Cyberpunk 2077s lead gameplay designer leaves CD Projekt RED

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Mar 25, 2021.

  1. Neo Cyrus

    Neo Cyrus Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    9,938
    Likes Received:
    728
    GPU:
    Asus TUF 3080 OC
    I'm not even sure if the dumpster fire was his fault. It was the fat cats at the top that made most the retarded decisions and wouldn't give time to actually finish the game AFAIK. It's obvious the game's systems are still incomplete, there's still no upcoming wanted system. All they're doing for patch 1.2 is having them spawn at a distance after a drone that spawns in your face spots you. It's a very cheap band-aid fix for a basic game mechanic that should have been there from the start but might never be included.
     
    jbscotchman likes this.
  2. sardine

    sardine Active Member

    Messages:
    78
    Likes Received:
    8
    GPU:
    Nvidia 680m GTX 4gb
    I was looking forward to cyberpunk, even bought xbox one X cyberpunk.

    I tried the PC version, the start seemed ok I was disappointed in the lack of feedback from the npc chars just nonsense replies or they all sounded the same and so angry all the time,

    I got as far as meeting jackie for lunch sitting there watching cars driving into the walls and pillars, all the npc chars changing if you look around they all change, you cant follow them like advertised as they supposed to go about their day. cars if you walk in front of one look around and the car has changed lol. everytime you spin around all the cars change,

    shoot your gun in the air and everyone just cowers, the crowd is so badly done and then the nail in the coffin for me is the POLICE. O>M>G>. what an utter cluster fluck this is.

    I climbed onto an almost impossible ledge and shot an npc, police spawned on my head, with the police mess I've not even played my xbox version, i did load it, got as far as char creation and looked in the mirror and the cloths I was wearing had gone, I was naked in the mirror WTF. so I closed the app and have not loaded it since last year in the hopes they fix it. everytime I look at my Cyberpunk xbox i sigh!! as it reminds me of the disappointment.

    I just heard patch 1.2 released and CDPR said the police spawning on you we have fixed. HAHA what!!! yes not on your head anymore but they spawn 10 feet away instead, deserted streets, ONE npc you shoot then surrounded by the police, even star trek transporter beams aren't that fast, OMG, , i give up, GTA 3 or even driver parallel lines has better police and that's a game from 2006. what an utter joke,
     
  3. jbscotchman

    jbscotchman Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    5,873
    Likes Received:
    4,717
    GPU:
    MSI 1660 Ti Ventus
    Eye of the tiger
    Eye of the tiger
    Eye of the tiger
    x 1000
     
  4. Daftshadow

    Daftshadow Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,325
    Likes Received:
    14
    GPU:
    RTX 2080
    Financially nope. How the game was managed, absolutely yes. But to put it more correctly, one of the biggest fails in gaming launch history.
     
    rl66 likes this.

  5. rl66

    rl66 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    3,082
    Likes Received:
    447
    GPU:
    Sapphire RX 580X SE
    Agree to that.
     
  6. SethNW

    SethNW New Member

    Messages:
    7
    Likes Received:
    1
    GPU:
    GeForce GTX1070 8GB
    Cyberpunk was really huge mess, not because it is the worst game, but because people got promised greatness and recurved game that us overall mediocre and very unfinished. CDPR really should have it in development for another two years. Or at least release it as early access and admit they bit more than they could chew. Instead they lied, made console versions pretty much unplayable and overall game was mess. Sure thumbs up for sticking around to fix it, but with studio that was in so high regard and enjoyed so much trust, it definitely was one of biggest backstabs.

    As for what I think happened, because it really makes no sense to destroy so much good reputation in a single week, I feel they were in course of having huge financial issues, if they didn't release game in 2020. They grew a lot, as they admitted, while CP was developed and I believe that is where all Witcher money went, pre-orders kept them rolling for a while, buy they desperately needed release for another big spoke in earning. And don't get me wrong, this is not to justify what they did it excuse it, it still was very bad thing. But it dies explain why they would literally lie about the state of the game and do everything to boost sales, because when corporations are on the edge, consequences be damned, they will go through hell and still lie about their financial state. But it is only explanation that would make remote sense for that insanity, at least to me.
     
  7. deusex

    deusex Master Guru

    Messages:
    646
    Likes Received:
    99
    GPU:
    3090 FTW3 Ultra
    They should have continue to work on Witcher 4 instead on something new. But they never listen to me :) Hopefully they will redeem themselves with updates to CP2077 and new Witcher game.
     
  8. PrMinisterGR

    PrMinisterGR Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    7,889
    Likes Received:
    755
    GPU:
    Inno3D RTX 3090
    All of their talent has left due to infamous years of horrible crunch and terrible management. This mess means they can't hire starry eyed kids out of university and basically squeeze their life out of them for peanuts.
    At least after this it won't be as easy. If they were honest, they should have banned board members from game directing after this, but they're not.
     
  9. XenthorX

    XenthorX Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    3,823
    Likes Received:
    1,807
    GPU:
    3090 Gaming X Trio
    Cyberpunk isn't a bad game by any stretch of the imagination, at least when it's playable (read 'on PC').
    But i don't see myself going back to this game in a while: i expected something of the caliber of RDR2 and it turns out they're not even playing in the same league.
     
    PrMinisterGR likes this.
  10. kapu

    kapu Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,863
    Likes Received:
    483
    GPU:
    Radeon 6800
    Im was not moved by the bugs .. ... i was destroyed by all the cut down features.
     

  11. Chess

    Chess Master Guru

    Messages:
    390
    Likes Received:
    57
    GPU:
    ASUS GTX1080Ti Stri
    Another one that was hyped to death, full of bugs but seriously enjoyable: Stalker.

    They'll get it right, I'm sure. They just made a big mistake with everyone looking at their every move AND the internet got A LOT more vocal and polarised since the era of Bloodlines and Stalker ( 2004-2007 )
     
  12. anticupidon

    anticupidon Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    6,220
    Likes Received:
    2,586
    GPU:
    Polaris/Vega/Navi
    This statement sums up what is wrong with this world.

    First and foremost, putting the blame on one man's shoulder is short sighted nonsense.
    Second, even to consider that everything it's his fault, people can change, people can learn from mistakes.
    Now, what you said sums up what Bigtech tries to makes us think.
    Mistakes are recorded and never to be deleted, modified or accept circumstances. Whatever a person did bad is set on stone. No mercy for the wicked, right?
    Seriously? Look back in your life, everything you did in your profesional life was imaculate and impeccable? Should you never to be employed again for just one mistake, if your logic applies.
    We are so quick to grab a pitchfork and start a witch hunt. No one tried to think, tries to see the bigger picture and to accept the human factor.
    Working your ass off, crunching, and upper management giving you unrealistic expectations and deadlines, while making statementy far from reality makes one quit and never to look back.
    What if we , as bystanders, see you quit if your boss made your life hell, we say: We will not employ you, you are so weak.
    How will that feel?

    Normally, I accept that everyone has an opinion and I accept that. But this kind of statements makes me cringe.

    Dear guru, please try to see the bigger picture. Try to understand that you don't know everything and your decision is hasted and short sighted. You can do better, I am sure of that.
    There is a reason we tend to forget the bad and remember the good.
     
    Chess, carnivore, Neo Cyrus and 3 others like this.
  13. PrMinisterGR

    PrMinisterGR Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    7,889
    Likes Received:
    755
    GPU:
    Inno3D RTX 3090
    He was just a scapegoat getting onboard the game in 2020. I don't think it matters at all if he's part of a game, for all we know he might have been the person coordinating them to make this remotely playable.

    Get a coffee, I got you fam.
    Source.
    Let's lay down a list of what was promised to us but it was found missing from the game.

    FINAL EDIT: Ok guys I think we have a good lay out of the game we were promised vs the game we had. I won't really modify further this list. I think we have touched on every main aspect of the game in a truthful and objective (for what we can) way. Please if you have any critism let it be contructive and well documented. Many of these are complex issues that deserve more than just a twitter post to be discussed. Also feel free to use this if needed in the future.

    Features we were told to expect but aren't in the game:

    - AMAZING AI that directs enemies during combat/patrol but also citizens and npcs' daily life (https://www.reddit.com/r/cyberpunkg..._ai_of_cyberpunk_2077_an_indepth_look_at_the/)

    - wanted system and corrupt police (https://gamerant.com/cyberpunk-2077-wanted-system-corrupt-police/)

    -Immersive police involvment changing with the area where you commited the crime (https://www.usgamer.net/articles/cyberpunk-2077-producer-details-law-enforcement)

    - (half kept) in general, more interesting combat and hacking (). Some examples are the ability to use your wire to hack people (), hacking reveales information about the network, more interesting viruses to upload, more loot from hacked devices. DISCLAIMER: the changes here may be due entirely to balace issues and/or making the game better and more intuitive. I keep this as a promise "half kept" as the hacking system gets really boring really soon and doesn't even many abilities you can upgrade. The skill tree is filled with passive and all you do is press tab, pick whatever, kill, repeat. For a better explanation please read this: https://www.reddit.com/r/cyberpunkg...4?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

    - more interesting gameplay, for example: trauma team that plays a key role, freequent flying avs, ads that target the player point to the merchant that sells that product, merch could be pre-viewed before purchase (Source: and ) NOTE: this section is by far the most oversimplied one. There are a number of minute key things I am not stating in this thread because I don't want to dilute it too much, i.e.: https://www.reddit.com/r/cyberpunkg...w?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

    - Strong RPG elements (https://wccftech.com/cyberpunk-2077...aying-experience-than-the-witcher-3-says-dev/). This was actually subject of lengthy debates in this thread, as some of you are happy with the "RPGness" of CP2077. Personally I have not seen a lot of elements that make a game an RPG, such as relevant checks (speech, perception... right now all we have are options to break a door or go around it), solid companions, defined power dynamics between factions and a general sense of progression achieved through meaningful upgrade to your character. The game right now is more akin to a shooter/looter with stats. Which is not "strong RPG element". Mind you, if you like it this way it's perfect, and I personally don't mind it too much. But the lack of RPG components does stay in the list as a promised not fulfilled. And no, madqueen, having 7 different finales that you get to choose doesn't make a looter/shooter an RPG.

    - NPC unique daily routine and AI (https://www.vg247.com/2020/06/08/cyberpunk-2077-npcs-1000-daily-routines/)

    - Quest decisions will have relevance in the world (https://onlysp.escapistmagazine.com/cyberpunk-2077-changes/)

    - (half kept) Meaningful day and night cycle (right now it's mainly cosmetic and doesn't impact the gameplay a lot, e.g.: you aren't more stealthy at night) as described in Exploring Cyberpunk's Night City with CD Projekt Red - Cyberpunk 2077 - Gamereactor but it does something, like opening and closing some venues (according to some, I am 200h in and venues are always open for me) and modifying some population density. I have not seen evidence of places being more dangerous at night. If you have please record a clip and send it over.

    - Incredible character customization during creation / in-game (https://gamecrate.com/cyberpunk-2077-boxing-power-weapons-militech-spider-robot-and-more/23426 and https://www.gamesradar.com/uk/cyberpunk-2077-character-creation/)

    - Use of drones for more than just some missions in the game (https://gamecrate.com/cyberpunk-2077-boxing-power-weapons-militech-spider-robot-and-more/23426)

    - three different lifepaths and more that would actually have more impact than what we are getting now (Wall running and metro system are not the biggest thing to be cut out from the game. Its the plot : cyberpunkgame (reddit.com)) for a better description on why lifepaths are poorly implemented. this post (https://www.reddit.com/r/cyberpunkg.../?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) is a good example.

    - to add on the previous point, lifepaths leading to non-linear quest design. (https://www.playstationlifestyle.net/2019/09/12/cyberpunk-2077-lifepath-system/)

    - Nanowire and gorilla arms have a lot of different uses that are still in the description of the item (https://twitter.com/CyberpunkGame/status/1153684171606450178?s=09).

    - Runs very well on last gen consoles (source NOT needed)

    - The game will launch when it's ready (source NOT needed)

    - Variety of braindances instead of it being just few cutscenes (can't find reference, please link)(so far videos like this point that braindance is a cool mechanic but they never said we'd be able to purchase and use the braindances on our devices and all. I don't feel this is a broken promise, rather an aspect of the game that we would love to have had implemented).

    - Challenging weather system that would pose a threat to your survival (https://www.windowscentral.com/cybe...ain-and-other-deadly-environmental-challenges)

    - At time of writing I haven't finished the game. However sources say there are very very few options for ONS and/or deep romances (this article summarizes what was expected https://www.ginx.tv/en/cyberpunk-2077/cyberpunk-2077-everything-about-relationships-romance-and-sex)

    - Finishing the game without finishing the main quest ( https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.th...-in-depth-finish-game-without-main-quest/amp/) At time of writing I haven't seen any progression just following the subplot and it looks like the main story is the quest to follow if I want to see an epilogue. This appears to be an error in translation during the interview.

    - The game will let you select your body type and your gender freely, allowing you to obtain whatever combination of voice/gender/genitalia you want. Sex/Gender complete fluidity was something allowed in the cyberpunk tabletop games and very very relevant in the lore of the cyberpunk society (https://www.gaytimes.co.uk/culture/...aracter-creation-and-queer-relationships/amp/).

    - A polished game and smooth experience (https://www.reddit.com/r/cyberpunkg...interview_cyberpunk_2077_will_be_as_polished/)

    - weapon customization (https://nightcitylife.de/index.php/...xxl-preview-cyberpunk-2077-angespielt?start=5) although we got mods so this is half kept.

    - 4 different styles, clearly highlighted, that you can adeere to and will make NPC react to it (https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=YlyDJVYqfpA). Please note that this was advertised as true 2 months before release.



    Features that were initially promised but removed during development (CDPR was transparent about those):

    - Properties purchase and customization options (Promised but then removed) (https://www.reddit.com/r/cyberpunkgame/comments/9bu0d5/purchasable_apartments_confirmed/)

    - Transportation system (Promised but then removed) (https://www.gamepressure.com/newsroom/cyberpunk-2077-wont-show-subway-travel/z41f9d)

    - Scaling walls (Promised but then removed) (https://www.ign.com/articles/cyberpunk-2077-wall-running-mantis-blades-cut)

    - Vehicle customization (Promised but then removed) (https://www.altchar.com/game-news/cyberpunk-2077-wont-have-vehicle-customisation-aonab8e3yY6b)

    - V voice customization beyond choosing the gender (Promised but then removed) (CDPR Confirms That Cyberpunk 2077 Won't Have Voice Customization (thegamer.com))

    IMPORTANT: I see many of you contributed and I thank you. However this thread is specifically for broken promises, i.e. things that they said (in an article, tweet, interview...) we would find in the game and didn't. I believe there are other thread specifically for quality of life things we would want to see implemented in the game (and the list is infinite there as well).

    EDIT: Alright I have monitored all your replies and added what I felt was truthful. The point of this list is not to discuss minutia but to have a concentrated and dense point of reference for future discussion.

    My personal opinion is that Cyberpunk 2077 is another reason to always try to hold people accountable for what they promised. Yes I know what companies do isn't illegal but that should not stop us to manifest discontent for what we think are malpractices in the game industry.

    Edit: thank you for the awards - I really appreciate it. However please do not waste your money on me, I am lucky enough. Donate instead to an organization of your choice, my favorite ones are Emergency (of Gino Strada) or Wikipedia.
     
  14. Irenicus

    Irenicus Master Guru

    Messages:
    582
    Likes Received:
    100
    GPU:
    1070Ti OC
    What are you smoking? You clearly missed the point of what he was saying. People do all sorts of things, get passionate and do and say stupid things. Every human on the planet is a person. Good or bad. And he wasn't the one making death threats, followers were.
     
  15. Irenicus

    Irenicus Master Guru

    Messages:
    582
    Likes Received:
    100
    GPU:
    1070Ti OC
    Nope it's not the exact opposite. It's a huge money grab. Done more research on it than most people that's for sure (because when I want to understand and learn about something I delve DEEP).
     

  16. CronoGraal

    CronoGraal Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,194
    Likes Received:
    20
    GPU:
    MSI R9 390 8GB
    ITT "it was fine for me on my 3000 dollar computer idk what everyone is talking about"

    I'm going to prefix this post with a solid "frack consoles" but you can't release a game on a console and have it simply *not work*. I don't really care what your stance on console gaming is, you already know mine, but for them to release what turned out to be an almost unplayable (and in some cases actually unplayable) game when it's not only released on that platform but advertised as such...that's just not right. Just because you personally had no problems with it means nothing when there's hordes of people with issues, surely you do understand what they're talking about regardless of your smooth experience considering there's so many people with problems.

    I don't know how it went for the average PC enthusiast, I was going to upgrade my rig back around December but we all know what happened to PC parts.
     
  17. PrMinisterGR

    PrMinisterGR Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    7,889
    Likes Received:
    755
    GPU:
    Inno3D RTX 3090
    Aren't they the people who actually mapped a start system, merged an FPS with a sim, added realistic control to ships, and had to create so much space that they had to mod the Cryengine/Lumbar to support 64bit coordinates because the amount of stuff they put literally didn't fit in a 32bit coordinate space?
     
    Chess likes this.
  18. GamerNerves

    GamerNerves Member Guru

    Messages:
    172
    Likes Received:
    34
    GPU:
    RX 5700 XT Nitro+
    Seems like CD Projekt's best talent is for impressive engines. Should they move to engine licensing business?
     
  19. DannyD

    DannyD Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    3,155
    Likes Received:
    2,085
    GPU:
    EVGA 2060
    You do realized TW3 is one of the best pc games of all time?
     
    PrMinisterGR likes this.
  20. PrMinisterGR

    PrMinisterGR Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    7,889
    Likes Received:
    755
    GPU:
    Inno3D RTX 3090
    Seems like Sony pulled it from their store because the engine couldn't work properly in the largest target platform (the vanilla PS4).
     
    Last edited: Apr 1, 2021
    XenthorX likes this.

Share This Page