Discussion in 'The Guru's Pub' started by The Chosen 1, Dec 15, 2009.
Sir, life is different once you learn about women, and realize you are not immortal.
If you Europeans came here you would realize that we actually need more powerful motors here, almost solely because of the highways. Bigger, torquier motors are almost just as efficient as small motors on the highway because they work so much less at maintaining speed. And if you saw the lengths of some merging lanes you would **** yourself. There are times where I would have to floor the gas pedal just to make it without getting rammed from behind. You literally have no more than 20 metres to get from 50 to 100 km/h sometimes. And as for size, I feel more more comfortable in a car with a spacious interior when I'm driving for 2,3, or 4 hours, usually without stopping for a break. And the back seat passengers sure are glad they actually have room for their legs, their heads and between each other.
I do care about fuel economy, just as long as it doesn't get in the way of having fun or practicality. Well not so much practicality, I'd be a hypocrite for saying that since I a buying a Lexus SC400 as my next car. Does a big luxury coupe need a 250hp 4.0L v8? No. Do I want one? Yes.
Oh and I forgot to mention the ridiculous amount of massive trucks on our roads. No matter what I'm driving I get scared around those things, but much less so if I'm in a bigger car. When you're going 120 km/h in between 2 trucks on a twisting, rutted, under construction highway almost every day the scare factor becomes a pretty important thing.
Oh and one more thing, I've driven cars on both ends of the size spectrum. My current car is a little mazda mx3 with more power than it should have. Sure it's fun to dart around the city and the money I spend of gas is low, but on long cruises with more than 2 people it's terrible. Either the people in the back or the people in the front get legroom, there's no way to have everyone in the car comfortable. My parents' car on the other hand, is just a joy on long drives. Everyone is comfortable and I'm not constantly fearing for my life because of all the damn trucks.
You are preaching to the choir man. I'm in my 30s. the only thing that matters in life is trying to make yourself happy by mostly any means necessary whether it be PC's, Cars, Woman. unfortunately money is the key to it all usually.
The thing that piss me off on american roads are the trucks/SUV/big rigs. well not so much the big rigs, because they deliver our food and stuff but these one manned escalades and excursions, usually driven by people who admittedly cant handle them. 9/10 times they serve no purpose and get half the mileage my guzzler does. Don't get me started about drivers in the south.
Easy to work on Japanese cars? Have you ever worked on a Mazda 6? My right parking light went out recently and we were a bit perplexed as to how to replace the bulb. Look through the manual and find one sentence which tells the method, "Take the car to the nearest Mazda dealer." Turns out you have to remove the front bumper to get to the lamps. Not only that, you then have to remove the entire front lamp assembly. It's all dependent on every model of car. Our Dodge Dakota pickup (1995) is a breeze to work on as it has plenty of room inside the compartment. My Mazda 6 on the other hand requires you to take it to the dealer to have lights replaced while the Honda CR-V and Odyssey are a bit easier to do that task and don't require you to take them to the dealer.
And, again, massive trucks are commonplace in the US and Interstate speeds start at 110km/h and go all the way up to 150km/h in Texas. I deal with semitrailer traffic daily, even off the highway. Those trucks are massive and I've seen what happens when Japanese and European compact cars are involved with such trucks and with those big SUVs (which are not just American cars, plenty of European and Japanese SUVs as well).
There's something to be said about having more mass around you to absorb impacts from other massive objects. And there's something to be said about the comfort of larger cars versus smaller cars. I have an uncle who could easily fit inside of a Corvette, or my Mazda 6 which also sits low. But he could never be comfortable getting into, or out of, either vehicle due to bad back and replaced knees. He prefers larger vehicles because he doesn't have to bend to get in them, same goes for many older people with back and knee issues. Now, that alone in the US is a big reason larger cars are more popular. We have an aging population, like other developed nations, and they tend to prefer larger (safer and more comfortable in turn) vehicles over smaller. Part of that is that they grew up in those massive boats that were produced between the 1930s and 1970s. It's a familiarity and there's much to be said of familiarity when it comes to cars and car choices.
I agree with the first comment made. This is ment to troll against the americans. Shame on you. We do this because we like cars. It shouldnt be a sin to want to pay more for gas if you want to have more fun behind the wheel of a high performance car. If you dont want to have fun, simply go out and buy yourself a freekin honda and dont support the usa. Thats cool.
Well, i'll have to go with the American side
Bring more power!!!!!
Oh, for the record, I would never buy a car that Europeans consider small. I believe a Civic is midsized there - that's the smallest I'll go (considered small in the U.S.).
Comfort and safety matter a lot - I need a larger, durable car which can keep me alive in case of an accident, and which I can drive in for many hours comfortably (LOTS OF LEG ROOM). India pisses me off about this - most of their cars are unfathomably small, and people crowd them - no one gives a **** about safety or comfort there. Just efficiency.
Gotta' be a balance. I love Japanese cars. I care about reliability. I'll probably buy a car that's a little better with mileage and for the environment, but those factors come AFTER reliability, comfort, and safety. We've got a Honda Civic and a Honda Pilot here at home - Pilot is a pretty large vehicle for what we're used to. And you know what? I love it. The power, the reliability, and the safety (and comfort!). I'd even buy a Ridgeline. And yes, I prefer Honda because of their excellent record with reliability - not fanboyism - should some other company "take the throne," I'd start buying from them.
Civic is midsize yes... small is something along the lines of Smart... big is everything bigger then civic my citroen c4 is midsize and its all fine ill buy Station Wagon down the line when family grows but thatll be family car for myself i want something fast and fun
lol I will never be a station wagon dad
Sure, would love to hear some.
I'm sorry but if you don't see anything wrong with a gas guzzling 5.7L V8 only having 210hp and a 1.9L 4 cylinder diesel engine having 215hp (diesels usually need bigger engines for the same amount of power that a gas engine has... at least in European cars). That's more then double the size of the diesel and 4 more cylinders. Don't give me the old engine thing. My early 90's Golf III had much smaller engines with roughly the same amount of power.
American cars got bad reputation because of this.
The handling thing... i think it also came from the muscle cars... it seemed they were only good for straight roads that is why there is that myth (if it is a myth...).
I'm thinking of buying the Opel Ampera (Chevrolet Volt twin brother) but now I'll just stick with a Peugeot or one of those from the Renault-Nissan alliance.
I think you can have lots of fun redlining a 60hp car and eventually blowing it up.
Ive seen a documetary about toyota mechanics being involved with future model designs to basicly make life easyer for mechanics and somewhat to users. Then another report where a wv worker on an assembly line got a fat extra for inventing a new tool wich helped in assembly. I wonder whatever happens in other companys.
Id still rather drive a nice youngtimer I made my hands dirty with.
well it will be for my wife ofc like id drive around in it! but if Saab doesn't go down i was planning on Saab 9-3 Turbo X mmm SW that i would drive
ROFL. Yes, midsized in the U.S. is the Camry, Accord, Taurus, etc. Large would be SUVs (most, not all - the CRV, RAV4 are considered small), trucks, and large luxury cars (Avalon, although this can be considered "larger midsized").
I just hate small cars. So CRAMPED. I can't get in comfortably, and my legs cramp up when they have no leg room, often.
And to whoever said to "buy a Honda" and "not support the U.S.A." - get real. Hondas and Toyotas are built in massive quantities in the U.S. buying them is still supporting American workers, and the U.S. in that regard. I give my money to who does a better job - it's competition. American car companies started failing because of their inadequate competition from inferior goods. Pretty simple.
There is only one American car I'd buy. And, I'd probably never buy it, unless its reliability jumped a bit. It's the Jeep Wrangler. Always had a thing for that vehicle.
To the person with the Mazda 6. I have a MazdaSpeed 6 and i've done just about every bolt on imaginable. Aside from the lights. I don't really care about emissions. Or gas consumption because... I want the power. Yeah It's a 4 cyl motor.. but it cranks out about 330 hp. But that power takes gas.
15 Gallon tank -- 320 Miles to the tank.
And yes, small cars blow. I'd never buy one EVER!! I don't care if it gets 60 or 70 mpg.
I can only assume you are talking about an old transit as all current model transits have their rear lights attached with two bolts inside the van, there's no reason to stick your fingers inside the door gap. They even use thumbscrews so you don't need a screwdriver. The only transit which has the rear lights attached with three bolts is the chassis cab, which has no rear doors anyway.
When I said blanket statement I meant that Euro models are usually designed by European designers and engineers, nothing to do with it being an American company.
well an American that trades a 10mpg rig in for a 30mpg one is saving a lot more fuel than a European who trades a 30mpg one for a 50mpg because the relationship is non-linear. See the tables here:
assuming 10,000 miles per year which is low for an American...12-15,000 per year is average but anyway at 10,000 miles per year if I move from a 10mpg Tahoe to a 30mpg whatever I'm saving 666 gallons a year which at say $3 per gallon is $2000 a year. Jumping from a 30-50mpg rig I only save 133 gallons per year which is just $400 a year and add in my new car payments mean I'm losing money not saving it at all....so maybe thats why the US websites make a big deal out of 30mpg...or maybe not
why are you using a desktop consuming around 200W to surf the web?
but a modern 5.7 is making just at or a little over 400hp and well over 400ft/lbs of torque.
Something you guys need to look at is that American motor companies lied in the 70s and 80s about power output. I'm not sure exactly why but my old 79 camaro was rated at 175hp, which was a bold faced lie. 175hp wont push a 4000 pound car to 60 in under 6 sec.
Another thing is the measurement of horsepower is how quickly you can get your torque to the ground. If you dont have the torque then it really doesn't matter. most american v8s put out more torque then hp. I mean I'm putting out over 100hp at 1200rpm. the power comes early and hangs around till 6k-7k.
If america was still going at the 1960's standards our 350ci small blocks would make 450+ from the factory in an all cast iron configuration. The Euro/Japanese arguement is kinda one sided especially when you consider you guys compare modern technologically advanced engines to an engine that been pretty much unchanged since 1955. wonder what kinda HP/mileage honda and volkwagen were making in 1969.
This is true. One of the only euro designs to really hit Ford over here in the States, was the LS. And we have almost no Ford car that You guys over east of us have. Example, Ford Falcon for Euro, and Ford Taurus SHO for the States. The closest American and European Ford cars come, is probably either Volvo or Jaguar.
The purpose of this thread was to show that American cars are overpowered and why they use those type of cars. If your culture thinks that they need V8's and 200hp engines for city driving... ok then... was just asking why ...
Also if you press the pedal in a 3.0L v6 or whatever the difference in gas consumption will rise exponentially compared to, lets say a 1.6L 4 cylinder engine that puts out 80-110hp...
And if you want torque... try diesel... or electric ...