creative recon3d pcie or another sound card?

Discussion in 'Soundcards, Speakers HiFI & File formats' started by headoncollision, Mar 24, 2012.

  1. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    hello everyone.
    I currently have a recon3d pcie sound card, I have bought it about 2months ago along with acomputer build so it was kind of a rush, and I went with the rule of (newer always better) but after I have been reading reviews about it I am kinda of disappointed, I have been comparing it with the motherboard onboard sound quality in movies and music and I can only hear its slightly better with a deeper sound with the recon3d over the onboard sound. although the onboard sound has a higher snr (108 SOUND TO NOICE RATION ) while the recon3d has only 102!!!. the noticable difference is in games since the recon3d has a better surround/positioning of the enviorment, foot steps, voices and gunshots in FPS games an surround sound in RTS games. I have been thinking of buying a new sound card such as asus xonar essense st since I use my headphones mainly for movies and games and don`t need to 5.1 much, but am worried that the essense is kind of old and it might not have abetter support for gaming and won`t have better drivers in the future.
    my current options are.
    1-keep the recon3D and wait for creative to release driver updates that might make it sound better. or wait for a better product to show up.
    2-go with the asus essense and see if it perform as well in games or not, if not use recon3d for games nad essense for movies and videos
    3- invest the money in a bette 5.1 speaker system.
    4- forget about everything, sell the recon3d and just stick wit the onboard motherboard sound.

    I would really appreciate your opinions and thoughts about this. what would you do if you were me?
    my headphones are denon ah-d1100 ( got lucky and got them new for only 97$ on electronic expo).
    wating for everyone replies.
     
  2. GenClaymore

    GenClaymore Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    6,070
    Likes Received:
    52
    GPU:
    XFX 5700 XT Thic II
    The Recon3D from what people saying is worst then the older X-Fi's. If your not happy with it then yes go to a Xonar ST. Over all the Xonar ST is a better card then the recon3D in sound quailty wise with the components the xonar uses.

    The only way to get 5.1 on the xonar ST is if you had the H6 addon board. but that addon board is rare and if you can find it cost a arm and a leg. The other option is to use the Encoders on the Xonar ST to encode your games into 5.1 to output them thru your speaker setup if they accept digital input.

    Also with the ST is it has a stronger headphone amp and replaceable op-amps for op-amp rolling.
     
  3. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    I won`t be needing the 5.1 output, I will be mainly gaming with headphones on. I am sure the st would sound amazing in movies and music, but what about games?, would it be able to produce the same level of surround sound like the recond3d?. my other concern is that the st has been around for awhile now and maybe asus will be introducing a new product line. and to be perfectly clear I do have a sony hi fi system(4 shelf woofers and an intergated reciever tape, dvd player) which can accept the analog white and red output of the st. so I could be using this high quality shelf system instead of the 5.1 creative computer speakers that I am using right now when am not using the headphones.

    if the st will sound better in games currently and in the future then I will definitly order one.
     
  4. DirkHardpeck

    DirkHardpeck Master Guru

    Messages:
    272
    Likes Received:
    2
    GPU:
    GTX 980 Ti
    The Recon3d has the best simulated surround headphone engine I have heard in its TruStudio Surround component. The only thing I have personally used that was equally convincing was a pair of Roccat Kaves, used in concert with an X-Fi Titanium, but I found the Kave's sound quality to be poor. Either way, I was trading fidelity for positioning.

    I've seen many argue that CMSS-3D is more accurate for gaming, and a few argue for Dolby Headphone. I think alot of the time, it boils down to whether you favor Creative or Asus. Neither one will be quite as accurate as TruStudio. All in all, do yourself a favor and pick up an X-Fi Titanium HD or the Essence. They sound wonderful with headphones and analog stereo, and the massive increase in fidelity is well worth using CMSS-3D/DH rather than TruStudio.

    Also, could wait for the Asus Phoebus to arrive, whenever that will be....it's looking to be killer but I'm willing to bet it will cost upwards of $200 USD.
     

  5. LifeInferno

    LifeInferno Master Guru

    Messages:
    370
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    Sapphire HD7970 Quad CF
    Xonar ST Deluxe (H6 Included) the best card i ever had!
    games or not i love it! pure quality power!
     
  6. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    how different will the sound be if I got the asus essense st in games and movies, if the sound different is marginal then their won`t be any point in buying a new card for little different. also the headphones I am currently using are denon d-ah1100 stereo headphones.
     
  7. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    and I wonder about all the bad reviews out there, did they try the recon3d with thx trustudio on in music and movies, since it makes a world of difference in sound realism and quality, the music really sounds great in thx trustudio on.
    by the way even if I get the asus essense st, selling the recon3D won`t be an easy jop since there isn`t alot of people around here that would spend more than 30$ on sound card.
     
  8. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    21,934
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    GPU:
    MSI RX5700
    Question, if you can answer it....if not, no problem.

    Is the issue with the Recon3D the components used on the cards or the DSP itself?
     
  9. DirkHardpeck

    DirkHardpeck Master Guru

    Messages:
    272
    Likes Received:
    2
    GPU:
    GTX 980 Ti
    So it sounds like you were happy with the card until you read some negative reviews. Don't let someone else convince you that what you have is complete trash if it's working for you. Dont get wrapped around the axle on SnR either, elsewhere in the audio world, anything above 100 is pretty solid, and there are more factors involved. My Denon 1912 has an SnR of 100db. The Essence is audiophile quality, the Recon3d is not, that is for certain. That doesn't mean it can't sound good.

    The card got lukewarm reviews because they tried to market it as something it wasn't, and because it is a step back in hardware. As you've also noticed, I think it works pretty great for headphone gaming....it would also work fine for optical out if your motherboard doesn't support Dolby Digital Live or DTS Connect...where it supremely fails IMO, however, is its analog surround output. If you buy a soundcard to use with 5.1 analog speakers, you probably don't care about crappy DSP's like Crystallizer, you just want something with a better DAC than the motherboard. It doesn't matter how great the Recon3d sounds with headphones, if the sound quality through speakers is irrefutably worse than every prior card in the last 6 years, if only slightly, then it's only half succeeded and doesn't deserve a score better than a 50%, C, 2.5/5 stars, etc. Thing is, alot of people probably wouldn't even notice the sound quality decrease...but if you bought a card for better sound, even if you can barely tell the difference, it should at least be better on paper.

    Still, if you mostly use headphones, and enjoy the convenience of not having to unplug them/plug them in every time you switch to/from speakers, it's a fine card.

    There is a chance that by upgrading, you may actually end up being disappointed. Hang onto the recon3d and buy a better card only if you can get a liberal return policy on it. Then, you will have no worries and you can just test them both yourself and choose one. But don't be surprised if you aren't impressed with other soundcards.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2012
  10. GenClaymore

    GenClaymore Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    6,070
    Likes Received:
    52
    GPU:
    XFX 5700 XT Thic II
    It doesn't use audiophile grade components at its price points for the other 149+ dollar cards. If it used the same components that asus used on their xonar ST/X/HDAV1.3 and what Creative used on their X-FI Titanium HD. Then it be a different story. Most likey creative didn't want it to under cut their X-FI Titanium HD which why they wouldn't had did it for their lower end model. BUt there two higher costing models should have had those components.

    But even then it be like the Auzentech Bravura which was a good card with the same components the forte had with some minor difference, but because of the dsp it used alot of people avoided it because of it using the Audigy SE dsp. Even if the card was audiophile quality components.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2012

  11. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    :)
    thank you for your long reply:) .
    well there is no way I can return it since I bought it from amazon USA and I live outside USA, shipping it back would cost me at least 60$, so this is not an option, will to be honest I am kinda pleased since I have compared it to my motherboard sound is considered best when it comes to motherboard sound quality, and the sound in games on the 5.1 speakers is really good, especially in eax games. such as company of heros. I am just kinda disappointed since everyone thinks its a failure, while at the time of purchase it seemed the right match since it had all the connectivity I needed and had a headphones amps. but I guess one sould always stick with what makes him happy and disregard what others think as long as he is not having any trouble with what he have. I really felt alot of sound difference when I upgraded my headphones to denon -d ah1100, the sound opened up with this card eventhough these headphones don`t require much of amps.
     
  12. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    quick question. there is two drivers available to for the recon3d.
    one signed by creative 6.0.100.1022 released in nov/2011
    the other is signed by microsoft 6.0.100.1035 released 20th feb 2012.
    which one should I install?, the newer one seemed needed higher volume while the first one had higher gunshots in fps games.
     
  13. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    21,934
    Likes Received:
    1,124
    GPU:
    MSI RX5700
    The driver is provided to Microsoft by Creative. The driver distributed by Microsoft is strictly an audio driver without the Creative control panel and additional software.
     
  14. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    when I checked windows 7 updates, I found this optional update for the recon3d so when I installed it the sound got different, i had to pump the volume about 10% higher and shooting wasnt very profound in games like the previous version.
    so you think its an overall benifit to keep the newer driver or should I rollback.?
     
  15. DirkHardpeck

    DirkHardpeck Master Guru

    Messages:
    272
    Likes Received:
    2
    GPU:
    GTX 980 Ti
    I meant you should try to find a vendor that would allow you to return a new card
    , such as the Essence, so you can try it out and see if its significantly better for your purposes. Hard to say with different countries, I understand it can be difficult. Otherwise, maybe just keep an eye out for a good deal one day. If you can't get a return policy on a new card to check out, I wouldn't rush it....I'd probably just bide by time until I saw something cheap. Sometimes Amazon sells refurbished cards direct from the manufacturer, if you can't get anything from ebay in your country.

    Until then, enjoy your card and more importantly, the games! Its easy to get wrapped up in the hardware and tweaking aspects instead of enjoying our damn games lmao....I know im guilty of that.
     

  16. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    :/ yes you are right, am guilty of that to!!, even if I get a good return policy it would cost me alot to sent it back to the shop, thats why I want to be sure first, I might as well get lucky and get a good deal should like the one I got with the headphones. well I`ve been thinking about it and maybe I should just wait for the new asus card and see how it performs. until now this card is more than sufficent, since I am going to order other components after 3 or 4 months so I might as well hold the cash and order a new sound card as well, by then am sure the asus gaming card will be released and reviewed.
     
  17. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    apparently the newer driver update from Windows update has an improvement in music sound quality, the sound on games is still superb just needed more volume.
     
  18. headoncollision

    headoncollision Member Guru

    Messages:
    152
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    GIGABYTE 6950OC 1GB
    ok so I am builing another pc for everone at home to use and play video games on, so there is an aprotunity for me to purchase another sound card for me and install the recon3d pcie on the other computer am going to build, since it motherboard is old and has horrible sound. I have been reading reviews about the essense stx and creative titanium HD, should I get the titanium HD because it has better sound positioning for gaming? or should I get the essense stx?.

    thank you all for your replies.
     

Share This Page