"AMD's Mantle 1.0 is dead; long live DirectX"

Man...I don't mind the wrong thread. But there's too much of it!
Also, I know where you're coming from, because I used to be linux-crazy like that. Well maybe not THAT crazy c1:

 

Just to let you guys know, I'm really enjoying the conversation here thus-far (as long as it remains civilized - even though it has gone way off topic, but as the OP, I'm okay with that; not sure I can speak the same for the moderators). I come here to read the comments whenever I'm bored.

Was going to ask, aside from gaming, I know (well not know, but have came across on the internet) many audiophiles who prefer Linux over Windows.

I was going to ask, is there alternatives to programs like MPC+Madvr, LAV Filters, FFDShow, Motion Interpolation Programs, and the such for Linux? You know applications that make the film experience a whole lot better? And how do they run? especially with the open-source videocard drivers? Do they outperform Windows the way some audiophiles claim Linux outperforms Windows in the sound department?

 

There is a huge reason mate, 3 sides(!) invested people and money into DirectX, billions of dollars of R&D. No one is stopping anyone to invest the same into bringing it all onto Linux. But Linux folks want it for free (Apple folks don't know what we are talking about, CandyCrush ftw!).

Look at what instruction sets your CPU supports and what intel supports. See the difference? Well that difference has advantages and intel payed man hours for that. Same goes for everything. Someone would need to get a lot of work done on OGL to bring it up to par with DX11 where (for the sake of simplicity I wont write the actual code) a dev calling for a specific instruction to be done on a gpu writes:
DX: call func123
OGL: <insert full page of text here>

because first one just tells GPU what to access internally through DX which already has the page of code tied to func123, and you don;t have it for OGL.

That's why it wont happen unless people start paying other people to code that.

Your game examples are fine but far from ample not to mention they are free to play. (maybe dota2 still isn't? Who cares, LOL is better)

 

Installing Windows 8.1 took me about 30-45mins when i got the new SSD, with about half that time just on the updates, so probably about 15-20 if i slipstream the updates beforehand.

I never tweak a single thing, no developer of a game or app tests things on a tweaked version of Windows and you never know when an issue is caused by you or the game/application.
If you can't resist the urge, maybe use one of one of those optimiser apps that restore everything back when your finished gaming.

 

I never really got into Madvr and the likes on Windows, so I'm unsure of how/if equivalents exist on Linux. I use mpv though, and it does list command-line stuff for setting video filters and other stuff though (so maybe something like what madvr does can be set-up on Linux; but likely not as-user-friendly or out-the-box-like).

As for interpolation; I don't think something like SVP (where it happens on-the-fly) exists natively (their FAQ page mentions you could try it from Wine; which should be fine since you can do OpenCL), but you can apparently convert videos and add interpolation via slowmoVideo.

Edit: Butterflow appears to be an easy way to convert videos with frame interpolation. It won't work on Ubuntu on anything aside from NVIDIA's proprietary driver though (some OpenCL library incompatibility), but it'll apparently work fine on other distros regardless of hardware.

Not entirely sure about video quality itself, but hardware-acceleration methods vary between drivers. I think AMD's proprietary driver supports VA-API, but only when it's emulated from another API (XvBA?). The open-source radeon driver supports a few more methods, including VDPAU, which does work quite nicely in my experience.

As for audio, I'm not really an audiophile and haven't done much comparison at all; but if anything, my sound card was handled better under Linux (Xonar DG).

Part of my delay is that i'm on DSL; so maybe that just magnifies the problem for me. If I recall right; Windows 8.1 after a clean install wants to download 800MB worth of updates out-the-box (and at some point, it was up to 1.5GB I think, but that was before Update 3).

Hmm, I guess that's a valid concern (I'm not a dev so I can't really argue with that), but perhaps it may be different now with DX12 and Vulkan.

Also, LoL is DX9 as well (last I checked anyway)

 

Ah, well i'm on 152mb so wouldn't notice that, most of the delays are on the multiple reboots, but even then if your using an SSD most of it's done while your making a coffee.

 

I was just saying it's a F2P so their interest is to gather as much as possible since f2p games tend to gather much more than just one sale worth of money per customer. I know people that spent over 1000$ on LOL. It doesn't matter what API it uses, I guess you have lol for Linux, Diablo 3 is also on linux and I can give you even more canon fodder but I won't I am a jerk like that

But yea, someone needs to put code into libraries to simplify and speed up development on any given API. There has been a lot of investment into DX. M$ payed, Hardware makers followed, then developers followed. Games are more complex with each new generation and simplifying API in a sense that you can code faster is a big deal. Even on consoles, hardware manufacturer gives developers lessons and dev boxes to speed up coding and simplify it for them. It's not just a matter if devs want to do it or not. Also, there are backwards compatible games, say, a dx11 game that can run a dx9 or even just OGL but you don't get full visual or other benefits - but it runs. Something like if you run PhysX capable game on AMD card, you get the game but not the PhysX effects.

 

I'm all for gaming going the ogl/vulkan direction and being multiplatform, not that I will change windows anytime soon, but because competition was always bringing the good stuff to the table for us, the users. Sure, linux usage is laughable, the userbase it is the non-paying one, making quite unprofitable to do any effort into making a game run on it, but all it takes are several major game engines to add support to, so a massive amounts of aaa titles can work on linux. And that is kinda happening now, so ms will feel the heat.

As for win/lin debate, use what you want, more people actually using linux is better for us in the long run, ms opensourcing the .net framework so that mono can provide compatibility is great too, but please don't put as an argument few hours of install time worst case every several years, thats not going to cut it. Neither the price - the time you need to just switch is worth more than the price of the os itself. It all boils down to if you find the os to you needs, can it run the things you need from it and that's all.

 

"AMD's Mantle 1.0 is dead; long live DirectX"

The question is:

Was mantle alive before his death?

How many games have mantle right now?

Four?

 

7

bf4
Sniper Elite
PVZ
Theif
Civ:BE
DA:I
Hardline

there are more coming.

 

yea, StarCitizen :d

Spoiler

somewhere in the late 2028

 

lol...

kidding aside, coming supposedly is Mass Effect, Mirrors Edge, Star Wars, Star Control, and a bunch of others.

 

I don't see why engines that already support Mantle wouldn't use it. It'd still give AMD hardware an advantage in those games until DX12/Vulkan is widespread

 

This doesn't make sense to me.

AMD spend millions on Mantle development only to push Micro$oft to upgrade DX version to 12 and then drop mantle.

:3eyes:

DX 12 will be avalaible for AMD and NVIDIA and wathever GPU out there.

Where is the exclusive benefit for AMD?

DX 12 for Nvidia?

:banana:

 

If you had been following from the beginning, they never expected mantle to be permanent.

They just wanted the current API vendors to get off their butts.

They said this way back in October of 2013

 

AMD's spendings on Mantle probably aren't too bad if it much of it ended up in Vulkan.

As for DX12, it was definitely in development before Mantle. Just not at a level to be ready for showcase.

 

Sarcastic mode on.

So AMD is like Sony: they do it "for gamers", not for the money?:eyes:

Thanks AMD you spend millions "for gamers" (even for Nvidia gamers).

Sarcastic mode off.


I'll never expect Nvidia spending million without looking the ROI.

 

I'm pretty sure DX12 was first, while Mantle was fast tracked as it only had to work on GCN hardware.

AMD announcing a few years back that there would be no DX12 makes me even more certain of that.

I'm not convinced Mantle will be used after BF Hardline, by the time the next Frostbite game is out DX12 will also be out and why would GCN AMD users need two low level apis?

 

Well, AMD users don't "need" it, but even with Win10 being a free upgrade during the first year, there'll be a transition period.

I agree that for example Dice probably won't use Mantle for the Frostbite 4 engine. But if the Frostbite 3 engine hasn't had any huge upgrades for Battlefront, that game could use it.