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American senator proposes bill against loot boxes in games

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, May 14, 2019.

  1. SHS

    SHS Master Guru

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    Oh really when why hell do all my niece and nephews bug there uncle to fix there console LoL


    No I disagree some loots should go
     
  2. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

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    Total unregulation. Yeah, that has always worked very well. /s
     
  3. Embra

    Embra Master Guru

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    Best way to handle this is on the consumer side. With our wallets.
     
  4. gx-x

    gx-x Maha Guru

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    Sooo...are they going to ban other forms of gambling too? Or , are those ok because state takes money from it?
     

  5. SHS

    SHS Master Guru

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    depend on what you mean by other forms of gambling
     
  6. gx-x

    gx-x Maha Guru

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    Lottery? Scratch cards? Everything in casinos? They have one common thing: taxation. Unlike loot boxes. It's tax free gambling. That cannot be left in that form. They need to either pay the gambling taxes (whatever those are called, I am not from US), or remove them in their current form, because every other form of gambling has a "gambling" tax attached to it. Of course, we are talking about services that customer pays for and someone profits from it. The gambling is regulated, payed loot boxes are not (yet).
     
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  7. airbud7

    airbud7 Ancient Guru

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    haha...Great Point^...The Lottery here is a big scam!...they get half of all sales then tax half again if you win big.....less than 25% of total sales goes to winner.

    and yet a friendly card game for a few bucks with my buddy is illegal.
     
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  8. SHS

    SHS Master Guru

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    Lottery or Scratch cards those are State or Gov run
    Everybody must have obtain legal gambling licenses even one's on a Indian reservation
    The other online gambling are outside the US must be geo block.
     
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  9. D3M1G0D

    D3M1G0D Ancient Guru

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    Those parents could also be into loot boxes, especially if they are whales. Very few people actually buy loot boxes - it's the whales, who spend thousands of dollars on a single game, who drive this industry. It's basically a way for the rich to entertain themselves and gain a fast track to success, as they do in real life (at the expense of the poor, who need to put up with the grind).

    Personally, I never thought gambling was the main issue with loot boxes - even if you remove the gambling bit, loot boxes would still be a problem (it just means the grind will be even grindier). People will still be encouraged to pay to win, which, IMO, is the real issue. It encourages a worldview where you can buy your way to success, where money solves all problems (as opposed to skill or dedication). Forget about working hard and playing fairly, just bribe your way to the top! It also encourages a culture of instant gratification, where patience is not a virtue and working your way to the top is a fool's errand. This, in my opinion, is far more damaging psychologically.
     
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  10. gx-x

    gx-x Maha Guru

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    Sure, but it's regulated. For example, in every country slot machines must have % set for win. It doesn't matter what is it, it's state mandated and regulated. If your slot machine has a lower % of win rate set - fine is hefty, and license probably revoked. Now, loot boxes also have % chance to get something that you want, and the rest is junk. So they are basically like slot machines. Considering how many people buy these loot boxes (gamble) and how they are not regulated, let alone taxed, they lived long enough. I read that EA's profits are over 80% card packs (gambling) and they pay 0% tax on that. Watch how EA burns down, card packs have been banned in some countries already, look at their stock price...Anthem didn't help either :D

    You are correct. Gambling is not an issue, as long as they (company) PAY gambling taxes and have win % regulated. Which they don't. They sell you the game (or it's f2p, doesn't matter), and on top of that they sell you loot boxes. Government is not really concerned about the user, they are concerned primarily about their share, and the optics of it from perspective of the others that offer services and are regulated and pay taxes on gambling, or fee, or w/e it's called. You at least need to pay for license.
    I am talking from the government side of things.
    From my personal view, even cosmetic gambling is a problem (for example loot boxes in path of exile)
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2019

  11. TieSKey

    TieSKey Member Guru

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    I might agree with u at the philosophical level but u know, u have to start from somewhere. If collectible cards become a reason/excuse to not ban loot boxes for kids then loot boxes become a reason/excuse to not ban collective cards an we are doomed. I think it's better if u see the half full glass, get this done first and then use it as precedent to push for the next thing.

    ---------------------------

    I really hope this gets banned and regulated to the fifth hell but I doubt it will pass. Heck they are not even paying the same kind of taxes a regular casino has to pays and nobody actually checks and ensures the gamble "fairness"......
     
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  12. jaggerwild

    jaggerwild Master Guru

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    Our Gov has so many more important things to focus on, like the China embargoes
     
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  13. asturur

    asturur Master Guru

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    Look to be honest i would be OK with loot boxes as long as those are no more products of the videogame industry but become some sort of highly interactive slot machines. At that point if developers are fine to label them as that they can move forward. You cannot really forbid things nowadays, but just say does are not videogames. Also maybe put a tax on who wants to review/sell those and ask a percentage on the gains as the state does with any betting related activity.

    In some countries you should be registered to be able to play such games to betting registry, profiling you as an high risk for loans and such things.
     
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  14. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Although such a bill I think would improve the gaming industry, I'm not exactly fond of the idea that this is a government-controlled thing. I think an age limit or added tax on loot boxes would be fine, though.

    Considering you're paying with real money, I agree that this is the real issue.
    I assume you mean current? Because there was that whole prohibition era in the US. That being said, last time there were alcohol restrictions at the federal level, it didn't pan out so well. Some states today still have some pretty damn strict alcohol laws, like Utah for example. Many state-specific alcohol laws are relatively recent.

    That's a good point, but the key is to boycott publishers who are very obviously catering to shareholders. The ones who don't do this don't seem to pull this stupid loot box crap.
    There were people who paid a monthly fee for WoW. I'm actually a little surprised that model hasn't become more widespread, though I'm glad it hasn't.
     
  15. scaredchimp

    scaredchimp Member Guru

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    Some people are also missing the point with some of this, and anyone whom does not have children wont understand.

    It's not so much the spending (yes parents control) which is a too simplistic look at it.

    Children more so than adults (conditioned over time) suffer from FOMO, the gaming industry know this more than anyone else.

    I have seen it first hand with my son's school mates, its not the spending that's the problem its more so the increased bullying about not having the latest battlepass or emote or skin.

    whilst this can be said for other industries such as phones or brand names clothes, its not nearly as big and unregulated as the gaming industry.

    But at the same time they could maybe not ban outright, limit some how items that have to be 18+ like lottery and such.

    this could as well could also mean a lot of games will be either adult content (apparently adults are meant to be smarter) and then child content, and then we'll see how the gaming industry reacts as it will show that more child friendly games come out and shows the FOMO predatory practices as the industry.

    also one thing as well, if anyone states children should not be playing games - what age were you when you started gaming and what age rated games did you play, if young do you admit your parents did just as a bad job as those your blaming for loot box spending.
     

  16. chispy

    chispy Ancient Guru

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    I have good vibes about this , hopefully the law will pass and shall set an example for future laws against loot boxes / gambling on games / vapor ware / Digital Ponzi Scheme games
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2019
  17. waltc3

    waltc3 Master Guru

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    I'd like to see microtransactions clubbed to death, frankly. Putting this crap into games, even it it's just virtual in-game money, is just conditioning for using real $ transactions in games. Hope it dies an agonizing, prolonged death. Nothing has as much potential to ruin computer gaming, imo.
     
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  18. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Those are some good points, but kids will always find a way to do such things. The gaming industry may be under-regulated but the behaviors you speak of can't be escaped. Kids can be pretty selfish and cruel, and the relatively anonymity of online games only enforces such behaviors. In other words, ban or limit lootboxes in games and kids are still going to find ways to bully each other over who has what. A lot of this [ironically] comes down to kids wanting to be liked more, or seen as being cooler than everyone else.
    In my own life experience, I've found the wealthier your child's surroundings are (your own income, as well as the child's friends wealth), the more that child will experience a superiority complex among himself/herself and peers.
    Hahaha I think you're preaching to the wrong crowd here. I don't think a single Guru3D member would say kids shouldn't play video games.
     
  19. Cave Waverider

    Cave Waverider Master Guru

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    A good step. Purchasing something where you don't know what you get is basically gambling. I'm all for gambling laws (or equivalent) to apply for such things. Once more countries make laws to prohibit such crap, we'll start to see less and less such deplorable mechanics in games and publishers will have to release better games to make money once more. The better the game, the better it sells. No need for "microtransactions".
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
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  20. SerotoNiN

    SerotoNiN Ancient Guru

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    People make the choice to pay ridiculous amounts for this stuff. Don't buy a game that forces these transactions and developers will stop pimping them out. I have no problem with loot boxes because I don't buy crap that incorporates them, or, incorporates them with a pay wall. Destiny 2 and Division 2 are examples of what I play that does a fine job of avoiding micro transactions. I still don't get people that pay $5 bucks for a virtual shirt, for a virtual character. But that's where we are in society.

    Government has bigger things to fix. Video games don't need this attention.
     

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