Driver issues since 17.4.2 (On two different systems and video cards)

Discussion in 'Videocards - AMD Radeon Catalyst Drivers Section' started by KyleStilkey, Jun 16, 2017.

  1. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    Alright everyone, here is the update, I did a fresh install of 1703. It looks like the default drivers from Windows Updates for the 580 is 17.1.1. 0 issues. I installed the 17.6.2 drivers and the issues started happening, no additional software installed, nothing, just straight fresh install to 17.6.2.

    It only happens on the creators update and up so my guess is it has possibly something to do with their support for either WDM 2.2 or whatever changes made in the creators update they might be trying to support. Anything else you guys can think of let me know.
     
  2. Watcher

    Watcher Ancient Guru

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    The only question I have; why is this not happening to everyone?

    My best guess is something needs to be installed on your fresh Windows installation.

    I would start by install .NET Framework V3.5 and then V4.7.
    I use " .NET Version Detector " http://www.asoft.be/prod_netver.html
    which not only checks which versions you have installed but also give you a download link for them.

    Next I would install C++ Runtime libraries from our own forum member " thatguy91 ":

    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?p=5444383#post5444383

    I would also install the " AMD Chipset Drivers " from this Amd: http://support.amd.com/en-us/download/desktop?os=Windows+10+-+64#4

    Look under " Option Downloads " and download " AMD Chipset Drivers "

    I would then verify that the " PCI Bus " and the " AMD SMBus " have been updated. Direction provided by another forum member " Me " ;) :

    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=373501&page=4
    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=373501

    Keep us updated.
     
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2017
  3. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    I have already done all of those steps and also I am the one who hosts those files from my website too for users that were having a hard time finding them since they changed the packages.

    I can 100% of the time get it to do it with the Pandora app, now I'm not sure if it's the method it's using to render or not but if I get a notification from say Skype (App not Desktop App) or Outlook Mail from time to time, just getting the notification from the action center causes this issue with the random stutters and freezing.

    So a very simple task is if you could install the Pandora App from the store and just test moving it around the screen very fast and resizing it and see if it causes the issue on your end. It only seems to affect mostly UWP Apps which I use daily. I will have to when I get some free time create that video I captured on my wife's PC showing off 17.4.1, 17.4.2 and 17.6.2.
     
  4. Watcher

    Watcher Ancient Guru

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    I believe you. If you want to make a video you can but it's really not necessary :)

    You have already performed the suggested actions which is a good start, lets see if you have also done the following:

    Disable UPLS:

    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=361702

    Activate High Precision Event Timer (HPET):

    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?p=4412312#post4412312

    Test setting: http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?p=4568336#post4568336

    https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/bb897568.aspx

    Modify CPU Delayed and Critical Worker Threads Registry settings:

    https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee377058(v=bts.10).aspx

    Code:
    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet001\Control\Session Manager\Executive]
    "AdditionalDelayedWorkerThreads"=dword:0000000a
    "AdditionalCriticalWorkerThreads"=dword:0000000a
    This gives a decimal value of 10 for both settings. Can be increased to a maximum of decimal value of 16 which is a HEX value of: dword:00000010

    Keep us updated.
     

  5. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    No change with all of these changes done.
     
  6. Watcher

    Watcher Ancient Guru

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    We're not done yet by any means!!

    Install Afterburner:

    http://www.guru3d.com/files-details/msi-afterburner-beta-download.html

    When it is done installing it will indicate in needs to reboot. Reboot at this time.

    Install ClockBlocker:

    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=404465

    When installed, run ClockBlocker, right click on tray icon and select " Quick Action " then : " Default > Block "

    This should cause you GPU to run at it's gaming clock speed.
    Move around the windows and see if the problem still occurs.

    Keep us posted.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2017
  7. Krteq

    Krteq Master Guru

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    Kyle, do you have ReLive app installed on both machines?
     
  8. A2Razor

    A2Razor Master Guru

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    @KyleStilkey:

    Happen to have a capture with LatencyMon or anything similar during those stutters?

    Also, tried disabling interrupt coalescing?
    eg, bcdedit /set disabledynamictick yes


    Definitely something funky is going on in your video. That looks like the entire system is locked up during the pauses.
    (do you get consistent audio crackling as well -- corresponding to the UI / mouse pauses?)

    ^ If audio is crystal clear and keeps playing (no crackle, no hitch) between pauses, less likely to help ... still worth looking in this direction though as there may be some interaction going on.


    EDIT:
    --May be worth playing with "MSIUtil" and toggling some devices back and forth between MSI / IRQ modes, to see if there's any impact.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2017
  9. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    Already posted saying with or without makes 0 difference.
     
  10. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    No difference at all with both. Damn was sure hoping it was an issue with like the clocks going into a 2D state or clock speeds gettings stuck. Keep them coming!
     

  11. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    Not sure how to use MSIUtil but when I have sometime to I will.

    As far as audio issue, none I causes no issues with crackling or anything, just seems like the card is having issues rendering Universal Apps and

    LatencyMon doesn't change at all when it comes to the issue, report almost identical when just using chrome here in idle or moving around other screens when testing.
     
  12. A2Razor

    A2Razor Master Guru

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    If the kernel was frozen for even a split-second, believe me you'd be hearing it during playback. (perceived loud "Atari style" sounds, pops, clicks, or otherwise)

    --Shame, no change in LatencyMon and no corresponding audio quirks. At least this confirms that the OS itself is still moving though. (not a complete freeze)


    Windows' desktop-composition framerate used to be dynamically driven (variable target + smoothing). No idea if the following registry value still has any effect in Windows 10. May be worth giving it a shot to force a high frame-rate target.


    Code:
    Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00
    
    [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\DWM\Schedule]
    "FrameRateMin"=dword:00000090
    -This would be for a 144hz panel.
     
  13. Watcher

    Watcher Ancient Guru

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    We have enter the troubleshooting stage of this issue were examinations and changing of settings will be required. Note any change in performance either good or bad and report back. Yes, sounds like homework, doesn't it :)

    Lets continue.

    • Are you overclocking either of the computers?
    • What profile is the RAM set at in the Bios? Change the profile to a lower one and / or change timings manually.
    • Control Panel / Power options: Does changing power plans have any bearing on issue?
    • Disconnect the computer from the internet by either Unplugging the network cable / Disconnect the Wireless connection.
    • Have you searched internet for other similar reports of this issue?
    • Try plugging the computer into another electrical socket; not on the same breaker as connected to now.

    Keep us updated.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2017
  14. A2Razor

    A2Razor Master Guru

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    Re-watched the video, had another thought on this.

    It almost looks like the freezing is during "bus hits" to the card (texture transfer and creation for dialogs -- such as in expanding dialogs [maximize] )... I actually remember having something similar in some MMO's way back (although not Windows desktop menus) that took forever for me to track down [because it didn't effect FPS's, RTS's]. Stuttering ultimately was caused from a chipset issue, and resolved in shutting off all bus power management (PCI-E was dipping to x1 mode, power saving mid game).

    --I'm guessing from the wording that there's no hit on games ... yet, at the same time this might simply be because games pre-load their textures (such as during a level-load).

    Do you notice any performance drops in game menus or freezing during loading levels?


    Also, if you would -- could you post a shot of GPU-Z on both those systems. Or basically, list the "Bus Interface" section and try to re-read that while moving the cursor around and dragging windows.


    EDIT: Why I'm considering something like the above, connection wise between the machines, is that both motherboards are from the same manufacturer.
    -That may be the commonality between the machines.

    I doubt that it's USB related (or linked to the mouse's movement), since you say there's specific 'triggers' like a system tray notice. I'd doubt that it's 'focus swap' off the game (tray popup stealing focus), as it's happening in your video during just dragging a dialog (no swapping happening).
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2017
  15. Noisiv

    Noisiv Ancient Guru

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    "only" ??
    and god knows what else :D

    Two entirely different hardware setups with 2 virgin-fresh Creators Update installs, are exhibiting the same stuttering problem?

    I know you said that you tried with fresh install(s?) , but tbh you dont sound completly convincing?


    1703 build with Latency Monitor and with 17.6.2 installed is NOT a fresh install.
     

  16. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    Try reading again, if you read everything, a FRESH INSTALL of 1607 with only 17.6.2 installed no issues, a FRESH INSTALL of 1703 with ONLY 17.6.2 ISSUES. Drop it down to 17.1.1 on the 580 system and 17.4.1 on the 290 no issues. So please read before ASSUMING what has been said.
     
  17. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    BUS Interface stace at 16x even during the issue, was a good shot though. Thanks for the suggestion!
     
  18. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    • Are you overclocking either of the computers? Both are, but stated when running the default BIOS settings to make sure it's not some sort of BIOS issue or OC it doesn't make a difference.
    • What profile is the RAM set at in the Bios? Change the profile to a lower one and / or change timings manually. I have done this, running them at their default (8350 being 1333 and 1700X being 2133) doesn't make a difference. I run my RAM times and speeds at the ones stamped on the chips, I don't tweak them beyond that, but I did already try default BIOS settings just to be sure no changes I made was causing an issue.

    • Control Panel / Power options: Does changing power plans have any bearing on issue? I run both systems at High Performance and changing them between any of the settings changes nothing sadly. Still happens.

    • Disconnect the computer from the internet by either Unplugging the network cable / Disconnect the Wireless connection. Doing this changes nothing.
    • Have you searched internet for other similar reports of this issue? Yes and a few others on AMD's Sub Reddit have the same issues, but it seems to be very few reports.
    • Try plugging the computer into another electrical socket; not on the same breaker as connected to now. I have done this too (did this months ago when testing to make sure I wasn't having power issues) and it made no difference. I even took the computer to my parents house next door just to make sure there wasn't an issue with the house sending electricity (it is an old house) but sadly no changes.
     
  19. Noisiv

    Noisiv Ancient Guru

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    I am really not assuming anything. I just have trouble believing that 2 different fresh systems would exhibit the same rare kind of stuttering.
    If it was 1 system, I would say fine sh1t happens, lets troubleshoot it, like the guys above helping you.
    But if you really claim that 2 different rigs are exhibiting the identical issue, an issue which itself is rare, then I would triple check against some kind of user intervention being done to both PCs.

    Its still not clear that you tried with fresh windows install on BOTH PCs.
    GL. Who knows, maybe when you clear this you get rewarded by both MS and AMD.
     
  20. KyleStilkey

    KyleStilkey Master Guru

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    If it's not clear then don't post, you're just trying to start stuff instead of helping.
     

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