Cryptocurrency CHIO can destroy an SSD in 40 days

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, May 17, 2021.

  1. Fox2232

    Fox2232 Ancient Guru

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    No.
    What are you talking about? When you buy new SSD, in 1st few days/weeks, you are going to write much more as you bought it with intent to use it. You can't run 800GB of games from SSD unless you write them there 1st. And then those games have updates. Especially if you have newer or actively developed games.
    Steam here just downloaded Dreadnought patch (370MB), then it was reading/modifying/writing data for 5 minutes where average write speed was around 150MB/s.

    Smart patching makes sense. Reduces patch size, makes games ready faster. Imagine if such patch required raw 40GB+ download. You would be waiting instead of playing.
    Today's total DL from steam is just 1.5GB, but actual writes could easily be 60GB. But writes much more here.
    upload_2021-5-17_15-35-6.png
    While I/O includes network writes, steam is still by far top at writing data. You can check yours when it is idle. (No active window open = no need to cache web data/game videos/screenshots/...) "I/O write bytes" almost do not change.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2021
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  2. warezme

    warezme Master Guru

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    Those figures are likely based on predicted single user daily patterns and the drive going through normal internal maintenance routine. THere is nothing normal about Chia farming.
     
  3. MonstroMart

    MonstroMart Master Guru

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    We really need regulations for cryptocurrency. I don't know in which world our leaders live and what they are smoking but cryptoconcurrency despite what the advocates say and want us to believe is a big problem and will be an ever bigger one moving forward unless we regulate (or the bubble somehow burst by itself). Computers are not only used for gaming despite what lot of people think. They are used for lot of crucial works like medical research, banking, design, science, ... lot of those use cases actually require a powerful GPU.

    It's not that big of a problem for now because people/companies already have computers and they don't necessarily have to upgrade now but if it keeps being the way it is now for another 20 years this will become a very big problem. I guess our leaders will regulate once they made lot of money with cryptocurrency and multiplied their assets by big multiplier (they are all already rich). Prople should stop drinking the advocates kool aid. The ideas behind cryptocurrency is good. But the current execution is atrocious and not sustainable long term and definitely 100% must be regulated.
     
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  4. Ssateneth

    Ssateneth Active Member

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    no? mining on storage devices uses many terabytes of writing, writing many times over the hard drive. The TBW is accurate. Mining with chia just writes beyond the TBW of SSD's warranty. I could imagine manufacturers also creating new warranty terms for sales past X date that gigabytes written per hour will be taken into account too so if there are excessive amount of writes over a short period, warranty is void (already possible since SSD SMART records power on time and how much GB written)
     

  5. Irenicus

    Irenicus Master Guru

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    I still don't get why SSDs die, when they have no moving parts, it makes no sense
     
  6. Irenicus

    Irenicus Master Guru

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    And there it is: if RAM doesn't die, no matter the amount of read/writes, why do SSDs? Deliberate degradation built in to promote more consumerism?
     
  7. MonstroMart

    MonstroMart Master Guru

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    This is two different technology. RAM doesn't retain data after the power is off. SSDs must retain data when the power is off. Over time the more you write to it they eventually lose that capacity to retain data. I think RAM use capacitors and SSDs transistors.
     
  8. CrazY_Milojko

    CrazY_Milojko Ancient Guru

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    What makes no sense? Like every piece of tech it's all about wear & tear, every single thing on this world has it's limits. RAM memory, SSDs, graphics cards, CPUs, HDDs, motherboards, PSUs... everything could die under normal everyday usage.. and when we talk about SSDs Chia is way beyond everyday usage. Chia (ab)uses SSDs NAND cells constantly for days, weeks, months... way beyound they've ment to be used. It's like using your car to drive 24 Hours of Le Mans and do it every day 24/7 for we weeks untill something breaks and It'll break for sure, it's just a matter of time. In your lifetime you never broke a hammer, bicycle, skull or any bone in your body... condom? :D Anything could be broken even in nrmal use and for sure if it's pushed outside it's limits.

    RAM chips and SSD NAND cells are simmilar but still quite/enough different technologies. Technology used for RAM chips is way more durable.
     
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  9. kapu

    kapu Ancient Guru

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    Different cells. Imagine how much ssd would cost if we would use dram cells. Also they are bit different for different use.
    Nand cells have finite writes.

    Chia will destroy consumer ssd in matter of months, its a fact and has been tested
     
  10. MonstroMart

    MonstroMart Master Guru

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    Holy moly you went there :D
     
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  11. MonstroMart

    MonstroMart Master Guru

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    Does it matter for miners though? You can buy 10 SSDs for the price of a GPU. So even if they can't use the warranty and Chia destroys the SSDs in 3-6 months if Chia becomes popular it will probably still be worth it for them.
     
  12. CrazY_Milojko

    CrazY_Milojko Ancient Guru

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    No I wasn't :D I've only broke a hammer and a bicycle, but no broken scull, bones... And no broken condoms here on my side, always used those oversized just to be sure ahahaha

    Back in the days...
    Me: "...do you have condoms for sale?..."
    Seller: "...sure, what size and flavour do you want?..."
    Me: "...flavour doesn't matter, those bigger ones are they more expencive?..."
    Seller: "..(wut)...no, price is the same for M and XL..."
    Me: "...in that case give me a pack of one size larger...why not to get more for the same price..."
    Girl behind my back: "...(omg!?...let's just pretend I don't know this idiot)..."
    Half-drunk friends ath the end of the cash register line: "...yo bro, that's the spirit!!!..."
    :D

    Never broke a condom for sure or else I'd end up with more than one marriage and more than 3 kids lol. But I know one that broke too many of these, my best man, let's just say there was no "appropriate shape for his tool" :D But he was lucky enough not to get into trouble because of those accidents lol

    Back on topic boys!
    :)
     
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  13. kapu

    kapu Ancient Guru

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    It depends on profitability , right now it does't matter but it seems for CHIA , HDDs are way to goo...but as for now SSD makers are very happy the way things are . Regular consumers are true losers , just as it is with GPUs . Maybe price jump won't be that huge as with GPUs....
     
  14. ruthan

    ruthan Master Guru

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    "All of those coins are a massive financial pyramid with little to no actual values. The amount of electricity consumed and waste is insane.
    This has to be stopped or at least regulated on a governmental level."
    It not pyramid, until it would start be regulated or completely banned ..
    Its such way how to clean dirty money (bad thing, its money from drugs, prostitution, children work etc..).. and get rid off stupid government rules in 3rd world countries like China (good thing).

    You cant fix it in short-term.. unless some big world united movement and such thing never happened.

    If you want to something to help just fight against criminal acts in general.. and try get rid off world of bad governments somehow..
     
  15. Venix

    Venix Ancient Guru

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    I wonder if a chia malware will break loose and start slurping down people's ssds .... That would be a huge problem!
     

  16. Andy Watson

    Andy Watson Master Guru

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    Being Guru 3D guys you are concerned about the hard drive hit, but actually what will kill this is the length of time to make any money at all! It's already huge for the person on the street to get anything and will only get worse with time.

    It will be Chinese farms on gpu's competing against Chinese farms on HDDs ....

    They'll probably have both to be honest.

    What will then screw it all up if China then decides, to teach these people a lesson, by shutting up the Great FireWall of China so they can't get money for their blocks ... ouch...

    And that screws up the entire pyramid, because this is all based on peer to peer and making sure that things are not spent twice in a timely manner, it's a currency after all, not an investment that goes up and down each day.

    Ahem ...
     
  17. Andy Watson

    Andy Watson Master Guru

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    Note that these non bank based currencies have a big upside.

    If you look at Argentina, with massive inflation and a government who seems more fixated about the Malvinas islands offshore than their entire country, their currency has deflated massively. So the central bank stops people trying to convert the local currency into dollars. They can do that with their local currency, but not crypto.

    So in this respect crypto currencies have their place, they defeat a dodgy government who slaps on rules like a plaster / bandaid, rather than learning to govern wisely.
     
  18. Venix

    Venix Ancient Guru

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    Ultimate retro enthusiasts challenge ! Make a plot using 1.44'' floppy drives ! That would need a lot of disk swaps. :p
     
  19. Lonja

    Lonja New Member

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    IC engineer here. The data is saved within the floating gate of the transistor which is surrounded by the Si-oxide, which is located above the substrate. Every time the electrons move in to the floating gate from substrate in order to form logical "1", or back from floating gate in to substrate to form logical "0", there is a chance that some of them get tapped within the oxide instead traveling directly to the floating gate/substrate. After multiple thousand of read-write cycles, there is a good chance that enough electrons get trapped within the local oxide layer which in turn would then always return a value of logical "1" for the local memory cell, meaning that the bit becomes stuck and its information permanently invalid.
     
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  20. kakiharaFRS

    kakiharaFRS Master Guru

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    you only need to check the 1st words of derbauer to know this is a scam, something probably invented by drive manufacturers ><
    you don't mine/farm coins...you farm lottery tickets to maybe (never) have a chance to win at leats regular mining your earning something 100% even if it's 0.000001cent

    guys before posting anything go watch his video, half of your ideas he has already debunked
     
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