AMD VEGA Launch Imminent ?

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Aug 15, 2016.

  1. RotatingFan

    RotatingFan Banned

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    I personally dont care if AMD stays away from the top 1% of the market because it makes the top end cards much more expensive.
    The reason i dont mind is because i dont buy them and it will hurt the people who do so when i see people bragging they have a 1080 ti its not envy i feel but pity and ridicule.:banana:
     
  2. rm082e

    rm082e Master Guru

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  3. jura11

    jura11 Ancient Guru

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    Those prosumers Tesla P100 cards are not even for sale,they hopping to launch them in next year or end of the year sadly Quadro are still based on GDDR5/X

    But agree this card can be first consumer HBM2 card,regarding hype,every new card brings some sort of hype

    Market simply needs to have two players and due this I want AMD to succeed with their new cards although I don't think Vega 10 will be faster than GTX10xx series,but I would be happy too if AMD prove my predictions wrong :)

    Thanks,Jura
     
  4. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    I don't see why AMD couldn't do HBM2. Nvidia has been shipping the DXG-1 with HBM2 since May. I don't know if availability will be sufficient for an October launch, or if there is even a reason for Vega 10 to get HBM2. But certainly by 2017 they HBM2 will be fine for consumer products.

    As for SSG card, it doesn't use a memory controller to interface with the SSD cache. The application needs to be programmed specifically for the cache using an API that AMD is providing. Those drives are directly accessible to the OS as if they were mounted in any PCI-E adapter. I don't really foresee mixed HBM/GDDR systems -- the complexity of the memory controller would add unnecessary cost/die size over just going GDDR5x or HBM2.

    Titan X was launched because it's the cut chips from full GP102 Quadro. I doubt it's a response to Vega -- Ti on the other hand will most likely be a response to Vega.

    At the moment the biggest thing AMD needs to do is start supplying it's cards. RX480's are consistently out of stock and lots of people are buying 1060's due to the availability problems. If they are having manufacturing problems on a ~230mm2 card it's only going to get worse with the big ones. Hopefully that ~100K injection of Polaris 10 chips is the first of many. The 480/470 are excellent cards -- they just need more on the market so they can sell them.
     

  5. huilun02

    huilun02 Master Guru

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    Can't wait.
    There's always something AMD brings without fail.
    Its called competition and better price/perf.
    And this time with more HBM.
     
  6. PrMinisterGR

    PrMinisterGR Ancient Guru

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    No one has been actually shipping products with HBM 2.0, at any meaningful quantity. The Tesla P100 is a Q4'16 product, and the GDX-1 is a cluster so expensive that they won't even list suggested prices. I actually don't believe that anything with HBM 2.0 will ship this year in any kind of quantity. I hope I'm proven wrong.

    You have a point, but on the software side that's the problem that they have basically solved with the Fury. The more I look on the SSG, the more interesting it looks. It seems that a simple bridge chip is used, nothing fancy, and that it requires API support for the SSD, not because the SSD is otherwise invisible, but for the apps to realize it's on the GPU. With card VRAM you probably won't even need that, since it will be on the GPU itself, and not present itself as a storage subsystem. Only the GPU driver needs to know about that, like it's happening today with the Furies. I'm thinking of even weirder configurations, like 2GB HBM+12GB DDR4. That would even be cheaper, the way DDR4 prices are going.

    You're probably right about that, but it also helps NVIDIA since all the $1,000+ commitment people would have gotten a Titan X already and won't even look at Vega, even in the miraculous case it's as fast as a Titan X. For the Ti I believe it will actually be faster than the Titan X, a repeat of the original Titan/780Ti story. Probably a 3840 configuration thus making the Titan X an even worse purchasing decision (if that's possible).

    Are they having manufacturing problems, or they can't make them fast enough? Unless we get a scoop on financial reports, we have no idea. I wonder if AMD will stick with GloFo for Vega, or go the way of Samsung and/or TSMC.
     
  7. Loophole35

    Loophole35 Ancient Guru

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    I would imagine no later than end of year for the GP100 (at least the Governments order).

    I kinda agree with Denial on the need of HBM at this point other than power. GDDR5X seems to be very nice and we have yet to see it on a 512bit bus.
     
  8. semitope

    semitope Member

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    at the time people were complaining about a lack of information, even in the reveal event. Somehow people also complain about overhype from AMD at the same time.

    Can't win.

    AMD has overhyped nothing. The 480 is what it is and what they said it was. AMD did not say it would beat a 980ti or anything like that.

    And the 480 can do pretty good. I am kinda pissed it can get close to fury scores with OC (firestrike scores). Pretty sure that it would beat a 980ti in dx12 at that point since the regular fury does the same. If they release better overclocking versions later than chip will be too good considering a regular reference 480 beats massive oc 1060 in dx12 from what I saw.
     
  9. Stormyandcold

    Stormyandcold Ancient Guru

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    Using the best cpu's, a couple fps. Using older cpu's...different story tbh.
     
  10. PrMinisterGR

    PrMinisterGR Ancient Guru

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    The 2GB less vram (from the new standard of 8GB), the 192-bit bus and the very very few CUDA cores make me very nervous with the 1060. It could just have been a similar drop in performance like the 1070 is from the 1080. Go for 1500 CUDA cores at least. At this point it's really the frequencies that make it competitive, and historically that never ended well. We'll see. I'm trying to avoid this cycle and see what happens once Vega is out.
     

  11. Loophole35

    Loophole35 Ancient Guru

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    AMD themselves handled the 480 very well during the time leading up launch. The AMD faithful on the other hand were hyping it. If they do the Vega launch the same way that would be great. They keep doing it this way and the AMD base will learn to curb it's enthusiasm until it is warranted. Polaris is a great card wish they would have made the 10 a 470 and not clocked it as high and left 480 for Vega10 and 490 for Vega11.
     
  12. Undying

    Undying Ancient Guru

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    Isnt it little too obvious how Nvidia plan to tick-tock every year? They rushed Titan XP just before any serius rumor about Vega. Sell it before we get ready Volta next year to compete.

    And people are still buying Maxwell cards.
     
  13. Finisterre

    Finisterre Member

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    Oops,

    http://www.tomshardware.com/news/openai-nvidia-dgx-1-ai-supercomputer,32476.html
     
  14. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    I don't see any indication that they rushed Titan. The Quadro P6000 card was launched and cut down variants went into cheaper Titan P cards.
     
  15. eclap

    eclap Banned

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    You're seeing things wrong. Dx12, 980ti beats 480, comfortably. Stock for stock, 480 is slightly faster than the 1060 in dx12, slower in Ashes though. Overclock both and the margins disappear.
     

  16. jura11

    jura11 Ancient Guru

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  17. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    The drop in performance for 480 and 1060 for whatever reason is rather similar even on weaker cpus. Apart from Vulkan API actually. Where 480 loses a lot.
     
  18. Finisterre

    Finisterre Member

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    Oops,

    P100 available for prosumers for a hefty sum.

    https://www.nvidia.com/object/deep-learning-system.html
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2016
  19. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    Fact is tho both oc roughly the same %. And depending on test setup either 480 is faster in Ashes or 1060 is faster in Ashes when both are stock. For example on g3d 1060 loses.

    Overclocking both means they are as a whole equal. With 1060 being faster in most dx11 by small margin and 480 being faster in most dx12/vulkan titles by small margin.

    @semitope to get close to fury or fury x in firestrike scores you need something like 1500 on the core for a 480 maybe 1600 to match fury x and that is not happening. Then you can still oc the fury x to get better score anyway.

    It might get "close" in synthetic benchmark but you are not going to see similar performance in games unless you game with LN2 cooling.
     
  20. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    Why do you keep saying oops?

    DXG-1 is not a consumer card. It's a server made for high performance computing. It's pretty obvious from the initial post that they were both referring to the fact that Vega 11 is potentially the first gaming/consumer focused GPU with HBM2 on it -- one that someone from Guru3D can actually buy and play games on it.

    480 vs 1060 is basically a wash. Depending on what country you're in, how long you're keeping the card and what CPU is in the machine, you can make arguments for both.
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2016

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