA900 is somewhere in the middle of them performance-wise but also supports shaders. Okay for games released up until about 2001-2.

    ATI Radeon Xpress 200M - the best of the bunch, marginally faster than the GMA in 3DMark2001 scoring around 3700, but better DX9 performance getting it 1500 in 3DMark03. That's nearly as fast as a standard Geforce FX5200 or Radeon9600SE, the budget cards of 2003. No good for playing todays demanding games but okay for games released back then. The drivers will also be more robust than those from Intel and especially VIA so crashes are less likely.

    If I were you I'd save up for something with at least an X300, preferably X700 or equivalent. If you can't then I'd recommend you forget about getting a notebook and find space for a desktop system as you have much more flexibility and get a lot more for your money. With a flat-panel monitor all you need is to find a bit of space under your desk for the box, you must have room for that!

    Hope some of the above info helps.
     
  9. 3DGuy

    3DGuy Master Guru

    Messages:
    370
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    HIS ATI Radeon 9600 XT 128MB 8x TV-
    Well I guess my choice is the ASUS A6R since I really didnt know that Celeron M and the desktop Celeron have some distinct differences, so a Celeron M is not really bad compared to a Pentium M?

    Also that I'm buying a laptop for mobility purposes, I already have a decent desktop that can play latest games with no probs at all. (FEAR, Quake4, etc.). Well you did mention that the X200 would be the best choice over the 3 integrated video solutions, so I'm gonna pick the ASUS A6R.

    Thanks for the detailed feedback PrinceGaz. It really helped alot, thanks for clearing it up for me. :)
     
  10. PrinceGaz

    PrinceGaz Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,052
    Likes Received:
    2
    GPU:
    GF8800GTS 640MB @ stock
    Please don't forget the overwhelming theme of my post, that none of the three integrated solutions would even be considered "slow" by todays standards on a site like Guru3d; the X200M is at best very slow and the rest aren't even worth thinking about.

    That's not to say the X200M can't play a lot of great games very well indeed; it can. There are hundreds of top-rated games it will play fantastically, but we're talking about games that are several years old and I know a lot of guys seem to think anything over a year old isn't worth playing. Just be aware that if you go for that Asus laptop that you will not be able to play the games you enjoy on your desktop box like FEAR or Quake 4, even at 640x480 at minimum settings. Those games will be strictly for your desktop machine.

    If the laptop is for casual gaming and general usage, then out of those three choices the Asus is the best bet. The Celeron M is a good processor that combines most of the performance and power-saving features of the Pentium M as I mentioned before so you needn't worry about that. It'll run office-type applications very well. The integrated ATI graphics have very good drivers thanks to graphics-cards being ATI's core business, and I've told you what to expect performance-wise.

    The only other things to watch for are the amount of memory, and whether the hard-disk is large enough. 512MB should be considered a requirement, and you might want to go for 1GB if the work you do on it is likely to require several apps open simultaneously. Hard-disk space requirements I'm sure you can work out for yourself, it probably won't need to be more than the basic size as your desktop box will have a much faster and larger HD where anything you're not going to use for a while can be kept.

    Of course the other thing to bear in mind is battery life, I imagine that Asus laptop offers runtimes similar to its competitors but I haven't checked. The Celeron M is an efficient processor and the Xpress 200 integrated graphics chipset will take very little power, so provided the rest of the system is well designed and it comes with a decent battery, you should be fine.
     

  11. k4t4n4

    k4t4n4 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,133
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    B
    I would save some money..
     
  12. Infested Nexus

    Infested Nexus Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,782
    Likes Received:
    1
    GPU:
    AMD Radeon™ HD 8850M
    Laptop Suggestions.

    Lower end of your price range:

    Compaq Presario V2000Z
    [​IMG]

    $794.99 (As Configured Below)

    -AMD Turion(TM) 64 ML-32 (1.8GHz/512KB L2 Cache)
    -ATI RADEON(R) XPRESS 200M w/productivity ports (128MB shared)
    -512MB DDR SDRAM
    -80 GB 5400 RPM Hard Drive
    -DVD/CD-RW Combo Drive

    (You can choose options as you fit, probably wise to get additional 512 RAM off of newegg or such rather than opt for the 512 from Compaq as it would be cheaper. Upgrading the processor to the ML-34 for +$40 is also a good idea as the increased L2 cache will improve performance quite nicely)

    At price point:

    Fujitsu A3040
    [​IMG]

    $999

    -AMD Turion 64 ML-37(2.0GHz)
    -512MB DDR
    -100GB
    -Dual-Layer Multi-Format DVD Writer
    -Integrated ATI Mobility Radeon X300 (HyperMemory up to 128MB)

    Slightly over price point:
    Acer TM4404WLMi
    [​IMG]

    $1149

    -AMD Turion64 ML-34 (1.8GHz)
    -1GB DDR
    -120GB HD
    -DVD-Super Multi double-layer drive
    -ATI Mobility Radeon X700 64MB

    Slightly over price point:
    Acer AS5672WLMi
    [​IMG]

    $1179

    -Intel Core DuoT2300(1.66GHz)
    -1GB DDR2
    -100GB HD
    -DVD Super Multi
    -ATI MOBILITY Radeon X1400 128MB DDR

    The last laptop is slightly abouve 1k but the X700 is superior to the other offerings my an order of magnitude.The Compaq can be configured to be under 1k with a lot of good options but you will still be restricted by the integrated graphics. The Fujitsu has some nice features like a large HD and an entry level X300, better than the xpress200m but still extremely inferior to the X700. The Aspire features the x1400 128MB which would fall between an X600 and X700 in terms of performance, however the Aspire also features the new Core Duo processor which is a real selling point. Though it is slightly more expensive, if you look at what you are getting - the price/performance ratio is very good.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2006
  13. Mr.Bigtime

    Mr.Bigtime Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    20,791
    Likes Received:
    11
    GPU:
    4090 on Laptop
    my laptop gets 1601 point from 3dmark05
     
  14. 3DGuy

    3DGuy Master Guru

    Messages:
    370
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    HIS ATI Radeon 9600 XT 128MB 8x TV-
    Here's an update for everybody:

    I've searched hard and hard in here to find the most budgetted laptop with dedicated video card and I found a generic (whitebox/DIY or whatever you call it) that is a barebone with the Mobility Radeon X600.

    Here is what the barebone is called with its specs:

    Apex DL76
    > supports 400/533MHz FSB, Intel 915PM chipset, DDR2, 15.4" WXGA display, ATI Radeon Mobility x600 128Mb PCI-E, 10/100Mbps LAN, 56Kb Modem, 3 x USB 2.0, PCMCIA, Firewire 1394, S-Video, IR, 3-in-one Card Reader, SPDIF, includes a DVD writer (8x Dual Layer), 8-cell Li-Ion battery, 2.87Kgs.
    > PhP 41,888.00 == converted to US$ it is $800

    With just the entire chassis with Mobility Radeon X600, it costs about $800 (I know the price is really higher compared to other countries, but its the cheapest that I found). Since the barebone doesn't have a processor, memory, hdd and wifi I have to make sure it doesnt go off my budget. Now my options to let it reach at a maximum $1000 are these:

    Celeron® M Processor 360 (1.40GHz, 1Mb Cache, 400MHz FSB)
    PhP 05,950.00 -- $116
    512Mb DDR2 -- PhP 03,350.00 or $65
    Seagate Momentus 040Gb PATA -- PhP 03,550.00 or $69
    Wifi -- not really ready to purchase this since it isnt exactly needed to run a laptop.

    So the addons cost $116 + $65 + $69 = $250
    Added to the barebone $800 + $250 = $1050

    It floats somewhere at $1000 to $1100, what do you guys think about this build?

    Also, the salesman told me that it isn't good to buy generic laptops since it doesnt have BIOS updates?? Is it really critical to have BIOS updates? Or the salesman is trying to salestalk me onto buying $2000+ laptops which has same spec but branded?

    Any reviews with the Mobility X600? Hows it compared to its newer counterparts? (compared to nVidia 7xxx go series and ATI X1xxx series specially for the X1300 and X1400)

    Sorry for all of these hassle questions but I really need some good advice here! :D

    Thanks!
     
  15. Infested Nexus

    Infested Nexus Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,782
    Likes Received:
    1
    GPU:
    AMD Radeon™ HD 8850M
    In terms of performance the MR X600 is closer to the MR X300 than the MR X700. Like the MR X300 its a 4 pipeline card but runs at higher clockspeeds than the MR X300. It is outperformed by the MR X1400, not sure about the MR X1300.

    The salesman is trying to sell you a more expensive laptop. BIOS updates are available from the vendor of the barebone.

    $1050 for a Celeron machine with 512MB RAM and an X600 isn't that great of a deal (see laptops in previous post), though this may attributed to geographic location - where exactly do you live?
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2006

  16. aircool

    aircool Don Aircooleone Staff Member

    Messages:
    13,763
    Likes Received:
    30
    GPU:
    Zotac GTX 560 Ti 448 Core
    it will be ok but you could pin mod ure celeron and overclock it

    and bios updates are crucial
     
  17. nm+

    nm+ Don Cappuccino

    Messages:
    10,405
    Likes Received:
    19
    GPU:
    old
    x600 is equivent to a 9600
     
  18. Infested Nexus

    Infested Nexus Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,782
    Likes Received:
    1
    GPU:
    AMD Radeon™ HD 8850M
    Rather, the Mobility Radeon X600 is roughly equivalent in performance to the Radeon 9600 Pro (desktop).
     
  19. 3DGuy

    3DGuy Master Guru

    Messages:
    370
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    HIS ATI Radeon 9600 XT 128MB 8x TV-
    Well I do have my 9600XT in my desktop, would it be better than the Mobility X600? I'm actually after a cheap laptop that would equalize or at least catch up with the performance of my old desktop (note: i already have my 9600XT for 2 years now it isnt that new anymore and I'm expecting that a cheap gaming laptop would be better than my desktop since it is indeed old).

    Also about the BIOS updates... I don't know much about these, why is it so important? Since I'm a desktop user I don't actually update my mainboard BIOS -- actually I updated my BIOS only once (and it didnt had an actual bug/problem, just wanted to see it updated).

    The barebone manufacturer is a third party group, they are mostly hidden, no website, no information, just the name "APEX" that mysteriously floats up on other computer shops. Anyhow, even if they server generic barebone laptops, does the mainboard thats going to come with it (Intel 915PM) would most likely be BIOS updateable? I mean if I could know the mainboard would I be download latest BIOS updates? Please explain me more about BIOS updates and laptops since this is where I lack information.

    For the price -- geographically I think the $1050 with MR X600 and Celeron M is a deal because I live in Philippines and I live on a 3rd world country so I guess that explains the prices. Heck a $800 Dell Inspiron E1505 with Duo Core and X1400 horridly costs $1700+ here, its like 2.1x the price. I wish I could smack those nasty merchants here in the face =). Seriously its pissing me off.

    And the pin mod? What would that be? Any links is it safe or recommended? Squeezing a few mhz would probably do =)
     
  20. boomheadshot45

    boomheadshot45 Active Member

    Messages:
    95
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    soon to come, HIS X1900XT
    i would get a really cheap dell with a x300
     

Share This Page