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ATI HD 4870 @ ATI FirePro v8700 does work for me..?

Discussion in 'Rivatuner Statistics Server (RTSS) Forum' started by blu0xi, Feb 22, 2009.

  1. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    My videocard: Diamond ATI HD 4870 1GB

    Goal: softmod my vc into ATI FirePro v8700

    Reason: I'm using xsi softimage so i need extra performance for heavy tri/poly counts.

    Action and result:
    after using glemar's patchscript to patch driver firegl version 5.23 or 5.32 and tried to install it, i got a bsod and shutdown. After I rebooted my computer, the windows os immediately showed a hardware dialog looking for firegl driver to install for hardware called v8700 so im like " it worked ? but yet when i tried to install the driver myc omputer crashed?" so i thoguht why not pointing to the newer and latest firepro driver (firepro_8.563_xp32) instead of firegl one? i went ahead and did it.. it worked; i used the update driver ofc.. after rebooting everything is what it should be .. good resolution, games does seem to run just like i did when i had cataylst 9.2 but all seem to be same what i have seen in cataylist 9.2. should I be expecting a sort of different configuration that does come with v8700?

    Question: After using XSI to open and view models with heavy poly counts, I'm not sure if I do see any difference .. maybe faster viewing but overall? I'm not sure.

    I have already downloaded specviewperf 10 .. to be honest with you I'm not at the high level as you guys are, so I'm hoping that you guys could help by telling or teach me how does it work (the specviewperf software) so I can know whether if I am in fact benefiting from the videocard using softmodo or not.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 22, 2009
  2. NormanBates

    NormanBates Master Guru

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    GPU:
    ATI HD3870 / ATI HD4670
    it's not uncommon that windows sees a 4xxx card as a firepro using some of the already available mods... but it's not a real mod, because so far it doesn't lead to performance improvements: as you guessed, there's no performance difference at all (you can confirm that by running specviewperf)
     
  3. Neo_Moucha

    Neo_Moucha Active Member

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    GPU:
    1xQ4600,1xGTS512,4x6800GT
    just run some test like "run 3dsmax" and you will see the result...
    For example:
    Weighted Geometric Mean = 10.61 (geforce fx 8800 gts 512 mb)
    Weighted Geometric Mean = 31.99 (quadro fx 4600 768 mb)
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2009
  4. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    More results

    Results by Viewperf using softmod driver firepro_8.563_xp32:

    1600x1200 Composite ----- Mulitsample Performance

    3dsmax-04 - 34.10 ----- no result
    catia-02 - 28.87 ----- no result
    ensight-03 not Successful ----- no result
    maya-02 - 50.60 ----- no result
    proe-04 - 23.52 ----- no result
    sw-01 - 50.77 ----- no result
    tcvis-01 - 12.97 ----- no result


    Results by Viewperf using cataylst driver 9.2

    1600x1200 Composite ----- Mulitsample Performance

    3dsmax-04 16.92 no result
    catia-02 13.58 no result
    ensight-03 not Successful
    maya-02 33.97 no result
    proe-04 10.60 no result
    sw-01 23.92 no result
    tcvis-01 7.13 no result
    ugnx-01 15.21 no result

    Well I do see a little different (maybe 20 points increas in the maya and 3ds but im guessing that aint much). I even tried to run some demos which are specially created for the v8700, they didnt work. Yep, gotta wait for more development news by gelmar and others (btw keep up with good work on the patchscripts and all, we all appreciate that.)
     

  5. Neo_Moucha

    Neo_Moucha Active Member

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    GPU:
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    nevertheless seems to me like a successful mod...
    and I think it is a huge difference - for example the 3ds points mean more than 100% difference...
    congratulations!
     
  6. NormanBates

    NormanBates Master Guru

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    GPU:
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    if the mod was successful, you'd be getting specviewperf-10 maya results or quite over 200...

    it seems *some* pro features are being turned on, but it's clear that the most important ones are still missing (this may be what gellmar was trying to find out with his features report script)
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2009
  7. buzz89

    buzz89 New Member

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    GPU:
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    Where i can Find the Patchscript?
    Googe dindnt help me.
     
  8. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    Under the "RivaTuner Advanced Discussion forum", look for the thread post titled "XP32 and XP64 patchscript for FireGL and FirePRO (driver 8.44 and higher)"

    http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=275174

    Once there you should see the first post by gellmar and his two patchscripts. I used the first one.
     
  9. vijaynair

    vijaynair Member

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    GPU:
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    The 3dsmax score is good but the other scores are not. Maya score should be over 200 as Norman pointed out. Also, check for stability. Do try to keep this thread updated with your findings. Good luck.
     
  10. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    more explanation

    I think that maybe the softmoding doesnt seem to work for ati hd 4870 to firepro v8700 series is because maybe the firepro driver requires the deviceid code of actual firepro v8700 (in my case for 1gb - it's 9456) to be matched with other external files within the firepro driver itself, not based on patchscript .. maybe thats why some of the "features" you guys mentioned arent turned on when I softmoded...? They might done this to prevent us from softmoding any further.

    1) ATI RADEON HD 4800 (1GB MEM) Series - RV770 - DeviceID: 9440

    2) Rivaturner + Patchscript + Firepro driver

    There's something in here that is blocking us from softmoding

    3) ATI FirePro V8700 - RV770 - Device ID: 9456

    I'm aware that what I've said above here is in fact what Gelmar is trying to find out by debugging the Firepro driver. I'm just trying to figure out using just my mind.

    Edited: Also, you have to think about it .. if we softmod the ati to firepro 8700, itd be powerful without ever having to empty our $$ in our wallets for the real one. I'm pretty sure that the ati guys who are doing the business thing probably wanted the driver developers to implement some sort of more advanced codes to prevent us from softmoding? I mean, if we try to be in the business decision making guys, we'd pressure or do anything to get the products to sell for 1 or 2k. It's purely about $$. Don't they realize that the workstation videos are being used by majority of artists who really dont have much of cash, and we produce better artwork than those who are in high paid corporations.

    Why dont they simply create two different kinds of service; one that is more serious toward more reliability / workable product for business customers while the other one toward gaming / workstation .. one driver for all but the business guys get better services and driver that is reliability. But ALL of us get the same functions, just less attention or something like that? LOOK at Red Linux Enterprise AND Fedora .. both are essentially same (available of apps, functions, everything etc), the only difference is the first one cost $$ in order to receive MORE custom services and attention.. that's all. I mean, surely the ATI guys can do that?

    Note: I'm just typing out what I'm thinking, so forgive me if you find any bad grammatical errors .. English is my second language.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 26, 2009

  11. cayn99

    cayn99 New Member

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    GPU:
    ati HD 4870
    hi there, it's been a while since i quit messing with high end graphic card lol, perhaps it means nothing nowdays, but as far as i remember there were some features not implemented at all in consumer lvl graphic cards (i mean something like istructions not present in the chip), that's why u can improve your card's performance only with some software, consider it some kind of hardware limit...for instance i remember Maya and Softimage|3D being quite "fussy" about graphic cards; one of the main requirements was a feature regarding hardware clipping planes (or somesuch) which only exist on professional graphic cards, time passed but i think high end software like maya still expect you to "feed him" with the proper hardware.

    just my 2 cents, btw the improvement with 3ds is awesome :D
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2009
  12. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    /chuckles - thanks. I just know there is a way to enable all or at least most of major and important features. We just aren't actually doing it (like learning how to programming in C++ or other language of which created the FirePro at first placle.. we just need to understand how it work on a workstation WITH an actual firepro hardware installed. That way, we can monitor how the driver files are being handled by Windows XP, Vista, and 7 (all both 32 and 64bits). After that, we can do some reverse-engineering on them (the firepro files) - we just read source codes or we could try using softimage, maya and other heavy dcc type application on the workstation, see which files are being used.. compare them against the one we use on gaming videocard using cataylst or other ordinary drivers. I think there could be a patchscript that is possible to enable all features, I think that the issue lies in the hex code or other some sort of files that are unrecognizable when installed on top of gaming videocard. I know this might doesnt make sense to any of you, its purely my thoughts. I might will post more and maybe clarify what I'm trying to think.
     
  13. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    What am I missing?

    Edited: Fixed the deviceid issue in the patchscript code, to make sure it mirrors my code correctly

    ok after looking at gellmar's patchscript i realized that i used the 8700 duo and also I didn't add the device id properly.. look below (look for the bold and red which indicate my changes to the gellmar's code;

    To reiterate what I'm trying to achieve:

    softmod my ati hd 4870 (1gb) at ati firepro 8700

    hd 4870 1gb -> device id : 9440
    firepro v8700 -> device id: 9456 (or 56 94 in the code below)

    Code:
    # ATI FireGL/FirePRO XP32 mod by gellmaR (gellmaR@yahoo.com)
    # for FireGL drivers version 8.44 and higher (incl. 8.532.1)
    # Thanks to schoko and YaoZ for general patchscript for 2x00 and 3850
    
    [Common]
    SrcFile = ati2mtag.sys
    BakFile = ati2mtag.old
    HlpFile = newbietechFireGLX2000.rth
    MakeCRC = 1
    Packed = 1
    
    ;common script for 669x+
    DstVar0 = force ATI FireGL V8650 capabilities
    DstVar1 = force ATI FireGL V8600 capabilities
    DstVar2 = force ATI FireGL V7600 capabilities
    DstVar3 = force ATI FireGL V5600 capabilities
    DstVar4 = force ATI FireGL V3600 capabilities
    DstVar5 = force AMD FirePro V3700 capabilities
    DstVar6 = force AMD FirePro V3750 capabilities
    DstVar7 = force AMD FirePro V5700 capabilities
    DstVar8 = force AMD FirePro V7770 capabilities
    DstVar9 = force AMD FirePro V7760 capabilities
    DstVar10 = force AMD FirePro V8700 Duo capabilities
    DstVar11 = force AMD FirePro V8750 capabilities
    DstVar12 = force AMD FireGL V7700 capabilities
    [COLOR="Red"][B]DstVar13 = force AMD FirePro V8700 capabilities[/B][/COLOR]
    
    Src0 = FF 75 08 E8 79 60 00 00 85 C0 74 2E 33 C0 EB 3B
    SCM0 = FF FF FF FF 00 00 00 00 FF FF FF FF FF FF FF FF
    Dst0 = FF 75 08 E8 79 60 00 00 85 C0 74 2E 33 C0 EB 38
    DCM0 = 00 00 00 00 FF FF 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
    
    Src1 = 83 F8 40 75 1D 66 81 BD 00 00 FF FF 02 10 75 00 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF
    SCM1 = FF FF FF FF 00 FF FF FF 00 00 FF FF FF FF FF 00 FF FF FF FF FF FF FF
    Dst1_0 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 0A 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_1 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 0B 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_2 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 0F 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_3 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 8C 95 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_4 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 8D 95 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_5 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D CC 95 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_6 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 9F 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_7 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 9E 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_8 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 46 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_9 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 56 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_10 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 47 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_11 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 44 94 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    Dst1_12 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D 11 95 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    [B]Dst1_13 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D [COLOR="Red"]56 94[/COLOR] 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF[/B]
    gelmar's patchscript can be found from: http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=275174

    I tried to patch it to firepro driver version FirePro_8.563_XP32_74139 (its newer) but it failed. I received the following log error codes:

    Code:
    Browsing for file ati2mtag.sys... selected 6.14.10.6891, 3453440 bytes
    Using native patch installation mode 0
    WARNING: Certified patch script not found, using common patch script...
    0015e353> matched sequence has been replaced
    ff 75 08 e8 65 86 00 00 85 c0 74 2e 33 c0 eb 3b 
    ff 75 08 e8 65 86 00 00 85 c0 74 2e 33 c0 eb 38 
    ERROR: Target sequence must be replaced 1 time(s)!
    83 f8 40 75 1d 66 81 bd 00 00 ff ff 02 10 75 00 0f b7 85 fe fe ff ff
    I'm not sure what the 7th and 8th lines mean.. is there anyone willing to explain what those lines mean?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 7, 2009
  14. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    Info wrong?

    Please take a look at Gellmar's original patchscript above. Look at this line:

    Code:
    DstVar9 = force AMD FirePro V7760 capabilities
    
    Dst1_9 = 0F B7 85 FE FE FF FF 66 25 00 00 66 0D [COLOR="Red"]56 94[/COLOR] 66 89 85 FE FE FF FF 90
    according to this device list from amd (http://developer.amd.com/drivers/pc_vendor_id/Pages/default.aspx) , the FirePro V7760 doesnt exist?

    And also.. the device id is similar to 8700? That makes no sense.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 7, 2009
  15. NormanBates

    NormanBates Master Guru

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    the name you use int hat "force AMD blah blah" line won't matter for anything; to me, it looks like gellmar expected the v8700 to be anmed v7760, but changing that won't matter

    the problem still is the same as it has been for the last few months: there's no working mod for 8.5x drivers, as AMD seems to have added some aditional software locks into this generation of drivers; as previous drivers won't make an HD4XXX card work, these cards are still in no-mod land
     

  16. darrenj

    darrenj Ancient Guru

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    This seems very interesting, I have myself an ATI 4870 1GIG in my possession and would love to try this Fire Pro mod but this is newbee territory for me where do I start. As an ardent gamer would doing this Fire Pro mod increase gaming performance?
     
  17. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    info

    Darrenj,

    It's actually drivers, not the architecture (maybe some but not most).. that make the videocard. For an example, go to amd/ati and check out the following workstaion videocard : v8700.. its the highest end out there but its whole architecture is like exact replica of ours (hd 4870 1gb).

    ATI Radeon series Drivers = Gaming

    FireGL/FirePro Drivers = unlocks some workisation related features inside the so called "workstation cards" (good for 3D modeling - DCC, CAD (AutoCAD, SolidWorks, etc)) BUT even with it you can still play 3D games, just not at the good performance level like the gaming driver. The reason why those workstation cards are so expensive (good ones are like 500 to over 1000, whera the performance equality of them are to ours hd or less.. its purely business thing.)

    Even if that might will make you understand and maybe discontinue taking a interest in this thread BUT if you have a working or mind that is genius, by mean go ahead and help us out, we would really appreciate that much.

    If you're still reading, you could start by -

    1. Learn how to softmod from this site http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=227800 (the info might seems to be outdated but what we do are basically the same.

    2. download rivaturner from http://www.guru3d.com/index.php?page=rivatuner

    3. if you want to get more info / guides / tutorials on how to use the rivaturner then go to this site: http://www.vaguetech.com/?pageid=rt207 (note this was taken from http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=195029 original post by boogieman)

    4. Get a patchscript from http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=275174 , theres more floating around in this forums though. keep in mind theres different patchscripts, like one for winxp 32 bits / 64s / or vista 32bits / vista 64bits.

    5. Download the FireGl/FirePro driver that you want your gaming videocard to be softmoded to. http://support.amd.com/us/Pages/AMDSupportHub.aspx click on workstation cards. Select v8700 then you will get a latest driver

    6. Don't feel too overwhelmed .. just get rivatruner, patchscript, and firegl/firepro driver - for me its basically

    a. find a patchscript for my os (winxp32bits) and my videocard, edit it if you need to (like I did , see my original post and others)

    b. go to folder path : C:\Program Files\RivaTuner v2.23\PatchScripts\ATI\SoftFireGL\Unified

    c. open the file : SoftFireGL w2k.rts with notepad or other text editing software.

    d. copy and paste the patchscript code into it. Save.

    c. this time double click the same file. rivaturner dialog will appear, click the dropmenu and select force v8700 then another dialog will ask you where is the driver file, you just help navigate it to where you extracted the firegl/firepro driver, to driver folder, the cx_ thing then .. click ok and pray that it work.

    d. if it work, then go to mycomputer rightclick it and select manage, select device manager, click display adapter, click on your videocard then right click again, select update river then you know the rest. after that reboot and make another prayer.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 9, 2009
  18. darrenj

    darrenj Ancient Guru

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    Fantastic!
    Rivatuner, I can already, I am versed with the main features for many years. Patchscripting I have done for other software/hardware products not graphic card related.
    Will give this a try when I have my ATI rig up and running. I will report back...
     
  19. blu0xi

    blu0xi Guest

    hope

    awesome! ;D hopefully you can get it working when most of us have failed to do.
     
  20. ignis

    ignis New Member

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