AMD: brief statement on Spectre/Windows Update issue

Discussion in 'Frontpage news' started by Hilbert Hagedoorn, Jan 9, 2018.

  1. waltc3

    waltc3 Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,344
    Likes Received:
    463
    GPU:
    AMD 50th Ann 5700XT
    It's only logical, really--fundamentally, the Intel cpu designs are much older than the Ryzen designs--or even FX, really. Something sort of really stinks about all of this, though--it's like Y2K panic all over again--much ado about very little, imo. Statements I've read from AMD flatly state there are no exploits for any of this seen as of yet, and that AMD hardware is exempt from variants 2 and 3--which are the hardware vulnerabilities in the Intel cpu circuit designs. Variant 1 is the software-only component--which seems to be giving Microsoft a hard time--but that's not unusual at all. Microsoft has managed to brick things with just normal OS updates--but to be "fair," it's mainly been their own hardware they've bricked like that....:D

    http://www.amd.com/en/corporate/speculative-execution
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2018
  2. nz3777

    nz3777 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,476
    Likes Received:
    214
    GPU:
    Gtx 980 Strix
    Fx is not bad but It is getting long in the tooth, as they say, I need to upgrade like really soon I have that Mod-bug starting-up again. Very satisfying putting together your own machine then the first time you fire it up, It's alive! Just for the fun of it.
     
    kruno likes this.
  3. WareTernal

    WareTernal Master Guru

    Messages:
    250
    Likes Received:
    39
    GPU:
    PNY RTX 3070
    Thanks Captain Obvious! :D
     
  4. Dazz

    Dazz Master Guru

    Messages:
    951
    Likes Received:
    110
    GPU:
    ASUS STRIX RTX 2080
    Well done Micro$haft rushing a patch out before testing and rather than excluding specific identifications like "AuthenticAMD" CPUID you just install it on anything and everything, whats next Windows update going to install AMD drivers onto my nVidia graphics card? It's not the first time Micro$oft have had to pull patches due to being rushed and braking stuff... and it won't be the last either.
     

  5. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    22,008
    Likes Received:
    1,197
    GPU:
    MSI RX5700
    Existing is not the same as being known. Prior to June 2017, apparently nobody was aware of the existance of these vulnerabilities, unlike the Intel ME vulnerability that has been known for several years now or the AMD PSP/fTPM vulnerability that was "discovered" just a few months ago. (I put quotes there because that particular vulnerability was based on fTPM emulation and not actual hardware access, even though it's been known that fTPM is less secure than a hardware TPM.)
     
  6. tensai28

    tensai28 Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,417
    Likes Received:
    366
    GPU:
    2080ti MSI X TRIO
    I'm fully aware of this. That is why the patch is being to released. Regardless people made a big deal about it and the media led people to believe they would lose 30% performance from the patches. In reality only servers and people running VMs are effected and there is no reason for regular users (that includes us more advanced users here on guru3d even) to care about this at all. Even those servers may see up to 30% performance loss. Lot's of news articles stated it like this. (Key words are in bold) That doesn't mean they will even be dropping that much at all, just maybe in certain situations. They only word it that way so that people will show interest and click their links and read their stories. Let's all relax about this and just install the patches and move on. Our PC's will perform exactly as they did before and after the patch.

    The media loves to do this kind of stuff all the time unfortunately. This is how they grab peoples attention and get people to read. They aren't necessarily lying, just painting a picture in your head that isn't necessarily there. They would take the worst case scenario of something and use words like would, could, possibly, up to, may or if to lead you to believe it's a lot worse than it really is. In reality it's really not nearly as bad. If they had just told it like it is and said that only businesses and servers would be effected and only during certain operations, I'm pretty sure most people wouldn't care nor read into it as much. Everyone should do their own research before jumping to conclusions.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2018
  7. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    22,008
    Likes Received:
    1,197
    GPU:
    MSI RX5700
    It's not just servers and people running VMs affected. The performance impact, per MS, is dependent on processor architecture and Windows version. Skylake and newer are expected to see a negligible performance loss. Haswell and older will see a greater but varying degree of performance loss dependent on architecture and Windows version. Servers will be the most affected due to heavy I/O based workloads.

    When someone says something like "up to 30%", the statement implies that the affect will vary between 0% and 30%. Most people just have an issue comprehending what "up to" actually means. Yes, the media does have a bad habit of stretching the truth or exaggerating depending on the subject, but at the same time, readers have a tendency to read what they want and not necessarily what's really there. I've been telling people since the news broke that the performance loss for most wouldn't be anywhere near as bad as they were worried about. Sadly, people kept seeing that "up to 30%" and ignored the rest of the facts.
     
  8. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    12,522
    Likes Received:
    4,867
    GPU:
    2080Ti @h2o
  9. KissSh0t

    KissSh0t Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    10,084
    Likes Received:
    3,926
    GPU:
    ASUS RX 470 Strix
    The important part I guess...

    “AMD is aware of an issue with some older generation processors following installation of a Microsoft security update that was published over the weekend,” says an AMD spokesperson. “AMD and Microsoft have been working on an update to resolve the issue and expect it to begin rolling out again for those impacted shortly.”"
     
  10. fantaskarsef

    fantaskarsef Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    12,522
    Likes Received:
    4,867
    GPU:
    2080Ti @h2o
    Exactly, everybody's working on fixes on all ends anyway. Like stated a couple of times, I too think in the next 2 weeks everything will be patched, from BIOS / microcode to OS updates to drivers to whatever.
     

  11. AsiJu

    AsiJu Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    7,649
    Likes Received:
    2,518
    GPU:
    MSI 6800XT GamingX
    edit: nvm already posted.
     
  12. Aura89

    Aura89 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    8,189
    Likes Received:
    1,286
    GPU:
    -
    Not every device doesn't change their whole system since 1995.
     
  13. tensai28

    tensai28 Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,417
    Likes Received:
    366
    GPU:
    2080ti MSI X TRIO
    All the more reason why I don't care about this:p. I'm on Skylake. But in all seriousness, I don't think the impact will be that great for anyone.

    That's the whole entire problem. The media knows people will fall for the whole "up to" wording. The problem is after some people misinterpret it, they go on to spread the misinterpreted information to mislead people who wouldn't normally have been making that mistake. For example if someone hears "up to 30% loss in performance" and then goes on to spread the information as "there will be a 30% loss in performance". Then things get messy and you have a bunch of nerds raging over nothing. Hopefully this will become old news pretty quickly.

    I was going to say the same. I'm pretty sure we'll look back on all this and laugh.
     
  14. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    22,008
    Likes Received:
    1,197
    GPU:
    MSI RX5700
    The media makes the mistake of assuming that people are more intelligent than they really are. Reading comprehension has become a major issue. Of course, some articles I read neglected to mention the performance variance would be workload dependent, or the types of workloads that would see the biggest impact. I think I read around a half dozen articles before I made my first post on this forum regarding the "bugs"..... They seemed to vary greatly in how accurately they presented the information with the "professional" media being the worst for accuracy but that's to be expected any time technology is involved. The "professional" media likes to sensationalize whatever they can.
     
  15. tensai28

    tensai28 Maha Guru

    Messages:
    1,417
    Likes Received:
    366
    GPU:
    2080ti MSI X TRIO
    I just updated my bios today. No performance loss whatsoever.
    Edit: spoke too soon. I had a massive drop in Cinebench after updating. Reverting to the previous bios fixes that. I don't think this all came from the microcode. Hopefully Asus can fix this.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2018

  16. Turanis

    Turanis Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    1,779
    Likes Received:
    475
    GPU:
    Gigabyte RX500
    Yoy play games or work with Cinebench??? Test what you play or work daily! :)
    What to fix? AMD Ryzen is not affected by Meltdown,as Intel cpus.Spectre,not so much.


    https://www.amd.com/en/corporate/speculative-execution

    https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.ro/2018/01/reading-privileged-memory-with-side.html
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2018

Share This Page