Bitcoin Mining Now Consuming More Electricity Than 159 Countries

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Nov 30, 2017.

  1. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    It's simple:
    People don't have a problem with folding because has an altruistic objective. It actually does something (or at the very least, intends to). Mining is strictly selfish.
    No, I wouldn't say the same thing, for the reason I just mentioned. Take supercomputers owned by corporations and schools for example - they are FAR more power-hungry than what any miner is going to build, but I have no problem with them, because they're doing something useful. That doesn't mean I agree with what they're calculating, but it isn't just arbitrary number crunching.
    People tend to use Bitcoin as a catch-all for cryptocurrency. From what I hear, Ethereum is what GPU buyers are the most interested in. Bitcoin, to my knowledge, never caused any market problems for PCs because everyone just used ASIC miners, which were more cost and energy effective. But Ethereum [for now] is more efficient with GPUs.

    It's wrong because it's selfish and wasteful. You are consuming a lot of power, contributing toward NOTHING at all, while maybe gaining money out of it. Remember, people who partake in this are gambling the value of the currency they are mining for. There's no promise that you'll even keep what you "earned". For the time being, the value is good.
    I find that very hard to believe. I don't think Bitcoin mining is anywhere near as profitable as you think it is if you think getting a couple ASICs is enough to live off of. If you live in the US, chances are, your power bill is not going to be lower than $0.10KW/h. If you're consuming just 2KW per month (including other personal electronics, appliances, air conditioning, etc) then you are not going to reliably survive on mining:
    https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/...ty-consumption-ethereum-energy-climate-change
    Like stated before: Ethereum mining.
    I could argue your mindset is wrong. This is a scary amount of energy and hardware being made for a specific purpose which does nothing and will always do nothing. When a company makes a failed product, they don't usually get far enough to create a concerning amount of waste (of either manpower, energy, or physical resources). Worst-case scenario, it becomes an example of what not to do, and for us to learn from.
    You're comparing the evolution of technology to something that has no intrinsic value at all... The inverse of your comparison can also be said: Look at all the hugely popular pitches on Kickstarter or Indie GoGo that became a major disappointment or never came to fruition. You can also consider products and fads that were super popular or practical that we look back on like "wow, that seemed horrible" or "why did people like this?". And I'm not just referring to things that were obsoleted. For example: Pogs, Pokemon Go, or Vine.


    Anyway, go ahead and justify these "career" choices all you want - I'm not going to stop you/them. But, there is not any amount of evidence you can provide that will convince me that there is nothing wrong with mining.
     
  2. Noisiv

    Noisiv Ancient Guru

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    Greetings to the fellow travelers, if there are any here :)

    We are talking about using electric energy to generate proffit selfish, not murdering babies selfish, laying off thousands or invading foreign countries selfish.
    Anyone with the capitalist mindset arguing against ASIC/GPU mining because it's selfish, needs a fvking head examination.

    Jesus would be more fine with the crypto mining, then with the million other things we're doing on a daily basis.
     
  3. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    In case you didn't read the article, this is a massive amount of electricity for a relatively small amount of participants. If you want to get pedantic, you could also consider things like global warming, which mining is definitely contributing toward at this rate (collectively anyway), which indirectly will be murdering babies.
    Not sure how arguing against mining due to its selfishness gives someone a capitalistic mindset... that doesn't really make sense.
    That I can agree on. But whether you pickpocket someone or murder them in cold blood, you're still a criminal. I'm not saying miners are criminals, but my point is you can't undo a wrong by comparing it to worse things.
    EDIT:
    But if comparing to the millions of other truly terrible things is the way you like to look at things, consider the fact that energy being used on mining could be done to research cures to diseases, the human genome, or physics. When compared to that, how is mining not a problem?
     
  4. Noisiv

    Noisiv Ancient Guru

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    It doesn't.
    I said:

    Anyone with the capitalist mindset arguing against ASIC/GPU mining...

    Here is a fun little fact that I've just came up with, in regard to alleged BTC terrible waste of energy:

    BTC market capitalization divided by electricity used for BTC generation is 2 times higher than the global stock market cap divided by the global electric energy use.
    Not terribly meaningful, I know, but it puts things into perspective.
     

  5. D3M1G0D

    D3M1G0D Ancient Guru

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    Although most of the people who mine do it for selfish reasons, mining itself is necessary for the cryptocurrency network to function - if miners didn't exist then there would be no way to validate transactions, and the entire network would come to a halt. Also, even those who run folding@home (or any other grid computing app) may not do it for completely altruistic purposes; some may do it for pride, as it can be a way of showing off the power of their system (team and global rankings exist for a reason, and people can get really finicky about their credit/points).
     
  6. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Agreed, though, I also couldn't care less if cryptocurrency didn't exist. However, it is nice in the sense that its value continues to go up, and, it is (in some ways) a universal currency.

    As for mining to show off their system's power, that's fine with me. Like I said before, I am perfectly fine with mining for a hobby, or to devote your unused hardware to.
     
  7. WalterDasTrevas

    WalterDasTrevas Member Guru

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    Should I be afraid to speak the truth? If you search for the "parasite" definition, you will find a perfect analogy for someone who keeps 50GPUS at full stress "sucking energy" like vampires and inflating everyone's economy.

    "an organism that lives on or in an organism of another species,known as the host, from the body of which it obtains nutriment.".

    "an individual who lives at the expense of others by sheer exploitation or laziness."

    "a person who receives support, advantage, or the like, from anotheror others without giving any useful or proper return"
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2017
  8. airbud7

    airbud7 Ancient Guru

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    Sorry, But you're wrong dude!
     
  9. D3M1G0D

    D3M1G0D Ancient Guru

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    A miner validates a cryptocurrency's blockchain using their hardware, and gets rewarded for that work with some coins. How is that the definition of a parasite? You either don't know anything about mining or you misunderstand what a parasite is.
     
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  10. StewieTech

    StewieTech Chuck Norris

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    I think we should save energy. But bitcoin makes money so whos gonna stop the lads from making a revenue? Nobody gives a damn about the environment anyway. I think we human are always walking on a thin line tbh...
     
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  11. Alessio1989

    Alessio1989 Maha Guru

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    Fùck off the free market, mining is disgusting.
     
  12. airbud7

    airbud7 Ancient Guru

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    What!....What other market you want?......;)
     
  13. Clawedge

    Clawedge Ancient Guru

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    This right here mate. gotta agree with you. There was a time i really cared, but seeing that all my effort goes to waste cos of the thousands of polluters compared to one who cares, its a lost cause.
     
  14. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    It's not. All you do DOES matter for environment (also includes people, surroundings, etc...). But most importantly it matters to YOU. And yes, you can adopt better life style.

    I can drive to work everyday, but instead I choose to walk and use train (public transport). I walk for more than 2 hours every day, helps a lot with lack of movement due to my desk work. I also reduce risk getting into car accident and slightly reduce road traffic.

    Please, don't give up cause other people choose to life on "auto-mode". We can think and design our lives for us and affect others.

    edit: you can start by bringing your own drink or cup to work/school. So you don't have to waste paper-cup or money buying a drink.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
  15. Clawedge

    Clawedge Ancient Guru

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    Sverek, maybe it has not struck you yet, but just take a look around. Population is exploding like a virus. We humans HAVE fucked up earth beyond repair.

    Let me put it to you like this, humans have taken a point blank shot at earth, the bullet has left the gun, wont be long before it hits.

    Anyway, just enjoy it while you can. It is a beautiful planet. Wont be long
     

  16. sverek

    sverek Ancient Guru

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    So you made yourself an excuse not to give a damn and life on "auto-mode" cause "others" do it?

    It's like, "This street is dirty anyway, I shouldn't feel bad about littering it". WRONG. You shape up your own personality, whether you want to life like decent human being with morals or not, it's up to you. There ways to contribute to environment.

    By environment, I am not only meaning Planet Earth, but our town, our community, our home. You might be close to nothing to Global Environment, but are everything to your home. You are something for your community and town.

    Stop overwhelming yourself with global problems. Think what you can do for your home and community.

    If you having a bad day and feeling like giving up, please pat yourself on shoulder and move on. Just don't write this bullshit nonsense.
    Thank you.

    edit: Sky is still blue, nukes are not falling, air is still breathable. Enjoy life and contribute.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2017
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  17. Alessio1989

    Alessio1989 Maha Guru

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    Common sense? Wasting power (and heat) to compute the nothing is disgusting.
     
  18. airbud7

    airbud7 Ancient Guru

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    The cryptocurrency was trading at £8,914.67 at the time of writing, with a single bitcoin now worth a massive $11,935.34
     
  19. Alessio1989

    Alessio1989 Maha Guru

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    So what? An expensive pile of crap is stil a pile of crap, still disgusting.
     
  20. airbud7

    airbud7 Ancient Guru

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    Yeah, well, whatever...I wish I had a bunch of them bitcoin things.
     

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