DVI output & 60Hz refreshrate

The BIG question.
How to simulate the Linux option "AllowNon60HzDFPModes", witch I trying to find out unsucesfully. Looks like the TMDS encoder on my poor FX5600XT card fall into some category that says "60Hz only" in all Forceware drivers I tested (45.28, 53.03 WHQ, 81.95 WHQ)...
I see two ways to get more that 60Hz. Okay, there.
1) modify the drivers somehow to disable the check, as the Linux option does
2) modify the BIOS in my FX5600XT to report more modern TMDS encoder, witch is allowed to use higher refreshrates over DVI
3) buy new GFX card - friend 7300GS with the very same monitor and some 75.xx Forceware drivers do 72 or 75Hz refresh w/o a glitch

Yet since these card are not AGP and the FX5600XT got passive (nice quiet Zalman) cooling, the option no. 3 is not very viable one...

Okay, in fact, there is also option no. 4: use Linux, where things (probably) work!

Oh, well.

The Linux drivers only have the very fortunate possibility of override the default settings by the "AllowNon60HzDFPModes" option that let the driver bypass the checks and allow any refreshrate to be set, and hence drive the TMDS to or even over it's limits.
(I heard that it produce funny digital noise effects, if you go over it's capabilities, hehe)

So basically it looks like that I have to search where the "60Hz refresh only on this chip" option of nVidia drivers is stored and then modify it (on installed drivers) and/or then go and modify the drivers to save the option as I want it - eg. leaving up to the user, how hard he want to drive his TMDS

 

Actually, everyone is right; while most LCD's can now go higher then 60Hz, they can only do so at certain resolutions (EG: My Samsung T240HD can get 75Hz at 1600x1200, but only 60 at 1980x1200). Check you're moniter manual, as it should list what Refresh Rates are avaliable at which resolutions.

FYI, the reason LCD's have lower Refresh Rates is because of the relativly high pixel Response Time; a 16ms Response Time ~ 60 pixel state changes per second, hence 60FPS. The standard is currently 8ms for good moniters, but as pixel Response Time is not uniform, you can still get pixel lag (ghosting) at higher Refresh Rates.

 

Jezus christ... dude... again?! In the second post I already stated that my BenQ FP75G LCD panel do support 76Hz refreshrate. Can't you read? It have 5mS response time!
http://www.superwarehouse.com/BenQ_F...P75G/p/1497679

On Linux is possible to override the artificial nVidia limit by using "AllowNon60HzDFPModes" paramater. I want the same for Windows. Clear now?

 

My guess is it's a hardware limitation by either the Gfx card or the Monitor - normally I would say the monitor because of the reasons in the above post.

BUT:

You mentioned that forcing the refresh rate gave you a BSOD - if that's the case then you may need to look at your card, because monitors don't cause BSOD regardless of the refresh rate.


Have you actually tried to adjust the refresh rate on the monitor itself? If you can't then it's obviously a limitation of your monitor, regardless of what monitor your friend has.

Unless your friend has a 5600 then you can't compare.

Either way, I don't think your drivers are the problem.

 

I give up arguing. Obviously, I hit a wall. 60Hz is not normal, people. That it is.

How I can "adjust the refresh rate on the monitor itself" is really beyond me.


...


My BenQ FP75G LCD panel do support 75Hz refreshrate, it have 5mS response time.

http://www.superwarehouse.com/BenQ_F...P75G/p/1497679

On Linux is possible to override the artificial nVidia limit by using "AllowNon60HzDFPModes" paramater. I want the same for Windows.

 

Is that screenshot taken on your PC, with your FP75G connected?


Hey your copy of PowerStrip - is that a demo version or r is it registered?

It's possible your EDID info is faulty but you need a registered version of PowerStrip to be able to overwrite it...

http://74.125.153.132/search?q=cach...q+76+CA&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=nz&client=opera

 

Yes, that it is.
Demoversion, but it dost NOT even unlock the 60Hz slider at all, in any cases. Demo shoudl, it should not allow saving, but testing...

What you saying does not make sense. There is the 60Hz lock that must be removed first, then it can work. It never will ever work w/o removing the artificial nVidia 60hz lock. Not on 5600XT, because nVidia says so.

 

I was able to use one TFT I have access here @ 75Hz with DVI connector. Custom resolution must be made though.

I use my own TFT (analogue connector) at 75Hz since it does provide smoother motion and it just looks nicer. My monitor has bad habit to start flicker weirdly at 60Hz.

 

It makes perfect sense. If the EDID info is wrong then the driver will incorrectly configure your monitors display settings.

I'm quite sure there is no "60Hz lock" imposed by Nvidia drivers (if that happens to be the problem).


Also, in your screenshot - why does your EDID info read BNQ76CA and according to the link you posted, your monitor only has a VGA connection, not DVI???

 

Anarion - enabling custom resolutions might be tricky on old Forceware 45.28 drivers. I used the Coolbites trick:
"ShowCustomModes"=dword:00000001
"NvCplCustomResConfig"=dword:00000001
from there: http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=178061
...but no custom resolution appear in my options:


Probably in the old drivers it has to be done somewhat differently? Dunno. Still, not even cusom resolutions can save me. First must be the cursed 60Hz lock lifted, that it is. Nothing else helps.



Pillmonster -

True. However I see in the capabilities of the monitor clearly 75Hz (should be 76, according to the BenQ company), so I _think_ the EDID is fine. Is not it? Anyone can check that? Also, there are many registers that allow tweaks into these data fairly simply...

Go explain that to the countless people around the web with the same problem - inability to set higher that 60Hz refresh rate on older nVidia cards with DFPs. (eg. LCD flat pannel connected using DVI)
Just use google and search for "5600 refresh 60Hz"...
After vieving a few thousads complains, basically the same as mine, go again telling me that you are "pretty sure" there is no "60Hz lock". It is there, God damned! I can't set anything more that 60Hz, now if that is not "60Hz lock", then I don't know what it is.

No idea. This is right, is not it? BNQ sounds like BenQ manufacturer ID, 76 sounds like the max. reresh they say the monitor can do (friend drive the very same as I'm at 75Hz, yet using new drivers and new 7300GT card) and CA looks like some of their stuff.

That is just an error on their page. I used the link to show the 76Hz capability, not noticed how wrong information about the monitor is showed up there. It have ALSO VGA connectivity, true, but it mainly have DVI witch I use.

Bottom yet important line - over VGA, there is NO 60Hz LOCK/LIMIT for my card/drivers!

Only using DVI I run into the "wall" of 60Hz limit, witch I can't overcome. I could, if I use Linux and disable the limit in the drivers, using the AllowNon60HzDFPModes option, yet no idea if that option could be used in windows, from witch driver version and how to get around it in the older versions of drivers

Also using reshacker I discovered that there are TWO avi files I never ever saw, totaling 400k - both resources deleted and the nvcpl.dll is now 400k smaller (the one for 45.28 is really big, 4,8MB in size by original, that is way too much bitmaps...)
BTW, I noticed there few odd things. First at all, a custom resolutions dialog:
Dialog 146
Custom resolutions

...and we all know that custom resolutions have debut far far later that in 45.28 ...

And in the AGP properties page I was option bellow the FastWrites and SideBand addressing that I never saw in the real life:
Dialog 37
Enable 2D command buffer caching

Dialog 141
Enable 2D command buffer caching



Of course I wonder, how can I enable this one to become visible... Because I never saw it before...

 

If it only effects DVI then it sounds like an EDID issue to me.

Have you tried removing the EDID detection pins?



I have read about people removing these pins with needle-nose pliers on their DVI adapter (not on the monitor cable, for obvious reasons!).

 

Isn't 75CA the model of the monitor?

You have an FP75G....to me it looks like the EDID info is for a different model than yours ...

 

chinobino -

That sounds very good - if it is true. I fear that it is not. In the EDID data I clearly see my monitor is capable of 76hz refresh, so how could possibly EDID data stop the refresh from going over 60Hz? For everyone with older card and more recent DVDI plugged monitor (DFP by definition)? It just "EDID" work wrong for everyone? I highly dubt that.
And the EDID informations are stored in registry and are, thanks to the EDID editor, easily editable. So, before I break my monitor cable (I did not have any converter?!) I play with the registers first, that is usually not destructive

But once again it looks like that the EDID data is fine.




Pillmonster -

And that does not make sense at all. The data closely match the specs of FP75G and the name string is fine:



Yes, there are some problems like the data suggest FP75G should start from not 30kHz, but 31 and should not end at 82 but rather 83kHz, but that it is. Mainly the max. 76Hz is clearly reported as possible there.

God knows what internal name BenQ give to the FP75G model...

BenQ FP75G manual: ftp://211.78.86.210/monitor/lcd/man...r_um_user manual_20070302_105901_fp75g-en.pdf
6. How to adjust the screen refresh rate
You can choose 60, 70 and 75 Hertz, (but not 72Hz) for the native resolution of 1280 x 1024.

 

Ok, I suggested that to you in my very first post...so did it work?

I was looking at the bottom right hand corner of your screenshot. I made a typo - it should read BNQ76CA, not 75CA....






The string data may may be correct for the model name, but that doesn't mean the rest of the info is correct...and it looks to me as if the EDID info may be for a different monitor....

Shouldn't it have your model number on the bottom right corner?

 

Pardon me, what did you suggested? Use Power Strip? For what? Can Power Strip write EDID data? To registers? To monitor?

And what good that will be, if the data is fine in fact, allowing exactly what I want - 1280x1024 in 75Hz?

Or you mean something else?
(Looks like I should look out for application that can modify the EDID data in registers... phoenix EDID designer only let me save it, I missing the Phoenix EDID programmer to actually write the data back to the poor LCD )

As the model name (product ID) go, please note that FP75G is five character long, while the product ID can be only 4 chars long. What is worse, in the product ID it let me write only NUMBERS
But hey - I could not care less what name is where. All it want is 75Hz, ragerdless of the name. It could there says Obama or Osama, like I give a ...

 

Yeah PowerStrip will let you rewrite the EDID info, but not inn the demo afaik.

I'll see if I can find a PowerStrip that works properly. Meanwhile, have you tried using PowerStrip to change the EDID parameters and then copying the data over to EDID Programmer in order to save it?

 

Fine.
Using advanced PowerStrip 3.8 settings I easily configured 1280x1024 32bit into wanted 75Hz. It also even rightfully reported it on the start:



Not need to edit the EDID data, they are fine. Now this is good, but it proved what Linux users proved already - it CAN work. But it is useless at the same moment. The 75Hz did not "stick" in OpenGL, no matter how I apply ReForce and 75Hz settings. Simply not working in Call of Duty/Q3 ... any OpenGL application. That is what I wanted it to be 75Hz, so that make the whole PowerStrip trip useless. The change has to come with drivers modification, not PowerStrip.

PS. to get around the BSOD after 75Hz and ReForce (because the system start in 60Hz and only after PowerStrip a 75Hz is working) apply, I did apply it ONLY to 1280x1024 and in fear, rebooted. System went to 1024x768, but worked. Yet someting is still wrong, OpenGL in 1280x1024 is working in 60Hz only, even ReForce show 75Hz for this resolution...

 

I know this may seem far out, but in the device manager does it show your monitor by name, or as "Default PnP"? You really should look at finding drivers for your monitor and install them.

I had similar issues with my monitor at 1600x1200/100 hz. I eventually had to jack the 2 edid out, and install the monitor INF driver file (Which I had to rewrite to work with x64 windows)