Cannot monitor or control fan speed

Discussion in 'Rivatuner Statistics Server (RTSS) Forum' started by Kaptdeath, Apr 4, 2008.

  1. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Sirs,

    I installed RivaTuner 2.08. I decided to start slow and try to use it to control my fan speeds. (Seems like a safe newbe thing to start with.) I read Derek's guide on RivaTuner and followed the instructions very carefully. I am not sure what I have wrong. The fan speed monitor always indicates 0 (I know the fans are turning). I created the 3 duty cycle profiles as described in the guide, but my fan speed does not change when I manually select different duty cycles. I tried adjusting the fans I have tried to click through all the menus, but I can't seem to find what is preventing me from controlling the fans. I also tried adjusting the fan speed from the "System Tweaks" dialog box. Nothing seemed to happen. I did enable "Low Level" fan control as per the guide's instructions.

    Here is (I think) the pertinant information:
    NVIDIA drivers: 169.21
    RivaTuner Version: 2.08
    Video Card model: 8800GT (2X in SLI)
    Video Card Manufacturer: XFX Alpha dog (Factory OC 640Mhz/940Mhz)

    I would like to throttle my fans a bit as they are quite loud and my temps on the cores are about 39C and 42C.

    Thanks,
    The Kapt'n
     
  2. Unwinder

    Unwinder Moderator Staff Member

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    Not all display adapters are equipped with software controllable fans.
     
  3. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Is there any way I can determine if my cards fall into that category? I will try contacting XFX to see if they will be of any help. If anyone happens to read this post and has a XFX 8800GT Alpha Dog card and has (or has not) been able to control the fan speed, please let me know.

    Thanks,
    The Kapt'n
     
  4. Unwinder

    Unwinder Moderator Staff Member

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    You can easily answer your question seeing that fan speed readings are missing and fan doesn't reply to speed override attempts. Forget about fan speed control.
     

  5. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Thanks,

    I guess that I just assumed that I was doing something wrong. I am suprised that no one else has brought up this issue. I need hearing protection to be in the same room as my computer. If anyone has one of these cards and has found a way to turn it down a bit please let me know. If I find anything I'll post it.

    The Kapt'n
     
  6. Unwinder

    Unwinder Moderator Staff Member

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    Really? And I'm no longer surprised that the majority of new forum visitors traditionally ignore forum search and claim that nobody discussed the same issues before. One of multiple threads about 8800GT lacking fan control is right on the first page of advanced forum, you don't even have to search for it:

    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=251554
     
  7. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Thanks for the link. It was very educational. I did not look in the advanced forum as I am not nearly intelligent enough to comprehend the highly technical dialog there (I also did not believe this was an "advanced" issue). However, the gist of the conversation there seemed to center about a single thermistor that is not mounted on the core being used to "monitor" the core temperature via some offset in degrees C being added to it. (more or less) It also sounds like the problem is very manufacturer specific as some manufacturers may have left off the sensor chip as a cost saving measure. I am not smart enough understand how the thermal sensor can effect the measurement of the fan speed RPM, but I'm sure it's plainly obvious.

    Now I do appologise for not searching the forums better, however the search tool, for me anyway, is broken. It always yields no records found.

    (I have discovered that when I paste the returned search link into another browser I do get some hits. They just have nothing to do with what I was searching for. Hmmmmm.)

    No excuse really, as I could use Google with an appropiate domain search to find what I am looking for. So, again, I am sorry for wasting your time. Hopefully someone, somewhere has managed to ask my question the right way.

    BTW RivaTuner version 2.08 does report the GPU temperature for the XFX 8800gt Alpha Dog. (Just not the fan speed.)

    Thanks again for responding. RivaTuner looks like a fine tool. I endevor to be worthy of using it.

    The Kapt'n
     
  8. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    I did hear back from XFX about my fan problem. They suggested that I check the fan connector. I removed the shroud and what do I see but a 2 wire fan plugged into a 4 wire connector. (This card is SUPPOSED to have a controllable fan!!!!!) XFX support has agreed to sen me a pair of four wire fans. Interestingly I did not find anything about this searching for:

    XFX 8800 gt fan speed

    However, a search string like:

    xfx 8800gt bad fan connector

    Will yield a link like:

    http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1266975

    (Now that is a useful link.)

    So to recap, the answer was NOT:

    1) RTFM (Which I had read what I could find, but more on this later)
    2) You are an idiot, learn to search these forums (The answer is not here)
    3) Just give up, you can't control the fan. (But I'm supposed to be able to)

    The answer was (drum roll please......)

    You have a defective card!

    In the process I read quite a few posts in these forums and I found that RTFM is repeated like a mantra. Which got me to thinking. Where is TFM? Not a guide (they are very useful if you find one that is for exactly what you want to do). Not release notes (they only tell you what was changed from the last version which is only useful if you have been using EVERY previous version). The built in help is nice, but that hardly passes as a users manual. How about a bona fide manual (that might be included with the download). It's ok to go ahead and call me an idiot (it seems to make some people feel better, or superior perhaps). I just want to be a smarter idiot that did actually "RTFM".

    So that's it, I'm out, perhaps I will get some indication where TFM might be and hopefully someone else who has the same problem will get their answer without the requisite browbeating.

    Thanks to all
    The Kapt'n

    Oh yeah, I still think that RivaTuner is a fine piece of software and a MOST impressive achievement.
     
  9. Unwinder

    Unwinder Moderator Staff Member

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    Or defective understanding. A lot of cards are shipped with non-reference cooling systems (which means lack of fan controller chip due to cooling system redesign or cheaper non-PWM (less than 4-wire) fans). Such cooling systems cannot be controlled by software by design. So yes, you cannot control it. Yes, learn to search the forum and yes, RTFM. You're not the first one coming with such question and definitively not the last one.

    And instead of flaming about lack of FM (like 99% of new forum visitors failing to find an answer and claiming that it is missing) please still learn to use search. And I definitively won't continue the next newbie battle and quit the thread.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2008
  10. attila_gorilla

    attila_gorilla Master Guru

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    GPU:
    ATI Mobility HD 5730
    A couple of months ago I bought a Palit 8800GT with a non-reference cooler. It had no fan control, but that was due to the company trying to cut corners. That model is supposed to have fan control, according to reviews I read and it even had a 4-wired fan. But the PWM chip was apparently missing There were dozens of similar complaints in my area. I returned the card for a refund, who the hell would wanna listen to a bloody hairdryer in the PC?

    So then I bought my current card. I was only interested in non-reference designs. This one works exactly like it`s meant to.

    It`s disappointing how certain companies are trying to cut costs by cheating the customer. I understand there are cards that officially have no fan control, like the Galaxy 8800GT. But when some cards of a certain model do, and others of exactly the same model and packaging don`t, then that is plain cheating.
     

  11. Unwinder

    Unwinder Moderator Staff Member

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    I can hardly call it cheating. Fan control is not a feature declared in the card specs and there are real price wars betweeen different AIB/AICs are trying to customize different reference aspects of the PCB including cooling system. So everyone buying non-reference AMD or NVIDIA hardware should be ready to get a card with no PWM controller or with cheaper cooler with no PWM (3 pins or less) or even with no tachometer (2 pins).
     
  12. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    In my case it is not a cost saving measure. Simply a screwup at the factory. The XFX cards are supposed to be controllable. (That's why they fix them for free.)

    So, if I interpret this correctly this forum is the "manual"......Hang on a sec, I need to roll on the floor till I stop laughing. That is the best joke I have heard in years. To have a manual that's primary instruction is to RTFM is like some kind of MC Ecsher drawing. Thanks, that will keep a goofy grin on my face all day.

    The search tool on this forum is not compatable with IE7. It does work with older versions of IE and seems to work ok with Firefox. (Neither one of which do I have on the machine that I am working on.) Further, this problem "Wrong fan installed at factory" is NOT discussed anywhere on these forums. (I have searched.)

    The Kapt'n
     
  13. Unwinder

    Unwinder Moderator Staff Member

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    Thanks for showing me once again that visiting newbie area of RT forum is just a waste of work time and thinking people are really rare guests here. It is absolutely not fun for me to see how those who fail to find simple answer cover themselves behind "search is broken", "that's not my case" etc, etc. I'll better invest the time in something more useful than reading these things and repeating the same things to every newbie coming here then on reading his smart replies.
     
  14. Rammstein

    Rammstein Master Guru

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    GPU:
    2 XFX 8800GT ZALMAN 512MB
    I have one of those cards aswell, the only solution is to buy a aftermarket cooler. XFX just saved a few bugs on the fan control.
    From the temp both nvdia stock and XFX low cost fans seem to be simular, but for over a week I didnt turn my pc on until I had the new cooler cause of the heavy noise coming from the cards.


    No XFX has 5 models which arent controllable:

    PV-T88P-YHF4
    PV-T88P-YHQ4
    PV-T88P-YHE4
    PV-T88P-YHD4
    PV-T88P-ZHF4

    If you have one not from this 5 in which the fan control doesnt work send the card to your onlineshop where you bought it. I have been to the XFX forum about this and thats exactly what I have been told.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2008
  15. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Rammstein,

    That is some good information that I was not aware of. It looks like most of those cards listed there are "lower end" models. I guess in one respect I did get lucky as my cards are not amongst the listed model numbers. Since XFX agreed to send me controllable fans it would make sense (there I go, wasting my time thinking again) that the cards I have are supposed to have controllable fans. (Some reviews I read indicated that the fans were controllable also.) When the fans arrive, we shall see (fingers crossed).

    Sir,

    While I was trying to figure out my problem (I know, I know my feeble efforts sicken you. etc. etc.) I had the opportunity, nay, PRIVILEGE of studying your responses. And when you are not distracted by your apparent compulsion to bully and abuse all who enter your domain it is clear that you are an extremely knowedgable and intelligent person. Which leads me to believe that the anger and vitrol that flows through your posts is not a result of a cruel and evil disposition, but more an unhappy bitterness that seems to consume you. You should be happy, you have done some great stuff here, and written your own ticket in the process. The insults and belittling comments only diminish what is otherwise a fantastic achievement.

    If you don't enjoy insulting every newbie that comes along, the answer is simple. Don't do it.

    I guess this means that I don't get to see the manual.....

    Peace,
    The Kapt'n
     

  16. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Rammstein,

    I double checked with XFX:

    8800 gt Alpha Dog
    Model: PV-T88P-YDE4

    Fan is definitely supposed to be controllable. Hope that helps someone make a good purchase decision.

    The Kapt'n
     
  17. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Fans arrived. Hooked them up. Fan control works perfectly now.
     
  18. Arctucas

    Arctucas Ancient Guru

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    GPU:
    eVGA RTX2080 FTW3
    RivaTuner is an excellent program. But, it cannot do the impossible; controlling a non-controllable (is that a word?) fan.

    My solution:

    Remove the crappy OEM cooler, replace with a quality aftermarket unit with a quality fan, use a quality hardware fan controller, problem solved!

    If you do not wish to, or cannot afford to, replace the parts, do not blame the software engineer for your hardware problems.
     
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2008
  19. Kaptdeath

    Kaptdeath Member

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    GPU:
    2X 8800GT XFX Alpha Dog
    Err, why replace what is working perfectly and cost nothing to fix? I might gain a bit of overclocking headroom, but I do not wish to give up 2 more slots to clear the aftermarket coolers.

    As for rivatuner. Yes, it is an excellent piece of software. I just wasn't sure if my problems wern't:
    A) My ineptitude at using it.
    B) A hardware problem.

    Turned out it was "B".

    I have already tried +30MHz on both the GPU and the memory with no issues whatsoever. I need to educate myself some more before I go further and no, I won't bother anyone with questions.

    The Kapt'n
     
  20. Lolzz

    Lolzz New Member

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    GPU:
    XFX GF8800GT Alphadog 1024MB
    Fan control on my XFX GF 8800GT

    Thats ist very strange, I can control the fan's duty cycle manually or change various settings (duty cycle min and max. Themperature min, max, working, range, etc etc) for auto mode, using rivatuner 2.09. :banana:
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2008

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