Flight Simulator 2020 Won't Even Fit on ten double-layer DVDs

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Jul 16, 2020.

  1. 0blivious

    0blivious Ancient Guru

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    I am reminded of the early 90s. 14 floppy disks for an installation. 13 disks, and 45 minutes later...

    Data error reading drive A:\
    Abort, Retry, Fail? __
     
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  2. EspHack

    EspHack Ancient Guru

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    it seems there's a tech gap even within the tech sector...

    I don't even use usb drives anymore, 2x2 wifi ac can do almost 80MB/s, file transfers have never been easier, we are about to get the whole globe covered in 1gbps thanks to starlink and whoever else decides to compete, and yet we have some big ass company shipping half a game on some disc just to ask the user to download the rest anyway, and the "next gen" console stuff is also packing discs that will probably get as much use as firewire on pcs

    how do you even get a disc reader on a computer modern enough to run that game if you supposedly have no connection available? I've been to pretty remote areas and still wondered whats the point of getting a big game shipped in physical media if that would take weeks anyway, just like downloading 100gb over a 1mbps connection

    the only justification i can imagine is data capped users having to pay x10 the price to the ISP rather than a shipping company, which is a whole nother level of idiosincrasy
     
  3. TLD LARS

    TLD LARS Member Guru

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    Starlink is not going to be 1gbps anytime soon.
    My wireless internet record is 120mbps and i have 200 meters to the mast, there is no way a satellite 500km away is going to beat that, even if the signal goes directly up and down again at best case scenario.
    The International space station apparently got upgraded to 600mbps, but the ping can be up to half a second, it makes no sense that a private person can buy a starlink uplink and get better internet then a dedicated link between earth and ISS.
     
  4. Sandy Bridge

    Sandy Bridge New Member

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    This reminds me of when Encarta was offered on both CD-ROM and DVD-ROM. You had your choice of which medium you wanted, and the consequent change in number of discs.

    I don't know if there's enough of a market for Blu-Rays, and for Flight Sim, to justify both, though.

    For USB, it makes me wonder how easy it is to mass produce software on USB sticks. Microsoft does it for Windows, but is it as easy as with DVDs, where you could simply hire someone to print 100,000 copies, or buy the machines to produce 100,000 copies in-house? Looking at prices, it looks like USB would also add a few dollars to the BOM, which is likely why they've stuck with optical media. It's less of an impact on a $130 or $200 copy of Windows than on a $60 piece of software with a smaller addressable market.
     

  5. Sandy Bridge

    Sandy Bridge New Member

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    Starlink is in much lower orbit than the ISS, or most other satellite providers. That's why the latency is going to be halfway decent. Starlink also is going to have 12,000 satellites. So if we take that 600 Mbps figure, and multiply it by 12,000, it's a lot of bandwidth. And that's before factoring in that they will be optimized for providing an Internet connection.

    The tradeoff being that it takes a lot of rockets to launch 12,000 satellites. But while you're right that a claim of 1 Gbps to the house needs a citation, at least in terms of latency Starlink is likely to be better than the ISS.
     
  6. nizzen

    nizzen Maha Guru

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    *They download BR on torrentsites :p
     
  7. wavetrex

    wavetrex Maha Guru

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    ISS link is being bounced of NASA's Space Network.
    It's not a direct connection to the ground.

    The ground only has 2 points (US, Guam (Pacific)) which are permanently linked to 12 satellites on a much higher orbit that the ISS itself (22000 km)
    https://www.nasa.gov/directorates/heo/scan/services/networks/sn
    https://esc.gsfc.nasa.gov/projects/SN?tab=sn fleet operations

    ISS maintains that link all the time without interruption, by having "visibility" with at least one of these hop satellites 24/24.

    ---
    StarLink will be just Ground -> Sat -> Ground for most connections, so really just 1000 km max wave travel.
    That is only 3.3 ms actual propagation time, with the rest of the latency being the equipment themselves and the fiber between all the ground nodes.

    Completely different technology and completely different way of doing things.

    ---
    What is certain is that they won't be playing MS FlightSim 2020 on the space station ^.^
     
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  8. blkspade

    blkspade Master Guru

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    The people that want this on physical media would likely just buy an external blu-ray drive, if MS made that the media choice. I have one that I bought 2 years ago. They are already actively pressing BR disks for console. Consider all the other accessories you ultimately end up buying just for a flight sim, that will largely only serve that purpose. Yoke/Stick/throttle, rudder pedals, head tracking, radio/mfd panels.
     
  9. Venix

    Venix Maha Guru

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    It can fit on a micro sd thought.
     
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  10. geogan

    geogan Master Guru

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    How the hell is a production house/factory going to write & verify 150 GB of data onto an SD card then and reproduce this 1000 or 10,000 times for mass production eh?? Do you realize how long that would take??

    There is a reason printed discs are convenient for mass reproduction... they are writen once to master mold and then stamp reproduced without having to write each disc individually.

    Do people think before they type....
     

  11. wavetrex

    wavetrex Maha Guru

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    Yeah, and all those copies are not CRC checked before being shipped...
    They are just shipping disks straight of the stamping press, fingers crossed that they don't contain any stamping error.


    Do people think before they type....
     
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  12. Venix

    Venix Maha Guru

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    Relax i was kidding to show how tricky can be with the marketing you have the company saying it will not fit on 10 dl dvds and you think a pile of dvds and seems impressive. Alternatively you can show a picture of tiny puny micro sd and write ... They could not even fill this tiny micro sd ! I did not even think of mass production at all ... Neither was my intention really. My intention was to show that the amount of dvds needed is the most useless information you can have in 2020 now if they come and say 150gb disk space required then yeah we have useful info !

    You really need to relax Oo
     
  13. geogan

    geogan Master Guru

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    Kidding? We are supposed to infer all that extra information from that one line you typed?

    p.s. Don't tell someone online to relax
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2020
  14. Venix

    Venix Maha Guru

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    @geogan no all you had to do is figure out out is that i was not serious , i just went on to explain my full reasoning .

    P.s. oh it that so ? Please send me a list with your rules about what i am allowed to say online and i will abide .(and since apparently i need to state such things ...that was sarcasm)
     
  15. n9nu

    n9nu Member

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    LOL

    First, Microsoft Flight Simulator was/is the longest running 'game/sim' of all time. No other title can claim anything close. There is an obvious reason for the data size of course. The most appropriate method to get is to download it of course. For those that cannot (and there are many) the next logical solution is a simple, cheap USB 3.0 key/thumb drive. They are a dime a dozen and it sure as hell beats installing dual layer DVD's. Optical media is just obsolete....whether it be CD/DVD/DVD/BR/etc. You will see the option to buy it via USB in the near future.

    The verification or check-sums of the data once its written is just like any other process. It's automated.


    FYI: The ISS uses a much faster and 'error free' method to xfer data: LASERS. In particular; O.P.A.L.S.- Optical PAyload for Lasercomm Science

    No need for traditional 'RF' as in radio waves within the microwave band when we have a beam of light :) This new system will replace conventional methods of communications in the near future.

    Tim Dickerson, PhD
    ARS N9NU
     

  16. Mineria

    Mineria Ancient Guru

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    Won't be that big of a deal with the right equipment for mass preloading, question is more if people are willing to pay the price.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2020
  17. tsunami231

    tsunami231 Ancient Guru

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    man even if you have 400+ mbit connection or even gbit that long downloaded, Internets speed are still to slow alot people lucky to have 100mbit. this why I still prefer disc copies which is great for consoles cause they use bluray, but pc still use DVD i dont even think many pc that come with optical drive actual use bluray to being with it?

    Not surpised by the size I had few fight sims that use real world terrian data and the data was alot bigger then actual game data and that back before "HD and 4k" assets were a thing
     
  18. tsunami231

    tsunami231 Ancient Guru

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    last i check that require direct line site for the to work, might be faster then anything we got, but how l feasible is gona be to replace everything if it require direct los for laser?
     
  19. Fender178

    Fender178 Ancient Guru

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    Not too surprised by how big the game is. There are a lot of big capacity games out there. And the graphics of this game look amazing.
    Because not many users have Blu-Ray drives in their PCs and even users having DVD drive is even becoming a niche market now a days. Majority of users don't have an optical drive in their PCs.
     
  20. Alessio1989

    Alessio1989 Ancient Guru

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    And probably could be cheaper and faster to read. Unfortunately SD card have a higher failing rate than DVD-ROMs... A USB stick could be also a solution (with the same failing rate problems). They choose the DVDs 'cause the target wants the game on optical discs.
     

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