Doom Eternal may not have Ray-Tracing at launch

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Jan 27, 2020.

  1. Undying

    Undying Ancient Guru

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    Its shame becouse wolfenstein youngblood actually showed what a good optimized engine like id tech 7 and a good dlss/rt implementation can do. Game was running even on a rtx2060 super at 1440p/60fps and thats impressive. I think they should've have supported it on launch.
     
  2. alanm

    alanm Ancient Guru

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    I think Nvidia will give them a nudge and help them get it ready for when Ampere arrives.
     
  3. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    I definitely think RT is the future and I think it's cool that Nvidia is pushing the tech but yeah it's been a pretty terrible launch in general. Especially with all the games that are either cancelled or delayed. I don't really care for companies selling products based on the promises of features and Nvidia is essentially doing that to a pretty large degree with RTX.
     
  4. sbacchetta

    sbacchetta Member Guru

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    At the same time Nvidia don't make game themselves, so it's hard to follow on their promises. The biggest problem was because of lack of competition from AMD, Nvidia jacked up the price of the 2000 series trying to justify it with the lackluster (in term of support) "RTX features"... With HW T&L Geforce 256 and pixel shader Geforce 3, support wasn't great at launch either but the price was still "OK" without even considering those features.
     

  5. Reardan

    Reardan Master Guru

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    I disagree, the biggest problem is their dishonesty in advertising. I fully understand that they can't control when games come and go, difficulties games have, problems that arise, crap happens.

    But then those games need to be removed from the list, or worded properly. Here's their Minecraft RTX page. There's nothing on this advertisement for Minecraft RTX that even suggests it not only isn't available, but isn't available and has no release date. In fact, all the wording on the page is present tense, as if this is something you could pop a card in and use. It literally uses the words "It's on". There's pictures, videos, no regular consumer would look at this page and think anything but "I can play Minecraft with RTX if I own these cards" which just isn't true.

    They have little control over what happens to the games that end up in development hell, or extremely delayed, but their advertising should reflect these realities and they seem to refuse to do that. And the funny part is, Cyberpunk, Atomic Heart, Minecraft, etc? They're going to use the same games they used to sell RTX 2000 cards around launch to sell RTX 3000 cards. If that isn't a massive problem, what is?

    I think when companies decide they want to start selling ecosystems, they have to be held to an even higher standard on their promises. It's entirely likely that I, as a consumer, would've bought a gsync monitor because I bought an RTX card because of the advertisements related to these games. Maybe I bought an nvidia shield so I could gamestream to it, maybe I bought some of these games on Geforce Now, etc. Companies can't be allowed to lie or mislead to get customers into the ecosystem so they're stuck there.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2020
  6. sbacchetta

    sbacchetta Member Guru

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    I won't argue with you on that point their marketing department have been particularly sh##y, but that nothing new, and seeing the still massive mindshare they enjoy, this is not going to change in the future.
     
  7. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    That's not to mention this list:

    [​IMG]

    Nvidia sold cards with the idea that these games would receive either DLSS/RT support.

    Off the top of my head, I know ARK never got anything, Corsa never got an update, Atomic Heart is basically cancelled, Dauntless never got an update, Enlisted is still in Alpha - probably never coming out either, Hitman 2 never got DLSS/RTX. PUBG never got either.

    At this point there are probably more games that were listed that never got DLSS/RTX then games that did get it.

    At what point is it just massive amounts of false advertising? Honestly I'd argue it's worse than the 970's 3.5GB issue. They promised all these games and features and never delivered on any of them nearly two years later. As Rearden said, the 3000 series will probably also feature Atomic Heart and people that search "games with RTX" will see lists like the picture above and yet nada.
     
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  8. OnnA

    OnnA Ancient Guru

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    Butter smooth (Demon frags) at +100FPS 1440p is what we need :p
     
  9. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

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    I wish I had the time and nationality to sue about this.
     
  10. sbacchetta

    sbacchetta Member Guru

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    You are both right, but like I wrote the problem was they jack up the price and tried to justify it with RTX feature, and obviously didn't delivered on it(their marketing department shouldn't have made any promises on the first place to be honest). I mean if the 2080ti was a 750 USD card people wouldn't complain as much because RTX would be see as nice "bonus feature"
     

  11. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    I think the pricing makes it worse but I still take issue with the idea that they are selling cards based on promises.

    I've been burned so much by this lately it's annoying. Google constantly does this, they show a product at some Google hardware event with some cool features that "will come in the following weeks/months" - I buy said product and the feature comes like a year later, typically after a new version of that product is already out, or the feature doesn't come at all, or the feature comes for like 3 months then gets cancelled.

    As far as Nvidia - there are still people complaining about the "Nvidia Spot" that they demoed with the Shield. People bought an Nvidia shield under the guise that they could basically use it like a Google home if they had bought a spot. It never came, Nvidia never even cancelled or mentioned why it's gone.

    https://www.droid-life.com/2017/11/14/nvidia-spot-release-date-price-wtf/

    These companies are realizing it's more profitable to sell the idea of something before actually implementing said idea. They shouldn't be selling cards based on updates to games that are a year or more away - regardless to the cost of the card.
     
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  12. MonstroMart

    MonstroMart Master Guru

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    For me it's the important part. Ray tracing is the future but the current implementation of it is meh at best. I don't have a RTX card but i know someone who does and while we're too old to gather and play games together on a regular basis i tried 2 rtx games on his computer for a short while and i was left rather unimpressed. I played BF V and the Tomb Raider game and it was really not looking much better than traditional shaders. Certainly not enough to drop 20-30 frames. In fact in the case of BF V at times i would say it looked worse as there was too much reflections for a battlefield full of dust and debris.

    I've heard that the new Wolfenstein game is the best implementation of RTX and DLSS. I watched a video (i know ...) and i must admit the DLSS implementation looked great and finally looked like something that I could maybe see myself use one day. But the RXT part left me rather unimpressed again. It's certainly looked better (in the video) than the RTX games where everything an their dog is reflective but still not something i would give 20-30 frames for. Specially not since the RTX taxes is very expensive in Canada when it comes to the 2070. If RTX would be free then yeah nice bonus to have but at 150$ CAD more than usual price then nope thank you very much.
     
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  13. k0vasz

    k0vasz Active Member

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    I think the whole nv range will have RTX in the next generation. In the first round, it might have been too costy for the cheaper models, but in the next round, there won't be anything but maybe 1 budget card without RTX.
    Also, as next gen consoles launching this year will have ray tracing support, I'm pretty sure that the next card from AMD will have some kind of hardware ray tracing support as well.
     
  14. sbacchetta

    sbacchetta Member Guru

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    Sadly this a global trend look at huge number of game that came out in a complete unfinished state. People need to start voting with their wallet, hence why I didn't bought an RTX card...we should be paid to be beta tester not the other way around...
     
  15. insp1re2600

    insp1re2600 Maha Guru

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    we happy few is long in the bargain bin, graphics weren't that great to begin with, surprised that will get rtx still.
     

  16. Nekrosleezer

    Nekrosleezer Member Guru

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    well i can say that nvidia did something similar to RTX features with the launch of geforce 6000 series, with the support of new shader model 3.0 which became the standard for the next years.
     
  17. Undying

    Undying Ancient Guru

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    I remember 6800ultra had sm 3.0 while ati x850pe had only 2.0, it set standard like you said and ati fallowed by x1800xt later on. Similiar situation will happen.
     
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  18. Aaron123

    Aaron123 Master Guru

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    Seriously...who cares? RTX is a joke. I was ready to play this in november!
     
  19. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    It is not like ARK needs any lower performance. It barely runs on mainstream HW at 1080p.
    I have PUBG and SotTR. PUBG is boring. And SotTR does not need it.
    We Happy Few is interesting game, but it does not need DXR as it can get away with artistic style too. Same applies to Serious Sam 4.

    In general, I would say that DXR does make some of those games better. But for rest, it is either not needed or undesirable. (Or not delivered/deliverable.)
     
  20. AStaUK

    AStaUK Active Member

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    With the next gen consoles supporting Ray Tracing I think we will see better implementation in future games, we'll certainly see a good jump in RTX performance with the next nVidia cards. I enjoyed play CoD: Modern Warfare with RTX enabled, some of the areas looked brilliant with RTX and the game as a whole ran very smooth.
     

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