AMD: ZEN3 architecture finished – expects 15% faster IPC

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Nov 22, 2019.

  1. Kaotik

    Kaotik Member Guru

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    It's different enough for AMD to change processor family from 17h of Zen1/+/2 to 19h in Zen3. Granted, they've switched it once (or twice if you count going from CPU to APU) before on quite flimsy basis, but it's definitely not a habit

    So long as they can fit everything in the BIOS (which has been a challenge as we know) there's no reason it wouldn't work. Zen4 will require new socket and motherboard though (and memories to accompany, DDR5)
     
  2. Octopuss

    Octopuss Master Guru

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    I am still holding onto overclocked 3770K, but it's finally turned into a major pain in the ass. Lightroom just doesn't work well it at all, freezing and being slow as hell all the time and I don't know if I can keep using this PC for much longer. Zen3 definitely looks like something to wait for, but we're looking at like 7 months from now at least. I just don't know.
     
  3. NewTRUMP Order

    NewTRUMP Order Master Guru

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    Gee I just make things up ..….you got me!

    https://www.kitguru.net/components/...-gains-over-8-and-up-to-200mhz-faster-clocks/


    https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel...ase-in-clocks-compared-to-Zen-2.438940.0.html
     
  4. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    Yeah, I mean I was expecting an AMD estimate of 8% not a forum rumor. So now it's like forum rumor = 8% and then you're taking that rumor and saying it's easy to see how it could be 15%.

    It's speculation on top of speculation and the only statement we have from AMD is essentially "the 15% from Zen 2 was due to optimizations being pushed from Zen+, expect more normal numbers from Zen 3"

    Which to me means 4-6% IPC gain maybe 8 if you include the frequency bump.
     

  5. K.S.

    K.S. Ancient Guru

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    I tend to give @Hilbert Hagedoorn the benefit of the doubt given his track-record delivering accuracy. If he's wrong he's wrong and he fixes it from what I've seen... I'm looking if anyone is claiming an AMD source for any uptickwards of 15% IPC. Otherwise I agree with @Denial those are ghost estimates.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2019
  6. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    it appears to be a misquote.
     
  7. K.S.

    K.S. Ancient Guru

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    Oh... @Astyanax how so? Here's the original source for that excerpt/story and that quote is intact if I read things right (I may not have) EDIT: I think I understand what you meant now. Misquote of the quote - lol. GURU3D tongue twisters...

    Original source, article quote first appeared. - "Real Money" By Eric Jhonsa - Nov 18, 2019 | 09:00 AM EST
    "AMD Inks New Server CPU Deals; Data Center Chief Discusses Them and More"
    [​IMG]
    Original source of quote (above article) didn't claim 15% uptick in Zen3. Would have been newsworthy; isn't intention of quote.
    Remain a skeptic? Write Eric Jhonsa a friendly letter & ask the man himself! :)
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2019
  8. Kaleid

    Kaleid Ancient Guru

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    Great, not sure I will upgrade this time though unless it also works for AM4.
     
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  9. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    I think it will - would be silly for them to launch a new socket right before DDR5 hits mainstream only to have to launch a new socket again.

    I honestly think one of the best decision AMD made was not constantly swapping sockets.
     
  10. msroadkill612

    msroadkill612 Active Member

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    One of the factors cited seems neglected here. The "things which had to be left on the cutting board" sounds very real world to me.

    Deadlines can be brutal.

    zen is so fresh and new, and budgets are blossoming, so i imagine there is a lot of low hanging fruit at this stage of its evolution.
     

  11. bobblunderton

    bobblunderton Master Guru

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    If you have a gen 6 intel or older (or even anything 7xxx that's not a dynamite overclocker), you will be very pleased with a 3700x CPU or 3900x if you wish to splurge a bit. The 2700x is also currently listed for 160$ at Micro Center & you get 30$ off the price if you include an AM4 motherboard in your purchase (almost any motherboard there). So 130$ for a 2700x, which easily rivals 4xxx~6xxx intel chips, or pick up a new 3700x which will be even quicker and have a lot more cores VS the quad-core-with-Hyperthreading we were accustomed to.
    I made the leap, very happy with the new system I put together around August!
    x570 Asrock Phantom Gaming 4 (Pci-E 4.0, intel NIC, 8 sata ports, open-ended PCI-E slots (for accomadating longer cards). ~150$
    Micron RAM that was on sale 2x 16gb sticks of 3000mhz CL15 ~2x 70$
    3700x boxed processor with boxed cooler, replaced paste with liquid metal in very very small quantity, as there was WAY TOO MUCH paste on the cooler from the factory. Was 50$ off with combo at the time so ended up paying 329$ for processor and 104.99$ for the motherboard.
    1TB NVME drive (Inland brand, was on sale.). ~103$
    Of course Seasonic PSU, external BD-burner, used full tower Fractal case for 40~50$ off auction site, and used 50$ Sound Blaster Audigy RX
    Rx 480 8gb that's a hold-over from the old machine, it got hit by some surges so it's down-clocked 10% but still works for now.
    So I paid about 800 for the parts not including video card, case and my 3$ BD-Burner drive (yes, and it's not even stolen!!!)

    Works great. Does CAD stuff in Maya and runs BeamNG Drive stuff like a total pro. Working with graphics in professional software and even simple zip/unzip file management operations had a considerable reduction in wait-time. My 4790k @ 4.4ghz just could NOT hold a candlestick to this.
    I listed my modestly powerful system for those interested in making the jump. I just put the bare-minimum motherboard in but you can get an Asus if it suits you better, though from an added cost perspective it wasn't worth it for me.
    You will not regret the jump one bit from intel, unless you already have an 8086k/8700k/9700k/9900k processor.
    No boost issues. Never updated BIOS from release days as it 'works fine', why fix what isn't broken? No heat or noise issues from CPU cooler or the chip set fan (which many people say makes noise, I have a sound-deadened case and even with the side panel off I can't hear the chip set fan EVER - though - that being said nothing I have is PCI-E 4.0 yet).
    Processor overclocks itself as needed, without PBO enabled, stock cooler is 'good enough' unlike any intel ones from Pentium 4 "Prescott" onward.
    Extra cache memory helps the process scheduler keep the cores fed quickly, with limited 'wasted hops' in the CPU.
    Upgrade path is a BIG bonus as I could put a 16-core 32-thread 3950x in here one day when they're more affordable. Purportedly Zen 3 will slot into an existing AM4 motherboard, keeping fingers crossed. That being said I'm running 92 people in a Rimworld modded colony on this with a bunch of traders here and 200+ animals in the map, and it's going along nicely yet, SO much faster than the other machine was.

    Consider it, you won't be disappointed as it is easily on par with intel for the most part, sometimes winning, sometimes losing. You'd be hard pressed to tell the difference unless you ONLY game in multiplayer competitive gaming with 144hz refresh rates with a monster GPU / low settings. Things with file zip/unzip, encoding, working with video/graphics/model editing is much better here. No buyer's remorse, and honestly, not sure why you're still waiting.
    This was not a paid post etc. Just totally honest.
     
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  12. K.S.

    K.S. Ancient Guru

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    Man can't beat it ... good ole' Microcenter still kickin as Fry's is a dyin' heh'
     
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  13. kanenas

    kanenas Active Member

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    So 130$ for a 2700x, which easily rivals 4xxx~6xxx intel chips

    you give to little credit to Amd
    let me show you what a 2700x can make with 3600 cl15 ram,x470 and ryzen calculator.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  14. Carfax

    Carfax Ancient Guru

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    Frequency is just one part of why Intel still rules in gaming. The others are lower memory latency, and lower inter core latency, and it doesn't seem like Intel will be abandoning it's monolithic die strategy so they will likely keep those advantages.

    Also, Zen 3 might face off against Intel desktop CPUs based on Willow Cove if Intel can get its act together in 2020, which it seems like that's whats happening.

    Intel isn't going to take this laying down, but at least AMD seems serious about decisively taking back the CPU performance crown in all aspects so it's going to be game on in 2020!
     
  15. Angushades

    Angushades Master Guru

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    Your a fool to not be updating your bios and that backwards quote of "why fix what isn't broken" doesn't stand up in computing. Ryzen 3000 bios was broken at from the start whether you like it or not. So my advice would be to update the bios.
     

  16. Angushades

    Angushades Master Guru

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    That's and exception not the rule mate.Very few ryzen plus go over 2900memory stable.
     
  17. kanenas

    kanenas Active Member

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    What?I have 3 systems hero vi,hero vii,x370 gaming 5 and ryzen 2600x,2700x,1600x all of them works from 3200 2 3600.
     
  18. Aura89

    Aura89 Ancient Guru

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    That's just not true. My previous 1700x and my wifes current 1600 both do 3200Mhz no problem, and the 2000, Zen+ CPUs had it even better.
     
  19. K.S.

    K.S. Ancient Guru

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    Lol oh noooo someone had to say something about another user’s RAM and the knives came out... :mad::mad::mad:
     
  20. wavetrex

    wavetrex Maha Guru

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    For Zen 1 (1000 series), 3200-3400 is reasonable with a good board, but more ... not really, must be lucky.


    Zen 1+ (2000 series, non G) goes all the way to 3600, but that's the limit as, the IF cannot go higher than 1800 on those chips and there is no "unlinked" mode on them.


    DDR4-3800 (aka, 1900Mhz) are easy to do for a lot of Zen 2 chips (including mine).
    The controller can certainly do more, it depends on the memory kits on how low/tuned the latency can go.
    (It's better to keep it in sync with IF, 1:1, so up to 1900Mhz, the using faster memory and adding buffering in the I/O die - which adds latency)
     

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