Advise for Budget dekstop

Discussion in 'General Hardware' started by jhelsas, Nov 22, 2012.

  1. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970
    What would be best right now for a budget desktop, an i3-3220 (or similar), or an amd apu like A8-3870K(it can be a cheaper model if it doesn't make too much diference) ?

    I haven't read about mobos/cpus since I bought mine so I'm a bit outdated, and thus I'm searching for a bit of help. Besides, I didn't searched the budget area while looking for parts to my desktop.

    I know they are very diferent CPUs, but they are sellig for about the same price where I live. Also I wanted to use the integrated graphics, not to put an dedicated VGA for them. I don't know if the mobos for the two cases differs too much, which is another concern.

    The idea is to build a budget desktop for the lab where my parents work, so it would be used as an oversized type machine, browsing, bibliography compiling, office suite and very basic statistics.

    The idea is to keep it simple and cheap, but have enough headroom for them to feel comfortable to work, the idea is less to have a . Their current desktop is an old Pentiun 3 or 4 I belive.

    The core i3 IGP would be enough for the normal use above?
    I belive they don't use any heavily threaded program, so, in this case, the i3 would be the best choice?

    Thanks and advance guys.
     
  2. thatguy91

    thatguy91 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    6,492
    Likes Received:
    18
    GPU:
    XFX RX 480 RS 4 GB
    The AMD APU's have much better integrated graphical performance than the Intel i3, so I would suggest the AMD route. The A8-3870K is actually a superseded model, the new A4, A6, A8, and A10 APU's have the -5xxx suffix (the -3xxx suffix is superseded). Which one of these to get depends on how much you can spend, but the A10-5800K is the highest model, and has the best integrated graphics performance of any CPU currently.

    In terms of motherboard, you could get an Asrock FM2A75M-DGS (for example). You could go with an A85x chipset based board (FM2A85X Extreme4 for example), but they cost more (by about $20 or so). Since you aren't using a discrete card and aren't going to make use of 8 SATA 3 ports etc, the Asrock FM2A75M-DGS would be ideal.

    The other benefit with the Asrock board is you can safely overclock it on air using the X-boost capability
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2012
  3. ---TK---

    ---TK--- Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    22,135
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    2x 980Ti Gaming 1430/7296
    If you are going to use integrated graphics go with the amd APU. if you are going to buy a discrete vga go with the Intel i3. It is a much better gaming CPU.
     
  4. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970
    The idea was to spend the least possible.
    It wouldn't be used for anything but desktop work, no games, no multimedia, just desktop work (typing, browsing, spreadsheets, presentations & simple statistics), also no overclock.
    Also, no room or need for a dedicated GPU, the most graphic intensive aplication they should be doing is something like a flash video or equivalent, nothing like photoshop.

    The 5xxx APUs haven't arrive yet were I live, so an option is to wait and see the price for them.

    In this case, you still sugest using an AMD APU?
    The idea is much more about beeing future-proof rather and great today's performance, probably the pc that is running there right now is ~ 10 years old, I wouldn't be surprised this would last a similar amount of time.

    The prices from where I livre (Brasil) to the US aren't that much equivalent, but I wished to keep the computer about US$ 500-600, considering that I have already the case(the power supply I would have to buy), monitor and peripherals.

    The idea was something like (prices include tax):

    PSU -- Corsair CX430 v2, or similar -> ~ US$ 70 ( I DON'T want to put some fake "nominal" cpus and simply let it blow the pc, so the least I would keep is a budget thrustworthy cpu from a known company)

    HDD -- Something like an 500GB from WD, samsung or the cheapest decent that I can find --> ~ US$ 80

    cooler -- a cheap cooler if it was intel, I simply can't stand the coolers that intel ship stock with their cpus, maybe for the amd too, but would have to think about --> ~ US$ 20

    optical drive -- some simple dvd writer, they need to burn dvds with lots of pictures and texts, so read only drive is not suficient --> ~ US$ 20

    RAM -- some value ram, or something better is there is room and is worth --> don' have any idea, but between US$ 40 - 90

    CPU & Mobo --> Don't know yet, but up to something like US$ 320 for the combo, if it get's the job done, the least the better.
     

  5. airbud7

    airbud7 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,477
    Likes Received:
    129
    GPU:
    MSI RX 480 ARMOR 4G OC
  6. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970

    Let me explain my situation:

    i3-2120=$135
    http://www.boadica.com.br/pesquisa/...20+&regiao=&em_box=&cl=&preco_min=&preco_max=

    ASRock H77M=$140
    http://www.boadica.com.br/pesquisa/...77M&regiao=&em_box=&cl=&preco_min=&preco_max=

    Total=$275

    HD 7770=$217 (one of the cheapest HD7770 I found:)
    http://www.boadica.com.br/pesquisa/...0G)&regiao=&em_box=&cl=&preco_min=&preco_max=

    Total = $566 = past my budget

    Prices above are in cash (credit cart is about ~ 10-15% higher), and for reference R$ 1 = US$ 0.48

    Yes, the prices are completely inflated but that's what I have to live with, I don't like it, but that's my situation for this build.

    No, there is no decent e-tailer like newegg that sells things for at least a price that is accepctable, if it's not fair. These are probably some of the best prices for non-used parts that I have access.

    I don't mean to be rude, but unfortunatly I have to accept where I live, and well, try to build the best that's possible there.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2012
  7. airbud7

    airbud7 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    4,477
    Likes Received:
    129
    GPU:
    MSI RX 480 ARMOR 4G OC

    Ouch!...$217 for a 7770, that's a high price...
     
  8. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970
    The 5xxx series of APU just arrived where I live, including the A10-5800, for an acceptable price here.

    The A8-5600K are for ~ US$ 140-160 (tax. included) and the A10-5800K is resseling between US$ 170-225 (tax. included).

    I know it's steeper than it should be, but it's still in my reach. I'll probably get some of this two or anything similar.

    By the way, any FM1 mobo is compatible or I would have to get a an FM2 mobo?

    the A75 chipset seems to have an FM1 socket. There isn't still almost no FM2 mobos here, so if I could live with an FM1 mobo would be very nice.

    I won't overclock because the people that are going to use it have 0 knowledge of how to handle themselves if anything goes wrong.

    Thanks guys for the help.
     
  9. StewieTech

    StewieTech Chuck Norris

    Messages:
    2,010
    Likes Received:
    37
    GPU:
    MSI gtx 960 Gaming
    There must an error on the hd7770 price, it can´t cost 217$. Here in Portugal it goes for 120€. Check other websits.:3eyes:
     
  10. naike

    naike Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,021
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    Asus EAH5870
    Would be nice to include your total budget..
    It's a pretty, relative term.

    Anyway, atm for budget I would build around these CPUs:
    1) A10 5800k (You could also consider A6 5400k for an even lower budget)
    2) Phenom II X4 955
    3) i3 3220

    The 955 has 4 actual cores and is not really that much slower in benchmarks and the price is just awesome.
    I'd probably still go with the A10 5800 and skip on the GPU depending on what resolution you are playing at. (the integrated GPU isn't that bad)
    You also want to get fast memory (4GB is okay for the games alone but I'd recommend 8GB if possible for overall performance) for integrated graphics (since it's shared), so be sure your motherboard supports that. Save on things like case, optical drive if you even need that, and use your old hdd e.g.
    Don't save on the component quality (especially not PSU).

    Also these AMDs overclock very nicely, don't know about intel.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2012

  11. sykozis

    sykozis Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    20,009
    Likes Received:
    29
    GPU:
    XFX RX 470
    The newer APUs require FM2 motherboard.

    Since you're not going to be using it for gaming, I'd recommend the A6-5400K. It should handle the usage you described reasonably well at a very reasonable price. If you'd rather a bit more "power", the A8-5600K.

    You can pair either with the ASRock FM2A75M-DGS. You could even use the MSI FM2-A55M-E33 if you don't mind a chipset that's a bit dated.


    @naike, he said it's not for gaming.
     
  12. naike

    naike Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    2,021
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    Asus EAH5870
    Oh sorry, didn't catch that, but I would still probably go for the AMD. Even if you don't overclock.
     
  13. Loophole35

    Loophole35 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    8,561
    Likes Received:
    88
    GPU:
    EVGA 1080ti SC
    Two things to think about is even though you aren't gaming with this setup you may want to invest in some "good" ram in the 1866 range as the AMD APU's like faster ram because that is the frame buffer. Also leave room in your budget for a SSD as that will make the biggest difference in your preceived quickness of you computer. You really only need say a 60GB for the OS and common apps all your documents downloads music and videos can be setup in a HHD as a secondary drive.
     
  14. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970
    US$ 217 is not wrong, it's one of the cheapest prices for the HD7770 that I've found here, and that's the price in cash, not in credit card(put more 10%-15% over that)

    The average price for the HD7770 is about US$ 250.

    This is the result of putting 100% profit margin over 70%-110% import taxes for eletronics. There is a lot of pressure to get this import taxes down, but it's no easy task. It was worse before, now there are some products with reasonable prices, not so long ago, everything was as overpriced as the HD7770.

    Why do you think that half of my computer came with me in my luggage on the plane? Do you think I would pay US$ 500 for a crosshair IV formula? Or US$ 800 for an HD7970(today's price, because it was release here for about US$ 1200)?

    Everyone if talking about Brasil, but sincerely, living here have lot's of advantages, but you have to live with this kind of jokes, besides many more serius issues. With this kind of price, the government complain that millions of brasilians go abroad to buy and so much of our inner market suffers because of it. What I say is that I won't suffer to feed someone else's greed.

    Just as an example of how ridiculous things can get here, the release price of the Playstation 3, which were ~ US$ 1k in the US, was US$ 3k here. Many people simply took the US$ 2k, passed a week in NY or Orlando, bought the PS3 and lots of other things and returned home....

    (AH, I forgot to mention, most console games ressell between US$ 80 and 150, not the console, the games, but thankfully this is changing)

    ---------

    (all the prices include all taxes, these are final prices)

    My max budget is US$ 700, preferably lower. The original budget was US$ 500, but since than my parent's said it's ok to go up to US$ 700, but the least the best. No gaming. The idea is to get a future-proof allrounder for desktop work, and it should withstand between 6 to 10 years without upgrade, and still be usable, not great but usable. The present pcs that are there right know have that age.

    I don't need too much power, but what I do need is that It should be fairly future-proof. Also, no need for overclock, the people that are going to use the computer either have too much fear to install a program (even an next-next-next-finish program), or won't have the permission to do anything that need an administrator account.

    There shouldn't be too much music (if any), and certanly there won't be any videos. Almost surely, text (pdf, MS word), spreadsheets, some ppt presentations, and some photos, mainly for papers.

    I'm not finding the X4 955 to sell here anymore, my options for a phenom X4 are the 960T and the 965, both are about US$ 150 right now.

    I can get a decent AM3 mobo for about US$ 100, e.g. the MSI 880GMA-E35. I would have to live with the IGP of the mobo, which should probably suffice.

    The core i3 2120 and 3220 are resseling for ~ US$ 160, but the H77 mobos are a bit steep. As an example, GA-H61M-S1 if for about US$ 70, but the GA-H77-DS3H (rev. 1.0) is about US$ 140.

    The A6 5400K is about US$ 80, if it does the job, it's great for the price. The FM2 mobos are still arriving, so there aren't many, the only one I could confirm is the GA-F2A85X-UP4, resseling for US$ 250

    The cheapest 1866 ram kit I've found is the F3-14900CL9D-4GBXM for about US$ 90. Most of them are over US$ 125, for a resonable price only Cas 9 ram unfortunatly. I belive 1866 is a no go right now, but 1600 would be feasable.

    As for an SSD, I belive there is no need. No one is keeping nothing important and there is no realy tough to load program besides the OS. If you belive it's worth it, the easyest to find 60GB SSD is the Kingston SV200S37A/64G for about US$ 110 followed by Intel SSDSC2CT060A3K5 and Corsair CSSD-F60GB3-BK for about US$ 160.

    Thanks everybody for the help. I know this is an uncommon request due to the restrictions that I have to face but I'm very thankfull that you are trying to help as much as you can.

    p.s.:
    I'm not idiot enough to save on PSU quality, not any component. I'm building a budget desktop for my parent's work, not a cheapo time-bomb, which is what you buy in most supermarkets or other eletronic stores here.

    The absolute minimum PSU i'm got to put is something like a corsair CX430v2 or CX500v2. If I have the chance, I'll put a seasonic.

    Still, thanks for reminding me :D

    edits: i'm mostly fixing typos
     
    Last edited: Dec 9, 2012
  15. Loophole35

    Loophole35 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    8,561
    Likes Received:
    88
    GPU:
    EVGA 1080ti SC
    Setting up a secondary hdd for high volume stuff is easy all you do is load the os with only the ssd installed to guaranty that you load it on the right drive (don't laugh you know everyone is always afraid of doing that) once it's loaded and up to date install a "storage" hdd format it in device manager then "move" your user folders to the storage drive (typically it will be drive F:) then all downloads music video pictures and documents will be on the HDD instead of taking up space on the SSD the computer will automatically locate the folders when saving and no extra steps need to be taken. The reason I say to move the user folders to the HDD is let's face it that is where all of your space is consumed anyways.

    In the end though the SSD is not a nessesity it's just a nice touch that does cut down on boot time and apps/programs do open much faster. If its not in the budget no worries there is nothing at all wrong with a 7200 rpm hdd.

    Edit: on the CPU side of things you may be able to save some coin going with a Llano based APU and a FM1 board the GPU thing aside there is not a major difference in the CPU performance. You should still be able to get ahold of a A6 3500 or A6 3650. For office tasks and even 1080p video the 3500 igp is more than enough. You could even run a 2560x1600 monitor on that setup for normal PC related tasks.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2012

  16. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970
    Thanks for the advice.

    An secondary HD wasn't necessary because they said that they would do the storage in an external WD 1TB.

    In the end, I settled in a US$ 700, A10-5800K cpu with an a85 gigabyte mobo, geil memory (I belive it was 4 GB), an caviar blue 500GB hdd and stock cooling. For the psu, the seller forced an 550W cougar psu, I haven't heard about it, just hope it's ok, I wasn't going to create a commotion since my father wanted the issued solved asap.

    I sticked with the 5800K basicaly for "future-proffness", this pc will probably have to work for the next ~ 10 years, so, the best thing I've found on the budget was that, I hope it withstand the test of time.

    The monitor is going to proably be 1600x900, an TN monitor from LG (E2060T) that's available back hope.
     
  17. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970
    I forgot to install the AHCI pre-install drivers on Win8.

    Do I realy need them? If I don't, I'll left them be, because I only realised after install almost everything on the machine while downloading the drivers.
     
  18. Agent-A01

    Agent-A01 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    9,833
    Likes Received:
    72
    GPU:
    1080Ti H20
    nope. you can install them through device manager
     
  19. Loophole35

    Loophole35 Ancient Guru

    Messages:
    8,561
    Likes Received:
    88
    GPU:
    EVGA 1080ti SC
    That setup should work good and should last for a long time. My mom still uses her desktop that she got about 11 years ago its a p4 with 512MB ram (thing was a beast when she got it).
     
  20. jhelsas

    jhelsas Master Guru

    Messages:
    387
    Likes Received:
    0
    GPU:
    PC HD 7970
    How do I do that?
     

Share This Page