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AMD Pulls PCIe 4.0 Support on all non-X570 motherboards

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Aug 7, 2019.

  1. schmidtbag

    schmidtbag Ancient Guru

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    Same reason why they enabled core unlocking back in the Athlon/Phenom II days - there was a good chance unlocking more cores wasn't going to yield a good/usable experience, because those cores were locked away for a reason. But people opted for it anyway. I'm sure some of these motherboard manufacturers are just trying to get rid of old stock. As of right now, there are hardly any PCIe 4.0 devices to test with and by the time there will be, the warranty might end (and for customers who bought the board prior to Zen 2, the warranty is likely already over).
    People like having/doing things when they're told they can't, and they retaliate twice as hard when they actually got to do/get what they wanted, only to have it taken away. This is why underage drinking exists lol.

    But you said it yourself - there's virtually no gain. Nothing is stopping you from going to X470 for a lower price with a minimal loss. There's backward compatibility, so you're not forced to do anything.
     
  2. Jonup

    Jonup Active Member

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    You know the PCI-e 4.0 support on older boards was only on the 16x slot? No GPU out there needs the extra bandwidth. This change really has no, zero, zip effect on the end user experience. If anything, it limits any incompatibilities/stability issue resulting from poor motherboard manufacturer implementation of PCIe lanes. So unless you can explain to me how taking off the PCI-e 4.0 support from your X470 mobo affected you, we can all call your bitching bullshit! ;)
     
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  3. JamesSneed

    JamesSneed Master Guru

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    People are entitled to their opinions but the facts don't support anything to do with motherboard sales at all. AMD isn't making more money from motherboard sales old vs new. Also, we all have read PCIE 4.0 due to its increased frequency requires shorter motherboard traces. We have also all seen that the x570 chipset requires a fan. If you put all this together its becomes obvious that not only are the motherboard traces likely to cause PCIE errors, the chipset itself if likely to run to too hot on x370 and x470 boards which could lead to more errors. Most people complaining probably would complain a lot more if there M.2. SSD drive was corrupted.
     
  4. JamesSneed

    JamesSneed Master Guru

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    I'm more on your side here but I run my M.2. drive off a PCIE card for better cooling. I could see folks doing that off the first slot. However I very much back AMD here as this is just a recipe for disaster. I think AMD would much rather have a few entitled people in tech forums being irritated than seeing lots of PCIE issues.
     

  5. jwb1

    jwb1 Master Guru

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    You could say, they pulled an Intel move. Yet, I see the obvious pandering to AMD about why they had to do...… interesting. They DIDN'T. They took a feature away that can work, but want to sell more expensive X570 boards.
     
    D1stRU3T0R likes this.
  6. ruthan

    ruthan Master Guru

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    It was nice feature for reviews :)

    Lets hope that VIA make faster CPU that both of them.. or wait 10 years make finnaly x86 virtualization fast enough on ARMs..
     
  7. Lordhawkwind

    Lordhawkwind New Member

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    PCIE 4 seems a lot like Ray tracing on Nvidia RTX cards. Nice to have but not worth the extra cost ATM. The only GPU that uses it is the 5700 and they're not exactly flying off the shelves are they? Same goes for PCIE 4 NV-ME drives so it's really a much ado about nothing TBH.
     
    schmidtbag likes this.
  8. NewTRUMP Order

    NewTRUMP Order Master Guru

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    So here is what AMD claimed from the beginning. You will note that there is no mention of any board except the x570. The board companies decided to make bios changes to try and cram it into their lesser boards. AMD has met their business model, and corrected the board makers mess of things. There is no AMD conspiracy to force consumers to buy higher priced boards. They are actually doing the consumer a favor by not supporting half assed boards that may or may not work with their cpu's. Nothing worse than buying a board and finding out it doesn't really support your cpu. http://prntscr.com/opqggp
     
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  9. LesserHellspawn

    LesserHellspawn Master Guru

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    Fully agree with that. If a mainboard manufacturer is confident enough that their X470 board will do fine with PCIe 4.0, let them. You as AMD might even sell a new CPU to that user to go along. The mental hurdle towards upgrading is way lower when you only need to upgrade the CPU and not the board as well.
     
  10. D1stRU3T0R

    D1stRU3T0R Active Member

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    Very true, shame on AMD making this Intel move. Hopefully we can bring it back with some bios modding.
     

  11. Ryu5uzaku

    Ryu5uzaku Ancient Guru

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    Now considering that the pci-e 4.0 chipset requires 15W and that leads to need of cooling. I can't see how the 5W chips with no cooling on x470 or whatever could be able to provide safe and stable 4.0 environment. It's just calling for disaster.
     
  12. Hilbert Hagedoorn

    Hilbert Hagedoorn Don Vito Corleone Staff Member

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    So from the very beginning, AMD communicates no - not happening.
    Mobo manufacturer Gigabyte says, sod off AMD we're doing it anyway.
    Then other mobo manufacturers say hey .. if Gigabyte does it so do we.
    AMD then says no, and restricts the firmware.

    This is AMD's fault how exactly?
     
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  13. Embra

    Embra Master Guru

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    It is amazing how convoluted things become on the internet.
     
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  14. Denial

    Denial Ancient Guru

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    Yeah I don't get it - if two years from now people were getting PCI-E 4.0 drives and they were losing data, or PCI-E 4 video cards where the image was getting corrupt, they'd all be sitting there going "why is this happening, AMD sucks" .. AMD wants to avoid this. This isn't rocket science, it's how you avoid your brand going to crap. AMD was super clear about this from the start.
     
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  15. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

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    I honestly never had the feeling that putting PCIe 4.0 compatability onto X470 boards was a big gain for real world use, or a good idea in general.

    Yes that's not how you sell X570 mainboards, but than again, why push something "nobody" profits from onto older mainboards to risk malfunctioning / overburdened hardware? That would be just silly.
     
    Embra likes this.

  16. maur0

    maur0 Master Guru

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    hack bios will support pcie in these old chipset
     
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  17. D3M1G0D

    D3M1G0D Ancient Guru

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    What?! PCIe 4.0 is not a necessity, nor is it required to make Matisse work. This isn't like Intel forcing people to buy a new board for Coffee Lake - Ryzen 3000 chip will work with existing X470 boards, it just won't have PCIe 4.0 (and seeing as how most people can't even saturate 3.0, so this isn't a major loss).

    Honestly, the mental gymnastics that people are doing here is ridiculous, saying that AMD has "pulled an Intel". Intel forced people to ditch their perfectly functional boards to upgrade to Coffee Lake while AMD is limiting PCIe 3.0 to older boards - they are nothing like each other.
     
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  18. BReal85

    BReal85 Master Guru

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    Not most, all of them. And as some asked and told you already:

    1. AMD only said that the X570 will support PCI-E 4.0
    2. What difference does PCI-E 4.0 make for you? Zero difference in GPU, zero difference in SSD performance.
     
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  19. Astyanax

    Astyanax Ancient Guru

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    no it won't, the agesa is a black box, signed and cannot be tampered with.
     
  20. NewTRUMP Order

    NewTRUMP Order Master Guru

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    Wait until they find out that the first generation Ryzen won't work with the X570 boards! And watch the fireworks when the next generation AMD cpu's wont be backwards compatible at all and it will be treated as an "Intel move".
     

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